Durham says CIA found data alleging Trump-Russia connection not 'technically plausible,' was 'user c

It wasn't just Mueller. It was in every newspaper in the world. We all knew it. Only Manafort showed the polling data to a Ukrainian, not a Russian. However how does that lead you to the conclusion of collusion?

 

Konstantin Kilimnik is a Russian political consultant who lives in Moscow, and has ties to the Russian government.

 

Heh, so you deny that Kilimnik was born in Ukraine and lived and worked there? Under 2022 rules, that makes him Ukrainian, but of course the REAL issue is one I've asked before on this forum and never got a good answer to, and I'm pretty sure you won't provide one either, but you stated your theory of collusion is "that they did give the Russians their internal polling data, and that the Russian did work to help Trump." So, how is sharing internal polling data collusion? And what did the Russians do to help Trump?

 

LOL yes Manafort shared polling data that was already public with a Ukrainian ex business partner...So? There is zero connection to Russian's buying 100k worth of ads or Hilary spending 1 billion and spreading BS collusion rumors. The rest I agree with.

 

Yes. It was nothing more than Dirty Lying Crooked Hillary trying to rig the election by pushing lies that the lying fake news media, blind sourced to the "Intelligence Agencies" then hosed all over the nation like a bad case of diarrhea, for years.

The FBI had determined that this was faked up evidence in September of 2016 and that there was no evidence for the Alfa/Trump Server claim. I would imagine that you are rather outrage at publically making a fool of yourself by spreading disinformation in the service of the DNC and other lying Democrats.

"Heide is the agent who wrote the document formally opening the investigation into the Alfa Bank allegations which were brought to the FBI’s James A. Baker by Michael Sussmann. But the document he wrote says the source was a DOJ referral, not Sussmann. " So the FBI higher ups concealed from the investigating agent who the source was, as in DC, Sussman is a well known hack for lying crooked Hillary. And if Lying Crooked Hillary's lawyer shows up with dirt on her political opponent, Trump, it's going to be viewed differentlly as all the FBI agents questioned under oath today testified.

But it gets worse: It wasn't just concealed from Heide that Dirty Lying Crooked Hillary's hack lawyer was the source but he was told that the source was the DOJ! The doc closing the investigation says "FBI received whitepaper that was produced by anonymous third party from the US Department of Justice."

Heide writes on 9/22/16. "I just talked with cyber division. we're leaning toward this being a false server not attributed to the trump organization."

Compare that date, 9/22/16, with the date of your linked article: 11/1/2016 from the Lying Fake News NY Times, blind sourced to yet another lying "US Intelligence Official".

Now that you have been publicly pantsed for parrotting lying fake news from the NY Times, blind sourced to lying "Intelligence Agents" have you learned anything from this experience? And if so, what is it that you have learned?

 

the Trump Tower meeting happened, we have the Trump's emails - it failed, but it happened

just cause the Trump's fail at something, doesn't mean they did not try

 

Collusion: secret or illegal cooperation or conspiracy, especially in order to cheat or deceive others.

This is the textbook defiintion of it

You're really going to hang your hat on where Kilimnik was born ? You know he is a Russian political consultant that works/ed directly with the Russian government right ?

If you have to have it explained as to what internal polling data is, and how it's used, then your being obtuse.

But because are being obtuse, I will spell it out. The Polling data helps target who they need to reach, the message that will help them vote for the specific candidate, and why they should not vote for their opponent. This WAS what the social media campaign from the Russians was

 

No I'm not hanging it on Kilimnik's citizenship, I'm hanging it on the entire issue being ridiculous. So please explain what Manafort's intention in sharing internal polling data is. Since you know it, I assume Mueller and Durham know it too, so you can feel free in sharing.

 

Its in the post your responding to........

 

Um no it wasn't. I asked what Manafort's intention was, not one of many possible uses of internal polling data.

 

oh FFS...."what was his "intention" ? You're not serious ?

But again, its in the original post you responded to. He KNEW they were helping them, and he gave them what they needed to help them.

So let me ask YOU a question: Why would an American presidential campaign share their internal polling data with a Russian political consultant to the Russian government ?

 

I'm glad you asked, although I admit my idea is pure speculation; I can't know what Manafort was thinking, but on the other hand, you've been depending on pure speculation as well. At least my speculation makes sense and fits the available evidence.

Manafort was a shady lobbyist scurrying around DC for years representing various foreign clients. When he got the opportunity to work for the Trump campaign to gin up votes at the convention, he jumped at it and eventually wheeled and dealed until he got his competitor, Corey Lewandowski fired and ended up running the campaign. Important to all this is that Manafort worked for Trump for no pay. Now why would he do that?

BECAUSE he was a shady lobbyist representing various foreign clients, including a former President of Ukraine, and he wanted to use his position to continue that. In my opinion, revealing the polling data to potential future clients was to show that Trump actually had a good chance of winning while at the same time all of the public polling was showing that Trump was heading for a humiliating defeat. A man like Manafort would be very valuable as a lobbyist with good contacts inside the upcoming administration, but he had to show it was going to be the upcoming administration.

