This is where I thought Trump devotees would go from the beginning.

That is a myth promulgated by Trump fans. Trump is a minority President. He was elected by 27% of the electorate. He even lost the popular vote to a horrible nominee. He lost the popular vote to Clinton by three million.

Trump's disapproval rating has been over 50% since he has been in office, most of the time between 54 to 60%. In other words his disapproval is the will of the people.

Put a different way, Republican Senators will agree that it is okay for the President to invite foreign interference in our Presidential election and using bribe on a foreign leader as incentive.

If that is the case, and it likely is, the American people will render their judgment on November 3. The GOP has already lost key elections in 2018 and 2019 because of Trump, including control of the House. A record number of Republicans quit in 2018. Already, 30 Republican lawmakers have quit before the 2020 election.

 

Still on the dem clown show narrative with zero proof? To be expected.

 

Another who deals in theoretical political arguments. We seem to get a lot of that. Some are uncomfortable dealing with facts.

I deal in facts and events. I deal with what Trump does and says and the consequences. Some do not want to talk about those things.

 

Apparently you don't expect them to ever tell the truth either.

The way Trump talks is the way someone talks who knows they can get away with anything. He's not careful with his speech because he knows he's in a position of power and is on a power trip. As such, all diplomacy and respect are tossed out the window because he views others as less than himself. Other Presidents at least had a modicum of decency when addressing people in public. He's also a pathological narcissist with arrested development. Other Presidents did not seek the Presidency solely to enrich themselves & their family at the expense of taxpayers, the environment, and national security. In Trump's mind, he is indeed above the law...and his behavior reflects that stance.

Still, despite his neanderthal ways, he knows when its necessary to hide & cover up his misdeeds...which is why it's so difficult to obtain witnesses, documents, and records...and why he resists the rule of law & Constitutional mandates.

 

No he didn't. He asked him to make an announcement about Biden.

 

Yet what I stated is at the very heart of humanity's ongoing struggle with itself. Trump doesn't matter.

 

No he didn’t and it was Zelinsky that brought up Biden.

 

How I phrased it is precisely as I intended in order to express my point. Please do not falsely put words into my mouth and then act like your false words are analogous to what I said. They are not. This is silly. It is difficult to fathom how you thought this was a good idea.

 

Shelby is going with the "it's okay cuz Trump did it" defense, not the "he did nothing wrong" defense.

GOP Senator Brushes Off Trump Soliciting Foreign Interference: ‘Things Happen’
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/shelby-trump-foreign-interference-things-happen

“And he’s going to make mistakes of judgment and everything else,” Shelby said. “They have historically, both parties, both from the beginning of our republic.” (mistakes of judgement...yes, but not trying to corrupt an election by way of extortion)

When Stephanopoulos asked if he views Trump’s foreign interference as a “mistake, but not necessarily impeachable,” Shelby sided with Alan Dershowitz who said he doesn’t believe “it rises to the standard of an impeachable offense.” (because....Dear Leader)

“Well, I’d say I don’t believe — like Professor Dershowitz at this point — that it rises to the standard of an impeachable offense,” Shelby said. “But I still think we should wait and see what comes out in the trial itself.” (equivocation in case there is witness testimony)

 

It's becoming clear that not only did Trump do what he is accused of doing, but that he has obstructed any oversight by Congress into those activities.

That obstruction alone is Impeachable

 

Not familiar with civics eh?

 

Not according to Crazy Al..................who is making the "the prez is above the law and accountable to nothing and no one" argument.

https://www.axios.com/dershowitz-im...wer-ceb31d4a-3be5-4733-95ee-a155f8cef0b7.html
https://thehill.com/homenews/sunday...ent-president-cannot-be-impeached-for-abusing

 

When you can’t get a single republican vote for impeachment and even lost a democrat, you know it’s a hoax. Pelosi knows this, still trying to figure out why she did this... i’m starting to seriously consider the possibility she wants Trump re-elected as it benefits her politically and she is more scared of the radical left than Trump.

