State bans on birth control

Discussion in 'Abortion' started by The Mello Guy, May 4, 2022.

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Would it be constitutional for a state to ban birth control

  1. Yes, there is no right to birth control

    5 vote(s)
    22.7%
  2. No, birth control is a right

    17 vote(s)
    77.3%
  1. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    That isn’t remotely what scotus ruled, if you view was the view of the courts it wouldn’t be allowed in any state
     
  2. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    What is it you find unclear?
     
  3. CKW

    CKW Well-Known Member

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    Your poll is misleading really. Using the term "right" isn't going to give you any real information.

    Food, housing, and a job aren't considered rights....so I doubt Birth control can be considered one either.

    As far as I know...there are no activist groups on the right clamoring to ban birth control...so this is just fear mongering.
     
  4. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    There are no souls, and the 19level of hell is reserved for people who are snarky
     
  5. FAW

    FAW Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Lets recap.

    You inserted yourself into a conversation about the concept of contraceptives being outlawed and me saying that is just fearmongering. Your reply was...

    "It's not fearmongering. Quite a few autocrats see repressive government as an idea whose time has come in the world and think that if they can get lots of tyranny on the books it will be hard to get it off. There is a reason that CPAC is meeting in the totalitarian dominion of Hungary this year."

    -Autocrats see repressive government as a great idea, and if they can get enough tyranny on the books it will be hard to get it off, and as proof of this assertion you point to a CPAC meeting being held in totalitarian Hungary?

    -So you are saying that the USSC are autocrats and they do not honestly believe that ROE v Wade was a poorly formed constitutional argument, instead they are doing it for the sake of creating tyranny, and if they can just get enough of this tyranny on the books it will be difficult to get it all off which is their real goal is just to create tyranny, and as proof of this assertion, we need look no further than CPAC holding a meeting in Turkey?

    -In the context of your premise about their goal just being tyranny, what is the significance of a CPAC meeting being held in Turkey?

    -You say there is a reason it is being held in Turkey. What are you asserting is the reason?

    -How does this reason impact the USSC?

    -How are you rationalizing that a minority party can be totalitarian?

    -In truth, I find the whole thing unclear. For a 3 sentence reply, you packed a whole lot of confusion into a small amount of space.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
  6. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    You never heard of the Roman Catholic Church?

    https://theconversation.com/how-the-catholic-church-came-to-oppose-birth-control-95694#:~:text=Condoms, diaphragms, the rhythm method,the Church's prohibition of contraception.

    Also, stating that three SC judge candidates would blatantly lie to Congress about abortion and then vote to outlaw it anyway would be considered 'fearmongering'....until now.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
  7. CKW

    CKW Well-Known Member

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    I haven't heard of any catholic activist groups trying to ban birth control. Have you? If you are a fundamental catholic you don't use it.
    Nothing to fear there.

    And SC judges don't make law...they decide if law is constitutional. So they aren't going to implement law on BC as that would be legislative..

    and they aren't going to decide on a birth control ban until it's actually legislated which isn't going to happen.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
  8. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2022/04/05/why-cpac-traveling-illiberal-hungary

    It impacts the USSC because they were known to be right wing and have become much more so since Trump's appointments

    Minority parties can be totalitarian in regard to the type of government they advocate without being in the majority position themselves.

    Thank you for complimenting my conciseness. I apologize if you found it confusing. Please do not hesitate for ask for clarification in the future
     
  9. FAW

    FAW Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I assure you that a compliment was not contained in my reply, and your explanation here has provided NOTHING in the way of clarity. Is it your honest belief that this reply answers the questions that I posed? If anything, it only furthers the confusion. I did not ask how it impacts the USSC, yet that is the sole question that you supposedly "answered". Arguing against a point that was not raised is the textbook definition of a strawman argument.

