LIBERBAL propaganda; the DOJ is NOT independent of the president.

Of course he does. Who else would he serve? Do tell...

 

Right they make a pledge to the constitution, and the constitution states they serve at the "pleasure of the president".

 

That is literally word for word in the constitution, that principal officers serve at the pleasure of the president, you should read it.

 

Lol...Maybe in China or in the mafia, but in the USA, government officials are servants of the people and the Constitution.
Their oaths of office are not to the potus but to the Constitution.
They can be hired and fired by the potus, but they are not his servants.
Educate yourself.

 

umm all I did was quote the constitution, how about you educate yourself and read it. It says principal officers serve at the pleasure of the president. That means they can be fired for any reason, disobedience being one of them.

 

You don't get it. Quoting a phrase from the Constitution means nothing out of context.
Government officials are public servants pledged to uphold the Constitution, not placate the whims of a rogue potus. They serve at the potus' pleasure, and can be fired in a puerile tantrum, but their duty is to uphold the rule of law enshrined in the Constitution and to serve the people, not play lapdog to a character like trump.

 

Watergate illustrated the necessity of the DOJ being independent of the White House because of the possibility of abuse of power.

And it has acted in that way since then because of that...until now

 

There are many people out there, who would be ecstatic if Trump could have sole power over every aspect of our government. They wouldn't care if he had the power, to change and rewrite our Constitution, suspend any rights he disagrees with(anti-trust laws), start foreign wars, stop all immigrations, sell rocket launchers at Walmart, control wall street and corporations, screw the budget, make any laws he wants, and hire and fire anyone he wants. As long as he can symbolize their xenophobia, homophobia, religious intolerance, racial elitism, civil rights violations, the we-better-than-them patriotism, and still pander to the blue-collar working class mentality, he will always be their man. They want to be part of a Trumpian Utopia, that caters only to a hive mentality. No matter what idiotic, unhinged, egotistic, self-serving, and immoral actions he does, or blatant lies he tells, it will always be fake news and sour grapes to his followers. Even God himself, could not open their eyes, to see what the rest of the world sees. Ironically, these are the same people screaming that their second amendment rights are under attack, because of a few extra background checks.

Fortunately, our founding fathers were very aware that people are HUMAN. They knew that human self-interests, greed, political, and religious interests, would eventually try to control all areas of our government. This would certainly lead to Tyranny. So they created three INDEPENDENT and SEPARATE branches of government. As well as three INDEPENDENT SEPARATIONS OF POWERS. They also had the foresight, and commonsense, to include CHECKS AND BALANCES, within and between each of the three branches. They were keenly aware, that a populace dictator or authoritarian, would assume power some day. Protecting the people from themselves, was their purpose.

Although, it is true that once the president's nominee for the office of AG(Solicitor General) is confirmed by the Senate, that the President can fire him/her for any reason. But this is very rare. Out of 85 appointed AG's, since 1951(and before Trump), this has only happened twice(under Truman and Bush). Trump has fired two so far, for standing up against his travel bans, and against his dismissal of 7 already confirmed US Attorneys, to gain a political advantage. Just because the AG and the US Attorneys serve at the pleasure of the President, does not mean that their job, is to serve the President. There is NO OATH OF OFFICE that states any cabinet official, or high ranking political appointee, must serve the President. This is just wishful thinking. If this is your cup of tea, try China, N. Korea, Viet Nam, or Cuba.

I seriously doubt, that anyone here is okay with all independent branches of Government, being controlled and run by the Executive Branch? If all power was invested in the Executive Branch, it would be the end of Democracy, by definition.
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It is not the Constitution that is a problem, it is comprehension and interpretation of the words "Serve at the pleasure of the President..." This means SERVE IN YOUR APPOINTED OFFICE, so long as I am pleased with your performance. If I am not pleased, or you have violated your oath of office(not servitude to me), then I will REMOVE YOU FROM THAT APPOINTED OFFICE. To imply that any appointed official by the President, is only appointed, because of his/her willingness to serve the President, is a frightening thought indeed. I would like to think, that they were appointed to their position, because of their qualifications and skill sets, not because of their party loyalty.

So, nowhere in the Constitution, or in any oath of office, says that any elected officials must pledge complete loyalty, or servitude to the president. This is just bad interpretation, and confirmation bias. The Judicial Branch is the most powerful of all the branches of Government. It can declare actions by the President, or Congress Unconstitutional. It has the last say-so regarding Civil Rights, and Constitutional relevancy. The AG serves the people and the Constitution. If the President fires the AG because he only wants "yes" men in his Cabinet, then it says more about the President, than the AG.

