US/NATO rule out halt to expansion,reject Russia demands.

Ah, China. Would they want to nuke and get nuked? I don't know. I would expect restraint on most sides because no one wants to be on the receiving end.

 

Russia has about as "colorable" a claim to Ukraine as we do to Texas. The Ukraine has a long history and was actually the "first" Russia for a long time. They ASKED Russia to take them over and were satisfied with the arrangement MORE OR LESS for quite some time. It's been less for some years however.

The thing is that the Texans don't really see themselves as separate country and the Ukrainians do and that makes all the difference, If people really want to be free, they should

(If you want to see how most Texans feel about the US vs Them I would advise you to read this. It's a Fantasy Fictionalizing but it's also a really entertaining book and it actually captures some of the important subtleties of this unique relationship really well, though it's also a really outlandish tale.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Specter_Is_Haunting_Texas

 

That doesn't give you stomach cancer, or the many other types he had. He was 72 as well but in good shape. 70 was the new 50 even then.

Again, are we defending nuclear testing now?

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davida...is-more-nukes-fewer-controls/?sh=7f333ccabd47

 

Of course. Nuclear testing is needed to refine and enhance nuclear weapons design. Though it can be done underground for the most part.

 

Hitler thought that Britain was knocked out of the war and about to leave, though she had actually won in 1940. Just about everybody thought that America would opt out pretty soon, since she didn't really have a dog in the fight and Naziism was an American invention anyhow.

 

Why do we need to enhance nuclear weapons? All our treaties have been directed to DESTROYING nukes for several years

If Trump had said we should all eat sh*t and die most Trumpers would be lining up at the graveyard with big bowls of ordure by now.

 

What is "heart" of Russia?

Russia has a heart?

 

I think that Putin is making an enemy of NATO in order to benefit himself domestically and justify military aggression against former Soviet satellite states. NATO is no threat to Russia unless Russia attacks a NATO member, and he knows that. He just doesn't like NATO standing in the way of his imperial ambitions.

 

You realize I'm a native Texan.... right?

 

Every other culture that has tried to fight on two fronts one being russia in the winter has gotten bent over and ****ed to death.

 

On that note... maybe Putin should be taking advantage of the hyperinflation unrest in NATO Turkey.

 

That fact that you cannot dismiss any opportunity to get a dig in at Trump supporters undermines the rest of your position.

We need to enhance our nuclear weapons to make the existing ones better. Not necessarily in destructive power but in safety and reliability. And even if we get rid of most of our nuclear weapons the ones that remain need to be safe and reliable don't they?

 

How? Why?

It sounds like their issue stems from Erdowan wanting to keep interest rates low out of some fundamentalist Islamic principle.

 

A lot of people seem unaware (or refuse to acknowledge) that.

The problem is that about 20% of 'Ukraine' (primarily in the Crimea) identify ethnically and culturally as 'Russian' and presumably this is the portion that supports being 'taken over' by Russia. The other problem is that this region happens to be the most rich in natural resources, and even if the other ~80% of Ukraine could be politically convinced to give up the Crimea and the Crimean 'Russians' to Russia , the other ~80% would not accept the economic loss of that territory and the natural resources within it. It would be nice if The People could just vote town-by-town for which country they want to be a part of and we could get past this whole thing without a war, but even the most democratic of nations will tend to not allow its people to take their land with them when they leave... and so we're left with war.

And to be fair, I'm certain that if a small portion of Russia who ethnically identified more closely with one of Russia's neighbors wanted to split off, Russia would not let them do it either. And neither would the US or any other country. The Will of The People only matters up to a certain point, and that reality exists across all governing bodies. Which is just more evidence that government, even democratic government, never really prioritizes its people over its power.

 

No, I said that suggesting Ukraine join NATO is provocative. It's a military alliance. If Ukraine wants to join the EU, and they'll have them, that's different. That's self determination. That self determination itself may be provocative to Russia, but I can get behind that principle. I can't get behind a provocative military alliance as a stand alone principle.

 

You should know WHY

HOW is up to Putin.

The government of Turkey keeps interest rates low for the same reason other NATO countries do, so bankrupt governments can borrow more money at cheap interest rates.

As Russia recently said... they are not afraid of sanctions from the socially and economically bankrupt.

 

Why are you talking about this as if it was hypothetical? It has already happened.

 

If I were Russian, I would view the admission of Ukraine into NATO as a major security risk. It would justify deployment of any number of nations' military forces, any of which may be adversarial to me at the time, right on my border and gateway to my heartland.

In fact, the mere suggestion of it might induce me to seize Crimea so as not to be shut out of the seas when it becomes NATO (because once it is, I can't seize it because an attack on one is an attack on all).

 

I'm speaking from a security standpoint. If you can put your troops in Ukraine, you got a good springboard to strike at Moscow...the heart of Russia, meaning that if you take it, it could be a mortal wound.

 

Ah, so you're another acolyte of Putinism. How amusing.

 

If I were Russian, I would have better sense than to buy into Putin's BS about NATO and the alleged security risk it represents. Putin is much more of a security risk to Russia than NATO is.

 

put it this way, if Russia put missile defense, military equipment and base in Cuba, would we allow it? i think that question already been answered in the 60s. Russia dont want NATO military near its border just like US dont want china/russia military near its border, aka Cuba

 

The Cubla Missile crisis was obviated by our taking missiles out of Turkey (along with the blockade.)

 

yeah, and we have alot military base near russia, so what happen if they decide open up a base in cuba again with missile there. the fact is we dont like russia/china have base near US, and vice versa.