 

Hannity previews Trump’s final defense: So what if he’s guilty?

"What difference does it make." I remember those words. But truthfully Trump doesn't need a defense since the politics are on his side.

 

I guess you think a leader is supposed to make everyone happy- especially you.

I expect a leader to safely take his followers to the destination they choose- as safely as possible in a dangerous world. That does take power and authority, it can not be done on the basis of requiring universal support from the army of idiots who think they know everything. Governing is not the control of individual freedoms or choices, but I don't assume that "the people" are capable of leadership as some kind of mass committee; that has never worked and never will. These must be separate.

I do believe that government should stick to the duties of governing, and the freedom of people to make their own choices- and suffer the consequences or benefits that result from them- should not be infringed on by government. This is sound and works. The problem is people expecting government to make them happy- provide for them like children and give them their way at the same time, free of consequence or duty.
In other words- they don't want to have to step up to the plate and be responsible, they just want the benefits of it. That's what many think good government, good leadership provides, and they support the candidates who promise it. Therein- lies most of the problems of the nation.

 

Cipollone is making the "so what" argument on the floor of the Senate right now.

 

Zoe Lofgren just made the same point I have been making for weeks. Trump has not yet actually made the claim of executive privilege in his illegal obstruction of the impeachment investigation. He is making the made up, bogus, non-existent claim of absolute immunity for all witnesses and documents under his control.

Zoe is knocking it out of the park.

 

‘Constitutional Nonsense’: Trump’s Impeachment Defense Defies Legal Consensus

WASHINGTON — As President Trump’s impeachment trial opens, his lawyers have increasingly emphasized a striking argument: Even if he did abuse his powers in an attempt to bully Ukraine into interfering in the 2020 election on his behalf, it would not matter because the House never accused him of committing an ordinary crime.

Their argument is widely disputed. It cuts against the consensus among scholars that impeachment exists to remove officials who abuse power. The phrase “high crimes and misdemeanors” means a serious violation of public trust that need not also be an ordinary crime, said Frank O. Bowman III, a University of Missouri law professor and the author of a recent book on the topic.

“This argument is constitutional nonsense,” Mr. Bowman said. “The almost universal consensus — in Great Britain, in the colonies, in the American states between 1776 and 1787, at the Constitutional Convention and since — has been that criminal conduct is not required for impeachment.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/20/us/politics/trump-impeachment-legal-defense.html?action=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage

 

It's not about the leader making people happy, but about them fulfilling the duties that they're entrusted to by those who put him in that position of power. Nothing more or less.

If a leader is entrusted by the people to execute a specific function effectively for a specific benefit, and does so...then good for the people.
If that leader does not effectively execute his entrusted function, then it's not only the people's fault, it's their responsibility to remove or replace that leader...or else they risk even greater problems.

The world is a dangerous place because people have succumbed to a fear-based paradigm in which they believe they cannot live without authority or leadership...the very same authority/leadership that has the people convinced they are lesser than they are, and incapable of thinking for themselves. This then allows authority/leadership to possess the minds & will of the people like a parasite.

Hence, the individual remains in a general apathetic state in which he lacks independent thought & will, becoming locked into a paradigm dictated by a hive-mind. The resulting leadership settling in place has always been a plutocracy...rulership by the Few over the Many. The Few easily rule over the Many without the need to target the mind of each individual, but by merely manipulating the hive-mind. The Few lead the Many like a shepard leads the herd. Each member of the herd follows the rest without an independent thought of his own. The hive-mind, locked into its paradigm, further becomes self-policing...attacking any individual who proposes or expresses an alternative paradigm...making the job of the Few that much easier.

