The Texas shooting shows the futility of arming teachers

Mass shooters will just move to somewhere else lots of people congregate.
You can turn schools into Fort Knox but then you would have to do the same for theatres, malls, sportsgrounds etc.
So I agree with you that finding the root causes and spending the time and money and legislating to improve them is far more desirable.

Good luck on getting people to agree on the root causes though.

 

Yes, they will go to a state fair or an outdoor concert. School shootings are a special kind of horror show. The kids have to be there, and they haven't had a chance to enjoy life. Fortify the schools.

 

Yawn.
Guns don't kill people
People kill people....Using guns.

Or in your case give them AR15's

Nope, guns are especially good t killing people which is why most civilised countries limit their availability and therefore the number they kill.

What utter tosh.
How can you froth these purile arguments so soon after seeing your precious guns kill another 19 kids.

 

With the exception of the US, all other Western countries have solved the problem I would say at 90%.

Severe measures of gun control, policy of buying back semi-automatic guns, ban on certain types of guns....

The list is very long.

The argument that crazy shooters will find another way to kill is countered by the fact that the protection measures put in place everywhere in the US - and which are the highest in the world - never manage to protect the citizens.

And when it comes to gun ownership, a owner is 13 times more likely to commit suicide with his gun than to stop a criminal act.

 

How can you argue nonsense? Sounds like you think the shooting was the gun's idea, and the kid who did this had no idea his gun wanted to kill.
Take the kid out of the formula- and nothing would have happened. Take the gun out of the formula- and the rage that drove this kid to kill is fully intact, and he will find an alternative weapon.
IF you can think rationally, you absolutely know that is true. IF you have honor, you will admit it's true.

 

But those severe measures you spoke of, realistically, are not going to happen in the U.S.

Some lesser measures may be taken, but not as severe as what you are thinking of. Background checks for all firearms transfers, red flag laws, more resources devoted to the detection and prosecution of straw purchases, and perhaps a 5 year prohibition on firearms possession for misdemeanants, including crimes committed as a juvenile.

All of those would have no substantive effect on the 2nd Amendment rights of peaceful, law abiding citizens.

But all of that still has nothing to do with the underlying problems - the “why” of mass shootings. They used to be almost unheard of. So what changed? What can we as a society do to undo that? Those are the questions we should be asking ourselves … and answering and then acting on those answers.

 

Then you'll have to get used to the fact that thousands of innocent people - including children - are still being slaughtered.

The proliferation of guns allows madmen to arm themselves to kill dozens of innocent people.

Pretty simple.

 

So you would be solution only involves stripping millions of law-abiding Americans of their rights due to the actions of a tiny fraction of 1%.

Maybe we'll consider your opinion when we go on a Canadian forum and advocate that we start stripping your citizens of their rights even though we don't live there

 

WHY wasn’t it happening when I went to school (1960’s - 70’s)??

 

That's the question there will never give you a good answer to. Because that would involve investigating what motivates these people to do these things..... Getting to the rot in society that causes such a thing to begin with.

But no.... In their mind it's the guns fault....

So instead of asking the hard questions and finding answers they would rather strip American citizens hundreds of millions of them... Are there rights to self-defense and personal property over the actions of a tiny tiny fraction of 1% of people.

 

Guns save lives- IF you leave them in the right hands.. This is how it works:

May 28, 2022
A woman in West Virginia drew her gun and fatally shot a man Wednesday night who had begun firing an AR-15-style rifle into a crowd of dozens.
Charleston Police identified the man as 37-year-old Dennis Butler.
The people were attending a birthday and graduation party outside a Renaissance Circle apartment complex.
Butler had been at the apartment complex earlier in the evening in a vehicle and was warned to slow down because children were playing, according to authorities.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/west-virginia-woman-shoots-kills-man-fired-party

 

Your guns are more precious than your kids.

 

Prove it.

 

In this instance I am concerned with the mass murder of children in a primary school. Perhaps you could give me links to a couple of maniacs who have killed 19 kids and two teachers with a hammer? or even a rock.

They make a better defence weapon because they are so good at killing people. But loads of other countries have much lower murder rates than America because they don't have guns.
But lets be honest, it wouldn't matter how many school children were mass murdered because for you guns are better than kids.

More garbage. Take the gun out of the equation and you have an angry kid with no chance of beating two teachers and killing 19 kids, not to mention the 40 minute stand off with the armed police.
What utter crap you do spout.
Everyone knows guns are very effective at killing, if they weren't then hammers and baseball bats would be part of the 2nd amendment.

I will waste no more time on you at this sad time.

