The Berniephobes are wrong

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by btthegreat, Feb 17, 2020.

  1. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Well you are a mainstream neoliberal economist, that's fine.

    But the consequences for the public are permanent austerity, as I outlined to Giftedone in post #140 above.

    As for the causes of the GFC, there is plenty of debate on that:

    https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo...lass-steagall-cause-the-2008-financial-crisis

    "But others, like former Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner, have said the focus on Glass-Steagall is misguided. They argue other factors were more important in causing the 2008 crisis, such as bad mortgage underwriting, poor work by the ratings agencies and a securitization market gone crazy. All of that would have happened no matter the size of the big banks".

    In any case - financial shenanigans committed by banksters on a vast scale
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
  2. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Drudge has an image of a bad EKG over 2 articles about Sanders' health.
    It is a very damaging image and almost certainly a fake. Another very low blow. So low that it might just help his campaign.
     
  3. Thehumankind

    Thehumankind Well-Known Member

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    Bernie Sanders is a socialist but not an authoritarian, he believes the power of the many should be above all other politically, for me that sounds empowering democracy. On the other hand business is business and the corporate giants could adjust and should adjust not only to bring profit but balance it with welfare to those who contributed a lot for them to prosper.
     
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  4. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    You paint a very disturbing picture.
     
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  5. FlamingLib

    FlamingLib Well-Known Member

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    True.

    I bet the Bernie people are ecstatic about those latest numbers though, from threee different polling outfits. That's always been their biggest weakness: electability. That, and Bernie is a loon.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
  6. Smartmouthwoman

    Smartmouthwoman Bless your heart Past Donor

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    And you remain oblivious to the real world where Donald Trump is YOUR President.

    FB_IMG_1580525605074.jpg
     
  7. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    What you mean is Western European CAPITALISM with a large social system.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
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  8. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    At the same time that Michael Moore predicted - before ANYONE else - that Trump would beat Hillary in 2016, I began to take serious interest in Trump when he said (of blacks in inner city suburbs): "you are living in poverty, your neighbourhoods are like war zones, your schools and hospitals are broken, your young men are in prison..........vote for me, what have you got to lose?

    Hmm... someone who was....apparently....seriously concerned to change conditions ... unlike Hillary who just bleated inanities about "we are the party who are concerned about you".
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
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  9. FlamingLib

    FlamingLib Well-Known Member

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  10. Texas Republican

    Texas Republican Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Nothing is stopping them from voluntarily paying more taxes.

    We could liquidate the assets of the top 1% and that would run the federal government for four weeks. Constantly crying about taxing the 1% is meaningless.
     
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  11. Texas Republican

    Texas Republican Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  12. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Oh, please--this is nonsense.
    Well, you're wrong.
     
  13. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't bet the farm on Trump.
     
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  14. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    They know the present system is unsustainable.

    Er… let's look at that "four weeks" figure:

    Wealth is distributed in a highly unequal fashion, with the wealthiest 1 percent of families in the United States holding about 40 percent of all wealth and the bottom 90 percent of families holding less than one-quarter of all wealth. ... Notably, 25 percent of families have less than $10,000 in wealth.Mar 21, 2019

    Total household wealth in all forms in the US is about $98 trillion*, so the one percenters own about $40 trillion....

    .During FY2017, the federal government spent $3.98 trillion, up $128 billion or 3.3% vs. FY2016 spending of $3.85 trillion.

    so liquidation of that $40 trillion would run the government for…. 10 years!

    *If a pie represented the estimated $98 trillion of household wealth in the United States, nine pieces, or 90% of the pie, would go to the wealthiest 20% in the country, according to a National Bureau Of Economic Research study of household wealth trends in the united states from 1962 to 2016.Jan 31, 2020
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
  15. Texas Republican

    Texas Republican Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Let's do it! Capitalist pigs!

    Oh wait, then they'll move out if the U.S. ... France tried taxing the wealthy and they all fled. France had to drop their tax on the elite.
     
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  16. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Exactly what is the nonsense? MMT, or you being a mainstream economist...

    Wrong on what? The causes of the GFC? Interest rates? Deficits? Balanced budgets? Austerity?

    That is your idea of debate?
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020
  17. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    So you admit your figures were crap.

    Now, as to the rich wanting to avoid taxes...yes that is human nature.

    But Gates and Buffet agree the wealthy have to pay more taxes, to maintain a sustainable economy as well as the capitalist system itself.

    But apparently it's only the 0.0001 percent - like Gates and Buffet - who say this.....
     
  18. Gatewood

    Gatewood Well-Known Member

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  19. Robert E Allen

    Robert E Allen Banned

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    Kennedy was asking young men to volunteer for the armed forces. No deeper meaning need be looked for in Kennedy's words.
     
  20. Texas Republican

    Texas Republican Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You go tax "the rich". See how many stick around. It never works.

    Don't let your jealousy of the rich become an obsession. It will destroy you from the inside.
     
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  21. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Actually, I'm an MMT'er; I agree with Professor Stephanie Kelton's witty aphorism:

    "Money doesn't grow on rich people".

    You can see Kelton's MMT lectures on YouTube.

    So you need to direct your remarks to those people here who think government must tax or borrow from the private sector before it can spend (of course, you also believe it, it's just that you are content to accept entrenched poverty as part of the national scene, whereas eg, LangleyMan isn't).

    Thank you for the advice, but I'm not interested in the rich, other than to the extent that mal-distribution of wealth is actually damaging our economy, and the lives of many people less fortunate than myself.

    Fact: no-one need be living in poverty, given the resources and productive capacity (not fully utilised) of the nation; in fact the government can guarantee above poverty employment for all (see Kelton's lecture on the JG).

    In any case, I'm with Bernie, who knows we can have an economy that works for everyone, without "destroying the rich" (your ridiculous assertion).
     
  22. Texas Republican

    Texas Republican Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Bernie and his crazy ideas. Too funny. Even he doesn't know how much his programs will cost. We can't afford any of them. And even if we could, Americans don't want government to have that level of governmental control over our lives.

    I'd love to see Trump vs. Bernie. It could be 60%-40% Trump over Bernie. Or maybe 65%-35%.
     
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  23. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    Yes we can, even a financial transaction tax ALONE on the parasitic financial derivatives casino (the mob including the banksters that caused the GFC) would pay for debt free tertiary education.

    70% of Americans, when shown the truth about the mal-distribution of the nation's wealth, and when they realise the scant relationship of real work performed to acquisition of wealth by money shufflers (eg, rent seekers, derivatives players....even Bloomberg's wealth is mostly obtained by collecting company statistics and selling this information to other people who would rather buy and sell assets, rather than actually doing real work, like creating something)...when people know these things, Americans DO want government to rectify the situation. Even the idea of a Job Guarantee has 70% support.

    It now appears you may well see that contest in November......and the latest polls are not agreeing with you re the outcome.
     
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  24. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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  25. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Human SURVIVAL depends upon socialism.

    The first tribal societies were ALL socialist in nature.

    Our current GREED OBSESSED unregulated capitalism is a PERVERSION of human nature.
     

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