It is the support of the Many that the Few draw all their power from. (If you don't believe this, then tell me...what can the Few do on their own without the support of the Many?) The trick then, to remain in power, is for the Few to keep the Many in a persistant delusional state in which they believe so strongly that they cannot coexist peacefully without the dictates of authority. The prime tactic used is fear in its many forms...which can be exploited to foment suspicion, conflict, and division. It is then a simple matter for the Few to fuel this well-established fear & division (via ignorance/education bias, media propaganda & petty distraction, suppression of truth, bribery, covert ops, engineered scarcity, environmental destruction, etc.). In light of all the ensuing interfighting & division among the Many, the Many come to view themselves as dangerous, unpredictable, immature, unwise and stupid...and with this fear-based paradigm, they willingly accept authoritative laws & hard-line leadership to avoid social implosion.

It's not up to any would-be leader/governing body to make that determination. It's up to the people, and always has been. If the people wish (for whatever reason) to forfeit their individual freedom & sovereignty and accept rulership by a governing body, then naturally they will be subject to the will of that governing body. In doing so, the people must accept the great risks that come when they hand their power over to the Few. History has shown that the Few will not willingly give up that great power, and will fight to keep it...while the Many become complacent to the point when conditions become intolerable, leading to violent confrontation between the Many & the Few. To forestall such an event the Few must keep the Many divided, distracted, fear-based...and always fighting. A unified people that can think & act on their own behalf without fear is the greatest threat to authority/leadership.

Either the Many commit to a cooperative effort in determining their own path, or they risk losing that determination to the Few. The power of the Few lies only in how effectively they can manipulate the Many towards its will. Either way, the power to choose always lies with the Many.

 

So let's see his tax returns for proof. Why does he refuse to submit his financial documents? No other President has done this.

His kids don't work for free. Like Trump, they've been exploiting the office to enrich themselves to the tune of 100's of millions, plus making foreign business deals. They're making many-fold more than they would if they were paid only their wages. To Trump & his family, salaries are just chump change. I posted the links to the emoluments violations awhile back, and will re-post once I find it.

UPDATE: I found my older post with the list I mentioned re. emoluments.

Here's just a PARTIAL listing re-affirming the Trumps as a crime family:

Trump using the President's office to enrich himself and his family (eg, foreign & domestic emoluments clause violations). Trump has accumulated over 2300 conflicts of interest. They include: 63 political events held at Trump properties, 362 visits by President Trump to his properties, 630 visits to Trump properties from at least 250 Trump administration officials, 100 events held by special interest groups at Trump properties, 59 foreign trademarks granted to Trump businesses, 111 foreign officials who visited a Trump business, 90 members of Congress visited a Trump business, officials from 57 countries visited a Trump business, 101 members of Congress who have spent campaign funds at Trump properties...and so on. Plus, taxpayers have now paid for Trump to visit Mar-a-Lago 100 times.
https://www.citizensforethics.org

"The Trump Organization's golf courses drew in $221 million in revenue in 2017."
https://www.newsweek.com/trump-fami...uch-richer-president-moved-white-house-975993

AG James Secures Court Order Against Donald J. Trump, Trump Children, And Trump Foundation:
Trump to Pay $2 Million in Damages for Illegal Activity During 2016 Election
https://ag.ny.gov/press-release/201...ainst-donald-j-trump-trump-children-and-trump

Donald Trump Agrees to Pay $25 Million in Trump University Settlement
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/19/us/politics/trump-university.html

Trump-Scam Accusers Say His Kids Had Key Role in Duping Clients
"Donald Trump’s three eldest children were deeply involved in their father’s alleged scheme to rip off tens of thousands of Americans with bogus marketing opportunities in the years before he was elected president, according to a revised lawsuit by four would-be entrepreneurs."
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...s-say-his-kids-had-key-role-in-duping-clients

China grants 18 trademarks in 2 months to Trump, daughter
https://apnews.com/0a3283036d2f4e699da4aa3c6dd01727

Ivanka Trump, Kushner took in as much as $135M last year
https://apnews.com/7b5cf4eec7d547508b7de4f34d3b7f35

