Is God Making a Comeback?

The world would be so much better if we reversed the word and exalted doG.

 

This is all you can say in response to Daniel showing you study after study after study?

 

We do have to distinguish between a religion and a church. You and I have religious beliefs based on our experiences and our attempts to understand these experiences. Atheists would say these experiences are simply the chemicals within our bodies that react in the world. Nothing more and nothing less. Therefore, there really is no good or bad. Some follow good or bad depending upon their upbringing, family life or connections. Others with a more spiritual understanding understand that we are more than just chemicals and that we have a spirit or soul that is unique to each person. Some experiences of people suggest that our spirits are actually separate entities that somehow work within our physical bodies as one in purpose. Some will say the spirit is not physical while other will say our spirits are physical but of a finer material than our bodies. At death, the two separate. One goes back into the ground while the other ascends to a place to await a resurrection with the physical body. Others think they go back into a new living creature. The new creature may be another human life or not. Others just think they die and the chemicals go back into the ecosystem and that's it. But, that is their religious experience.

A Church is an organization of people with the same beliefs or religious experience. Or, some who are interested in learning about said religion. Some organizations or churches are very basic while others are very complex. To belong to a church, there are some requirements as all organizations (businesses) require some form of trade or money to exist and teach their religious beliefs to others. Some are extensive while others not so much and are willing to live at very basic levels of needs. Their beliefs will put into motion a need for missions and mission statements. Some missions are simple while others complex. Jesus Christ requires faith in the Father, Son and Holy Ghost, repentance of sins, charity, baptism and receiving the Holy Ghost for admittance into the earthly Church and the Eternal Church with our Heavenly Father. Some understand that these ordinances must be given by correct authority from the Godhead. Others, not so much. The leaders generally take upon them their own authority. So, how do we know if we should be members of a Church or not to return to God? How do we know which Church or religion to follow to return to God? Does incarnation really occur and lead us to the tree of life with God? I have my understanding and experiences to point me in a direction that I believe leads to the tree of life with God. It doesn't match up with your reincarnation belief. So, how can two wrongs be right or two rights be right without knowledge from God?

 

So it appears your argument is that if God took a more visible, active roll in the everyday lives of humans, that would lead
to a Communist like society of slackers and lazy-bobs ... interesting. So using your logic, believing that God will not do
anything to help anyone leads to more self-reliance and motivation. Works for me.

 

I actually agree with you. This was not how Jesus Christ taught. He taught, gave light to darkness and the way to know and understand. But, he did not teach to take away our rights to believe as we choose for ourselves. But, that doesn't mean that those with the truth should stop teaching. Jesus organized his Church with Prophets, Apostles, 70's (evangelists), teachers, preachers, deacons and so on. But, it didn't take much time for the people to change His Gospel, Doctrines and Ordinances. Eventually, tyrants took over some calling themselves Popes and whatever. So, as Paul prophesied, there would be a falling away or an apostacy. He didn't expect it to be long but it ended up to be about 1400 years or more. The Church has been restored in these days of "the restitution of all things." The last days, the Lord would not leave us without Prophets, Apostles, 70's and so on.

 

No that is a form of determinism, some atheists would agree with this others would argue against it, if you are going to strawman atheist points of view at least make an attempt to understand what they are!

 

Well, the simple fact that unlike the British Monarchy they had just fought to escape from, the Founding Fathers
SPECIFICALLY decided NOT to have an official State Church, a practice that had dominated European thought
for centuries. That pretty much confirms the Founding Father's wish to separate church matters from state matters.

This was mainly because of abhorrent policies propagated by the Church of England over the preceding 500 years.
I suggest you look up the term "Droit du Seigneur", the mutilation of John Ogalvie, and 500 plus years of
Catholic-Protestant Wars.

 

Well, from what I understand it is not so much your belief system that matters as what your actions and thoughts are. All beliefs eventually lead to god. It might go by different names, or have different rituals, different codified texts, but in the end it all goes back to god, because god is all. There is nothing that exists except god, so it is impossible for there to be anything that does not lead back to him. Whether one believes in reincarnation, or saints, or even Jesus himself, ultimately it doesn't matter. God is all. And God is love. Now, this doesn't mean that we can all just do whatever we want, but that is for another conversation, lol.
What matters is does your faith lead you on a path filled with love? If so, perfect! It is a good path for you, and that is all that matters. If you are on a path that leads you to want to impose your will on others, to dominate, and take away free will, then that is not a good path, and will probably impede your journey to return to god.
Anyways, I respect your faith, and it seems to be working for you, and I am happy that you find the answers you are looking for in that faith.

 

You really didn't understand. It's not that I wouldn't want to live with God in Heaven. That's a different topic altogether. We will still have our moral agency. We just won't have Satan around to tempt us to do evil. And, not a lot of the billions of God's children will be living in the Celestial Kingdom of Glory. Only those who can keep their agency while not falling into future trouble because those who can live with God will receive their own mansions or universes to organize and watch over.

What my point was is that if God makes himself visible to all, then people would not be left with their moral agency by faith to choose good or evil. He purposely leaves us to our own decisions to choose for ourselves. The fact is, God is busy in people's lives every day. Billions pray to him 24-7. What he's asking atheists and Darwinists to do is learn to believe in Christ through faith, not empirical means. That is if you want to organize your own universe some day.

 

Faith, belief, actions (works) all are important. But, those also require obedience to God's plan. Yours is a system similar to "all roads lead to Rome." Not true. Jesus said that the only way we can be with him in the end is through baptism. If we are not baptized we cannot enter into the Kingdom of God. Why would we be able to return to God if we don't believe a thing he teaches? What we need to do is find out what he teaches, truly teaches, and follow Him. Keep his commandments. Receive his ordinances by authority. God is not a god of disorder. His House is one of order, not confusion. So, all roads cannot lead to where God exists. Does this mean good people without this acceptance can't be in Heaven? Of course not. Just not living in the Glory part of Heaven Paul teaches and saw in his vision. The 3rd or Celestial Glory.

