Trump is considering Pardon for Edward Snowden!

You claimed that classification was used to cover things up that shouldn't be classified, so what of the 1.7 million documents that Snowden stole, shouldn't be classified?

 

I gave you 3 examples of classification used to cover things up... You were not aware of any examples - and claiming others were uninformed.

Now you want to move the goal posts and make this about Snowden - a lame tactic - but you were given an example from Snowden - NSA - en masse spying - were you not aware ?

You go running around claiming others are - uninformed - turns out it is you.

 

I want examples from what Snowden stole and released. That's what we're talking about. I don't know how it's "moving the goalposts" to refer to Snowden since that is what this thread is about, that is what I've been talking about.


"NSA - en masse spying" seems pretty vague. But I'm going to guess that what you are really referring to is the program collecting telephone metadata. I think the program was legal and I don't think some IT guy knows better, nor do you.

I can see where this is going. You probably have some extreme positions on this which make your opinion's irrelevant, but you don't want to reveal them.

 

You asked for an example from Snowden - and I gave you one - but, the original context was not just Snowden ..

IN any case .. What about NSA - en Masse spying - Snowden - had you not heard of ?

are you pretending to not understand or what ? You seriously never heard of The NSA Spy Program - and connection to Snowden ?

News to you this is ? - and you claim to be informed .. desperate despite being proven otherwise a number of times already - and are headed for yet another fall... off what ever Turnip Truck you road in on

 

Holy crap I actually referring to your "NSA - en Masse spying -" in my reply...did you even read it?

Go back and read that post and then try to have an informed response.

 

I know you referred to the NSA -- which is why I asked you what about that being an example of classified material - did you not understand.

You are the one claiming to be "Informed" yet you could not come up with one example of things that were classified that the public has the right to know about.

You asked for an example from Snowden - This is the one you were given. Your idea that no such examples in all the Classified material exist" - is false...

What part of "Your claim is false" and this example proves your claim false do you not understand? along with all the other examples I gave - each which individually prove your claim false ...

 

Yup and so is Assange.

 

I am aware of that.

... this is where you found that "motive".

With that for a motive? No, you most certainly do not know what a whistleblower is.

Snowden is most certainly a whistleblower - in the highest degree - and this is why I say that it would be better to admit you do not understand his motives than to make such an outrageous conclusion as you have done.

 

a little bit to chew on..OK here goes"

"I know you referred to the NSA -- which is why I asked you what about that being an example of classified material - did you not understand."

1. I gave mention of a specific program, the phone metadata program, and in your last post you didn't seem aware that I mentioned it, even though it was in my post. If you can't understand the easy things where I give you a direct answer, I doubt you'll understand much else.

"You are the one claiming to be "Informed" yet you could not come up with one example of things that were classified that the public has the right to know about."

2. I never made any claim that the public had the right to know classified information. If anything the opposite. So I've no idea what you are going on about.

"You asked for an example from Snowden - This is the one you were given. Your idea that no such examples in all the Classified material exist" - is false."

3. Sigh...once again, and you said, "What about NSA - en Masse spying." To which I replied..see my point one, unless you are referring to another "What about NSA - en Masse spying" program. If so, what is it?

Based on your response, you don't seem to have any idea of what you're talking about. You barely seem to know a few talking points (NSA - en Masse spying) but beyond that you seem clueless.

So... do you believe there should be such a thing as classified information?

Should there be such a thing as intelligence services?

Do you believe that the government has the right to keep secret sources and methods?

 

In order to be a whistleblower, there are steps that someone has to take in the federal government and intelligence services. Snowden could have gone to his supervisor, if that's not satisfactory take the issue to the NSA IG to ask for clarification on the legality of the program.

Snowden did none of those things. Instead he stole the data, fled the country, and went to China and Russia with it. I'm hard pressed to see how that's whistle blowing and not espionage.