Jared Kushner’s Company Curiously Raked in $90 Million Since He Joined the White House: His real estate company, Cadre, has quintupled in value since 2017
https://www.gq.com/story/kushner-company-flooded-with-money

"Brookfield, a global property investor in which the Qatari government has placed investments, struck a deal last year that rescued the Kushner Companies' 666 Fifth Avenue tower in Manhattan from financial straits. Kushner was chief executive of Kushner Companies when it acquired 666 Fifth Avenue in 2007 for $1.8 billion, a record at the time for a Manhattan office building. It has been a drag on his family's real estate company ever since. The debt-laden skyscraper was bailed out by Brookfield last August, when it took a 99-year lease on the property, paying the rent for 99 years upfront. Financial terms were not disclosed."
https://www.haaretz.com/us-news/qat...tegy-after-kushner-building-bailout-1.6932771

Saudi Crown Prince Boasted That Jared Kushner Was “In His Pocket”
https://theintercept.com/2018/03/21/jared-kushner-saudi-crown-prince-mohammed-bin-salman/

And the list goes on...
And this is only during Trump's Presidency & campaign. What else did he do before becoming President? This is a guy you think should not be removed from office? I don't know what's worse...Trump or his followers. I can understand why Trump does what he does. He's corrupt to the bone. But what's wrong with all his 'loyal' defenders/followers?

 

You're making an elaborate case that serves no purpose. What is known as the "human condition" controls what we have to work with at any time. It's not what people might be capable of, but where they are right now that establishes what is possible and not possible. The potential is far beyond the reality- but the best of efforts by the best of men to promote that potential has been and will be ignored, even fought against by the majority of people. I think you need to bring your argument closer to the range of possibilities, or it's irrelevant.

 

Trump's lawyers lied to the Senate.

Falsehood No. 1: Trump’s lawyers claimed Republicans didn’t have access to key information during House impeachment inquiry
As part of an effort to portray the process that resulted in Trump’s impeachment and trial as a partisan witch hunt, Cipollone at one point complained that “not even [House Intelligence Committee chair and impeachment manager Adam] Schiff’s Republican colleagues were allowed into the SCIF,” or Sensitive Compartmented Information Facility, which is basically the secure facility that members of Congress used to review classified information pertinent to the impeachment inquiry.

This assertion is not true. As a number of reporters pointed out, not only did Republicans involved in the impeachment have access to the SCIF, but many of them also used it.

And there is more
Cipollone wasn’t alone in getting basic stuff wrong. Sekulow’s opening statement, which served as an extended complaint about process, also managed to mangle the facts (he claimed House Democrats delayed transmitting the articles of impeachment to the Senate for a longer period of time than was actually the case) and mischaracterize the impeachment process (he said Trump “was denied the right to cross-examine witnesses” during the House inquiry when, in fact, the White House declined to do so).

https://www.vox.com/2020/1/21/21075...s-jay-sekulow-pat-cipollone-opening-statement

 

Sekulow was spot on.

 

Senate Republicans do not want to hear direct evidence regarding Ukraine and the military aid they approved.

Senate Republicans defeated a series of amendments from Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer to subpoena the Trump administration for Ukraine documents on the opening day of the bitterly fought impeachment trial of President Donald Trump.

Schumer offered several measures seeking a trove of documents from the White House, the State Department and the Office of Management and Budget that the Trump administration refused to turn over during the House's impeachment inquiry, but the amendments were thwarted one by one on 53-47, party-line votes.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/21/politics/senate-impeachment-trial-day-1/index.html

Apparently, Republican Senators are unconcerned about the horrible precedent. Congress controls the purse strings of government. The Government Accountability Office recently said the White House’s Office of Management and Budget violated the law when it withheld nearly $400 million this past summer for “a policy reason,” even though the funds had been allocated by Congress. Republican Senators looked the other way.

Republican Senators just relinquished control of military aid to the executive branch.