 

I view the concept of baptism as the recognition of the separation of the ego self and the spiritual or higher self. Similarly, when Jesus says “I am the way and the truth and the life, no one comes to the Father except through me” what he is talking about is discarding the ego mind, which is rooted in this physical world with all of its fears, worries, hatreds, etc, and recognize the higher self, the Christ consciousness. Only then do you see the reality the ego believes in is insanity, and it is the higher self, which knows only love, that leads you back to god.

 

No it wasn’t. Please don’t try out 1619 project propaganda on this 1776 American.

 

Not in science, He isn't. The number of scientists who believe in God continues to decline and He's making no headway into being mentioned in scientific theories.

Science has changed a lot in the last few centuries as it improves. It's relatively recent that alchemy has been taken out of science. That's not a reason to trust alchemy.

Lots of books have been written about it. We stopped believing in God for much the same reason we stopped believing in other supernatural creatures.

He can challenge away. That's not an argument so far.

What comeback are you talking about? There are fewer Christians all the time, especially in science.

 

And, I agree. However, the Gospel also means that if you follow him, truly follow him, then you will accept not just one thing he said to do. But, you would accept all he said to do. He taught his Apostles that he would eventually give them the authority to even perform miracles. And, to perform baptisms by emersion in water and to give the gift of the Holy Ghost. John 3:5, "Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God." The concept of baptism is a re-birth. When we come up out of the waters of baptism, we are cleansed of our sins and start a new life in Christ. However, we still have to repent every day as we are still not sinless. If you love Christ, keep his commandments. That means being baptized by one with the authority to do so. That means not to teach false doctrine of reincarnation. We have but one life to come unto Christ if we are given that opportunity. Those who don't have that opportunity will in the Spirit Prison.

 

Answer: Are there fewer? There may be less people attending church but that doesn't mean they have become atheists and don't believe in Christ anymore.

 

This is one of the many topics Pew Research studies on a continung basis.

Their data show that between 2009 and 2019 the number of those who self identify as Christians has dropped by 10 million. The rate of decliine is about the same for each of the major divisions of Christianity in America.

And, it shows that the number of those not affiliated with a particular religon (a group identified as "nothing in particular") has grown at about the same rate as that of the combined Christians.

The number of atheists + agnostics is growing, but at a much slower rate.

Obviously, it could be interesting to look into this segment of "nothing in particular" to see where the shift is going.

But, my bet is that these people are drifting toward more abstract religious views, not carrying with them a devout belief in the Christ of the major Christian denominations.

https://www.pewforum.org/2019/10/17/in-u-s-decline-of-christianity-continues-at-rapid-pace/

 

I think you will find many people are simply becoming apathetic about the existence of a god, there is little need for a god in modern life and promises of eternal life without evidence are not important to many people anymore.

 

It is a 'resurrection' time of year.

 

Nonetheless, our nation was founded and governed by judeo-christian mores. And mistakes, we made a few, but the hallmark of our system of government is that it is not finished, that we continually work to make it better. We are for want of a better term a work in progress.

 

Really, can you provide a link to anything at the time that talks about Judeo-Christian mores, most Christians were very anti-semetic at the time your country was founded. Judeo-Christian was a term used by left wing Christians in the 1930s as Christian had become associated with Fascism and antisemitism. I notice how the right wing has adopted the term now and used completely out of context.

 

The transformation of Easter season seems like one more indication of the drift toward "nothing in particular".

When I look around, I see a rabbits and eggs made of low grade chocolate season.

 

Spring is the reawakening of much of nature.

 

Which is a fascinating claim because everyone who built this country wasn't a plantation owner or a slave. As was the case in Europe, many Americans were subsistence farmers, fishermen and townspeople engaged in various forms of manufacturing and trade.

 

Slavery in the early US extended far beyond the south and plantations.

Benjamin Franklin owned slaves. Alexander Hamilton's adoptive parents were wealthy merchants who owned slaves. George Washington's family were wealthy land speculators, and Washington owned slaves. He didn't free them until 1799. That's not the end of slave ownership even amoung our notable founders whose wealth was not based on plantations.

England ended slavery tens of years before the US did, and they didn't have to have a civil war over it. And, I don't see anything in UK history that is similar to post civil war America and the history of our ex-slave population or anyone who might look similar to the eye.

We STILL struggle with this very serious problem.

 

Yes, and James Otis Jr. asserted that Blacks had the same natural rights as Whites in his arguments in Paxton's Case (1761) and the indispensable man of the pre-Revolutionary period who is pictured in my avatar and quoted in my signature was opposed to slavery, as were other Founders and Framers, not to mention the countless ordinary men who picked up a musket and fought for our Independence.

This and the fact that most of the Americans who helped build this country were neither slaveholders nor slaves remains. Of course, giving a full account of History doesn't diminish or excuse the abomination that existed on these lands going back to the days when European settlers were enslaving Native Americans (who likewise enslaved their fellow Native Americans and some of the settlers they captured), and our country paid dearly for that sin during and after the Civil War. As it has been said, Man cannot defy Nature with impunity.

Obviously, slavery was and is far worse than a serious problem - it is a crime against humanity that still endures on this planet after thousands of years - and it troubles me that many people in this country are re-opening wounds that my generation strove to heal, but if we're going to discuss History in an honest and accurate manner we have to discuss the whole story, not a selective or revisionist part of that story.