 

I'm a "MAGA cap" person. And I think that Snowden belongs in prison. Same with Bradley Manning and Julian Assange.

 

FIRST of all you don’t know what he did prior to skipping town. SECOND complaining to the “higher up” about what the “higher ups” are doing is asking for trouble. If you don’t understand that …...

No, he stole nothing and he did not “flee to Russia” with his info. He is “stuck” in Russia. That was not his plan.

That’s because you do not understand the situation.

 

What a bunch of Gibberish - If the NSA is violating the law - spying on US citizens en masse - the public has a right to know. It matters not whether or not you agree with en mass spying - as this does not change the fact that the NSA was violating the law by en mass spying on US citizens.

You claimed not to know of any examples where "Classified" is used to cover up bad Gov't behavior - whether you agree with this activity or not is irrelevant to the fact.

Of course there we should have an intelligence service and of course Gov't has a right to keep secrets. This has nothing to do with what is being discussed - a diversion because you can't deal with the fact that your claim is patently false.

This has to do with examples where the Gov't uses "Classification Illegitimately" not examples where there are legitimate reasons.

 

I believe him. He deserves a pardon.

 

Well you've done a poor job explaining what it is that you understand that I don't.

 

The program wasn't in violation of the law. If you don't even know that, why are you pretending to understand this topic?

 

If you can't figure out that our Intelligence agencies spying on the public is an issue - regardless of whether or not it is legal - then there is little help for uniformed brain.

 

Well legality sure makes a difference between a whistle blower and a traitorous spy.

 

We are talking about whether or not information should have been classified to begin with .. and that is what makes the difference.

If you want to claim that our spy agencies should be able to spy on us "En Mass" without our knowledge - then you are welcome to your opinion.

Do you not realize that this is Snowden's defense - ? That in fact the Gov't was acting illegitimately in keeping this information from the public. For someone who started out crying "you are uninformed" - you don't seem to be very "informed" - on any of the aspects covered so far - having your backside handed to you with each post - and digging your hole deeper.

Clearly you hate the founding principles, principles of Republicanism - and the right to privacy.

 

I told you what the NSA program was, and you still refer to it as "En Mass." There is no such program and you've failed to demonstrate which program you think should never have been classified, or why.

But maybe you could explain to me how Snowden revealing the extent of US spying on China, benefited the US that he deserves to be a whistleblower? Do you think that program should have been unclassified as well?

It's difficult to discuss issues like this with you when you seem to take such pride in your ignorance that you won't even bother to google anything. I assume your love of Snowden is some sort of weird anti-American fetish.

 

Let me ask you a question:

Would you be okay with the government physically tapping telephone cables? Say for example, you have a major transmission cable and the government, without the public knowing, essentially spliced into the cable so as to create a parallel cable that carries the same data? And that data is sent to a government database with no public oversight?

You okay with that?

 

If memory serves, that topic was covered extensively in The Shadow Factory. If the book is to be believed, that practice had been going on for decades. Does that have some relevance to Snowden? Or this thread?

 

Of course there was an En Mass program - another swing and a miss. What exactly do you think "Meta-Data" refers to..

Edward Snowden: Leaks that exposed US spy programme
ffff

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-23123964

Further details in the rest of the Article. You seem to have no idea what you are talking about - What part of En Mass spying program - on US citizens - do you not understand ?

We don't need to know the specific details about Methods - but the general question of "Should We allow these agencies to engage in "En Mass Spying on US citizens" needs to be addressed. no need to get into any details about capabilities - other than very general "we can tap your phone " OHH ... go figure.

And in what part of the world - was this capability not an open secret among intelligence elite .. It was just you and me who didn't know - Chump...

At some point - lines were crossed - and although you don't see any problem - in your yearning for Orwellian Totalitarian Bliss - I do not share your beliefs.

 

Ya ****ing think? Well hell yeah.

So are you gonna answer the question or not?

 

Can you explain it's connection to Snowden?