You work at the pleasure of your boss. And, your boss can fire you for many reasons, right? But, do you serve your boss? I would guess, like many, you only serve the steady pay-check.

 

Which means he can fire them. Not that they're his personal...

Never mind...

Read this

http://www.politicalforum.com/index...listen-to-fox-news-to-actually-get-it.568154/

 

One can find law professors and historians that will opine the same way anyone wants; it proves nothing. Anyone -- law professor or not -- who claims the DOJ is independent from presidential control is simply exercising wishful thinking as if it had anything to do with reality.

 

Well, no Democrat cared. Why should they since they have their own system of justice?

 

The citizens of the United States of America.

 

That’s incorrect. The power of the executive vest in a president.

 

Read again:

"George Washington ordered the prosecution of participants in the Whiskey Rebellion, then ordered the case be dropped. John Adams ordered prosecutions under the Sedition Act. Thomas Jefferson squelched those cases, but took an active hand in the prosecution of his own onetime vice president Aaron Burr. One of Theodore Roosevelt’s AGs deferred to the president on individual antitrust cases. William Taft, according to the paper, ordered the backdating of a Justice Department document to give him cover for firing a whistleblowing federal employee."

 

Of course he does. The president can fire him at anytime for any reason

 

This is a revolting assault on the fragile rule of law
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/02/12/this-is-revolting-assault-fragile-rule-law/

Chuck Rosenberg is a former U.S. attorney, senior FBI official and acting head of the Drug Enforcement Administration.

Something extraordinary and deeply troubling happened at — and to — the Justice Department this week. Four federal prosecutors properly, and as a matter of conscience, withdrew from the Roger Stone case. They had shepherded that case through the criminal-justice system but in an alarming development were ordered to disavow a sentencing recommendation they filed with the federal judge overseeing the matter.

Their original recommendation — asking the judge to sentence Stone within the range set by the U.S. Federal Sentencing Guidelines for the offenses for which Stone was convicted at trial — was a perfectly ordinary filing. It is the type of pleading filed in federal courts by federal prosecutors every day. Certainly, when a defendant is convicted at trial, it is routine for prosecutors to suggest to the judge that he be sentenced within a prescribed range — the result of a cumbersome sentencing guidelines calculation that is often debated between the parties and adjudicated by the court.
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Someone on another thread, in defense of said Cry Baby, noted there is no law preventing a prez's intervention in a case like Stone's. In the main, that assertion is correct. But as Rosenberg points out in his op-ed, he and the employees of the DoJ with whom he worked obeyed the unwritten law that called for politics to stay our of their work. Because, as he puts it, the DoJ's work must be seen by the public as being fair to the accused.

More than anything Rosenberg stresses it has been tradition and respect for ethical boundaries established over decades that has maintained the public's trust by keeping the DoJ from violating it. Boundaries respected not just by mid-level workers but going all the way to the AG and even the prez. No longer. The Orange Pissant has seen to that. It's just one more way he has smeared his shyte on another vital institution of our government............as if appointing a hack like Billy the Bagman wasn't already bad enough.

 

Why? The judicial branch oversees cases...the DOJ enforces the law

 

Their role is to execute the law and enforce the presidents policies

 

Wrong, the AG works for the executive branch. Which means the president...

 

They most certainly act as tho' they are independent of the President.. and the people who elected and support him too!

 

The presidents have always had to be mindful that there are threatening remedies available against them, namely elections, term limit, and impeachment.

Like the recent unpeachment and the election coming up in just 262 days.

Kings do not endure those remedies, but rather endure until they are succeeded at their death. That's the monarchy way.

 

Our third world dictator inserted his opinions into the cases which directly involved direct supporters of him,talk about putting ones thumb on the scale??Justice is supposed to be fair and impartial exactly as his impeachment WAS SUPPOSED TO BE, but it would appear with Dirty Donald we can expect the justice of a two bit tyrant.

 

Trump's tweet had nothing to do with the prosecutors' resignation. Their sandbagging the DOJ and the AG had everything to do with their resignations. They reviewed their sentencing "recommendations" with the AG per normal and got his tentative OK. Then they recommended something totally different. That will get a federal prosecutor in hot water every time.

 

We've been telling you folks that about 'general welfare' for years, you going to take your own advice on that?

If it was as you say, the DOJ wouldn't be accountable to anyone, how stupid would that be? 200 plus years this has worked, I think we'll be just fine. At least now we know the system can even weather a three tantrum. The Founders were freaking geniuses...