Now, all of this seemed obvious to me from the first moment I heard of these allegations, years ago. But...it was possible that subsequent investigations would reveal that Manafort was really pulling a double aught spy routine with the Russians, but nothing like that ever came to light, in spite of the near universal agreement among leftists such as yourself that Manafort was some sort of Russkie agent. I think at this point, we can safety assume that was an idiotic fantasy you bought into as part of the ridiculous collusion conspiracy theory lock stock and barrel. Since that's you, I don't expect any of this to make a bit of difference to your opinion. Reason seldom has much of an impact on conspiracy theorists.

 

OK...

Soliciting help from a foreign government in a US election is illegal......The ONLY reason that he was not prosecuted for that is that Mueller had no way of proving, in a court of law, what the Russians actually did with the data. What we do KNOW, is that the Russians DID use social media to help the Trump campaign. Multiple intelligence committees, and the the senate committee proved that. What Mueller could not prove was the breadth ot that help, and if it actually swung the election to him (it did).

But your defense is that it wasn't the Trump campaign, it was just a rouge Manafort that is to blame.......you know, his CAMPAIGN MANAGER........

Nobody is claiming Manafort a "ruskie agent", thats not even in the ballpark. Your defense is that since he wasn't a "russian agent" then it was OK ?

Helping someone thru illegal means to help you, IS collusion.

Collusion: secret or illegal cooperation or conspiracy, especially in order to cheat or deceive others.

 

What "help" was solicited from a foreign government in a US election? Facebook buys? The Russians also supported Bernie. Is he a Russian agent too? At least you could make a much better case for that with him.

That seems to be rather crucial. In fact, the entire collusion fantasy revolves around the idea that the Trump campaign had some sort of agreement with the Russian government; we do something for them, and they help the Trump campaign win the election.

Your argument seems to be that the actual collusion is that the Trump campaign directed Manafort to give internal polling data to a Ukrainian who would pass it off to the Russian government. Is that really what this collusion thing has been about this entire time?

Because if so, that's ridiculous.

Oh, what was the "illegal means?"

It's been clear that arguing with conspiracy theorists over this issue is fruitless, but at least early on there was the possibility that there would be some sort of revelation that might unravel the whole scheme, but it's been years now since we've known about the Manfort/polling data thing and no one has been able to connect that to collusion. The only revelations are coming from Durham now and I don't think you're interested in those.

Sad, very sad.

 

You're being beyond obtuse here. If you don't know that using foreign help in a US election is illegal, then I don't know what to say.

We don't know if they solicited the help of the Russian government, or if the Russians just did it out of the kindness of their heart, we absolutely know 2 things: 1. The Trump campaign gave their polling data to a representative of the Russian government. 2. The Russian government DID actively help the Trump campaign on social media platforms.

You don't have to be Sherlock Holmes to put these things together......

You can make up whatever you want, but these are just facts

 

Not for the desperate!

 

*LOL*

You really don't know much about Kilimnik, do you?

 

How do you know it failed? The only one who has said that is Trump Jr.
For all we know, it could have been a huge success. It's not as if they've been so open about it, already have lied numerous times about it and Trump Sr even faked a document to cover it up. I think it's safe to assume the worst rather than the least.

 

that is true, we don't know for sure what happened there, first they lied and said it never happened, then that it was about adoption, then after emails found they said they got no dirt - all we know for sure is the Trump tower meeting did happen

 

You know what that said to the Russians? It said "Hell, yes. We'll play ball with you!"

Not that the Russians didn't already know that.

There were over 240 contacts between Trump's campaign and the Russians. Anybody who claims that there's "nothing there" is delusional or failed to read ad/or grasp the Mueller Report's significance. Trump and his campaign's conduct was both treasonous and atrocious. I think Mueller's conclusion--that there was not enough evidence to find a conspiracy--is a far too conservative conclusion. He should be indicted for that, and for obstruction of justice, among other charges for different scenarios.

 

You might wanna tell AG Garland and the Biden DOJ to get on with it then to arrest the evil conspirator Trump

 

Who was soliciting foreign help? What help? Could you just speak plainly instead of saying "internal polling data" and then next step: collusion? Internal polling data isn't classified information, and it seems hard to believe that if Russia really thought they were going to have a contact (Manafort) close to the White House, that's what they would ask for.

This really hinges on Manafort being contacted by the Russians and requesting the polling data. I've seen no evidence of that, and since your collusion story, or at least this version of it, now rests on Manafort being an a conscious Russian spy. Given that Manafort and virtually everyone in the campaign were being surveilled by the FBI/CIA/NSA, how would they not have evidence of Manafort treason if he was really a traitor?

Frankly, my explanation makes about a hundred times more sense than your version, but then that's why these conspiracy theories have such staying power, they appeal to something deep within you. But I need evidence and you have not provided any at all.

 

Yes. It's a great big hilarious joke to betray your country. "America First!"

Did you believe the punchline?

 

*LOL*

Jesus----

 

You can't possibly be that ignorant.
Unless willfully ignorant.
Trump stood on a stage and asked for Russia's help. Don Jr. held a meeing in Trump tower with a Russian agent and lawyer, and Sr. fabricated a letter lying about the meeting.
The polling data, paid for and collected by the Trump campaign for the purpose of targeting both negative and positive ads, was given to the Russians so they would know where and how to target to help Trump win.
Read the Mueller report, not the comical Barr version, but the actual Mueller report. It is a lot of reading, but it's better than ignorance.
So, you want to ignore facts in favor of "what makes more sense".
OR, you could just keep repeating yourself erroneously.....
We do have choices.
Nice to live in this country, isn't it?