    Is it your position that the strict constitutionalists on the USSC do not actually believe that Roe V Wade was poor legal reasoning, and instead they are doing so for the sake of creating tyranny? Is it your position that they do not actually believe that Roe V Wade was poor legal reasoning, and instead they are holding that position because deep down they are really just pro oppressive government?
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
  10. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Yes and yes.
     
  11. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    And after that IN wedlock, or at least they'll make it illegal to enjoy it.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
  12. FAW

    FAW Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I personally think that is preposterously silly, but you are certainly entitled to your opinion. I happen to be pro-abortion while simultaneously being anti Roe V Wade. I think abortion should be legal in most places, but do it the right way which is via legislation, not by hijacking the courts with nonsensical interpretations of what was clearly not intended by the writers of the Constitution.

    That activist read into the Constitution whatever you wish crowd is off their rocker in my mind.

    Ending Roe V Wade does not mean that women cannot get an abortion, it only means they will have to go to the doubtless many states where it is legal, and if the poor need to be subsidized with free bus tickets, then so be it. The sky is not falling.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
  13. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Until it does.

    Most Deep Red State Republican legislatures give me the impression they are Shakers when they are not Skoptsy
     
  14. CKW

    CKW Well-Known Member

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    There is a lot of interesting activism pushing for all sorts of destructive change to societal norms....change that would truly hurt women in the areas of sports and women's achievements and their position in our world. Your side is on the road to making women second class citizens. I think it makes good common sense to focus on what is happening on the here and now and truly protect women and not imagine things that are not realistic.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
  15. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    I voted yes because birth control, like abortion, is none of the federal government's business or authority and the Constitution has nothing to say about it. I would be greatly against any state that banned birth control, but it would be constitutional.
     
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  16. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    It's the first step.

    I'm the other side of you. I dislike R/W because it didn't go far enough. It used the Right to privacy rather than just saying abortions were part of bodily autonomy.

    What they're overturning here is the whole idea that you own you.
     
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  17. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    So following that logic they can ban any medical treatment they don’t like? Chemotherapy? Viagra? Our medical care is subjected to the whims of state govts?
     
  18. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    States are already trying to criminalize leaving for an abortion
     
  19. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    I think weight classes instead of sex hierarchies would solve most of the sports problems and I really don't see how making women travel out of State just because they get pregnant enhances their position in the world.
     
  20. FAW

    FAW Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The fundemental detrmination is when does life begin. If it begins at conception then that life supercedes the right to choose. If it begins at birth, then it does not. IN either case, this determination is not the purview of the Supreme Court. It is the purview of state legislatures, and not every state legislature needs to agree with each other. There is a difference between state and federal law for a reason.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
  21. FAW

    FAW Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Nonsense. I doubt there is any such attempt other than perhaps some opponent trying to twist the meaning of some proposal and pretend that there is, but even if there truly were such an effort, they have no jurisdiction whatsoever as to what happens in another state. That is not how our system of jurisprudence works, and you can rest assured that every state legislature as a whole understands this, regardless of what you or any other fearmonger out there tries to imply.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
  22. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Blood transfusions? What if your State legislature is captured by rabid Christian Scientists like many seem to be enthralled by Opus Dei.
     
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  23. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    https://www.politico.com/news/2022/03/19/travel-abortion-law-missouri-00018539

    Yes it does. Particularly if the enforcement is being done by the kind of vigilante law these people seem to favor.
     
  24. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    Maybe but they can always charge her for conspiring to leave the state for an abortion.
    https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/po...w-to-make-illegal-to-aid-or-abet-out-of-state
     
  25. CKW

    CKW Well-Known Member

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    So women and men are no different other then weight?? As a woman....I can tell you that is a false assessment of what a woman is.

    The left just really likes men, biological men... taking the place of women in sports. They consider it courageous for a man to take a woman's spot on the team.

    Weight does not make a gender. I'm thinking if a party wants to protect women they ought to at least acknowledge that women are not men and men aren't women.

    .
     

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