 

No one determines how many guns a person needs, that's the problem. You want loads of guns despite what you see them do on such a regular basis.
Nothing I can say could be more persuasive that gun laws need to be changed than the trauma you have just watched happen. If yet another mass murder of children only leaves you arguing over how many guns you need, then the cause is lost.
God bless America (please)

 

You will waste no time on points you can't win.
Deadliest school murder in American history was not done with a gun, but with a bomb. 1927, school in Bath, Michigan. Killed 44, wounded 58 more.
1990- man angry over an incident with a girl splashed gasoline over the only entrance to a nightclub in New York, and lit it up. Killed 87.
Deranged PEOPLE kill people. The often use guns. IF no guns are available... they turn to bombs and gasoline.
What they don't do is say- "Oh, crap. No gun handy, so I guess I'll just forget it..."

I'm all in favor of stopping school shootings and ALL violence. I'm not in favor of imposing regulations on the people who don't cause this, because that will not work- and you don't have to be too smart to figure that out. The common denominator is not the weapon- it's the deranged person. The more you blame anything else, the further you are away from a real solution.

Since you can't figure that out and you don't see it when it's clearly explained- why waste your time?
You will not change the reality, nor my mind.

 

If you think that's because you can have people arrested for expressing opinions you don't link, then you might need some time in a looney bin somewhere.

 

Then explain Australia and other country's please.

 

This is the garbage, and it's what people do not understand. In the United States of America, we are guaranteed the right to own firearms. For some reason, people who don't like that fact are trying to get AR-15s banned based on their appearance, not their functionality. AR-15s are only used for an unknown subset of 3% of all murders committed here on an annual basis. It's unknown because the FBI only breaks the category of firearms down to rifles and handguns, and ALL rifles, including the AR, which makes it some unknown subset of that 3%.

That means that even if you could succeed at banning them, AND manage to get the 15 to 30 million that are estimated to be in civilian hands somehow given or sold to the authorities, which is of course impossible, you'd only succeed at eliminating <3% of all homicides, which also assumes that would be shooters wouldn't choose some other rifle or a handgun or two. The largest school shooting ever happened with the use of 2 pistols, one of which was the lowest power firearm made by anyone.

My point: Banning future sales of AR-15s would change nothing, unless you think someone crazy enough to want to commit a mass shooting, in a school or elsewhere, either can't get a hold of one of the 30M+ that already exist, and decides if he can't get that particular weapon, and he's just going to cancel his plans altogether. I find that to be highly unlikely.

Remember, what an "assault rifle" is, is defined by cosmetics, not function. And any other semi-automatic weapon, whether it is a rifle or handgun, can get the same job done, especially when you're talking about shooting children.

 

Excellent I assume anyone in America can walk into a shop and buy a bomb? Choosing from a rack of hundreds of different bombs?
After all as you say bombs don't kill people, people kill people.
As for it being due to mental issues, America's homicide rate is 30 to 40 times European countries, are you putting this down to the fact you are all nuts?
Is this a genetic problem with Americans? Should we be warning the world you are all psycho?
Or is it because you all carry an easy killing machine?

 

Really Who'd have known.
The 2nd amendment was not handed down by god. It was written by man. It can be unwritten.

I don't care which gun you refer to. I don't even want them banned, just controlled and licenced.
But I know from previous conversations after your last kids massacre, You love guns more than kids. That's your choice, I just want you to be honest about it.
All the rest of the arguments are just excuses to keep them, any comparison between the US and the civilised world clearly demonstrates its GUNS, GUNS are the issue.
Just admit you love them more than children, I mean who wouldn't when you can love this baby.

 

Do it for the kids.... If it saves just one life...

I'm so sick of people trying to shame people into giving up their rights. Particularly those who don't even live here.

 

Which explains why London has experienced its worst teen homicide rate in history.... nearly 100% of which were people of color. What is weird is that London was 90% white as recently as 40 years and is less than 45% white now. Keep watching London's murder rate in the next decade and lets see if you can make some connections. It's murder rate will go completely off the chain and it won't have a thing to do with gun laws. Europe is headed to where America is. Europe will be low trust like America as their governments balkanize them with 3rd world immigration. Low trust societies always lead the world in murder.

 

You only have to compare gun deaths (per head) in the USA to gun deaths in the UK.
The disparity is astonishing even if you throw in as many ‘yeah buts’ as you like.
There are as many nutters in the UK (per head) as anywhere else, after all the population voted to leave the EU and have elected a neo fascist government.
Even in that context the UK is much lower in gun deaths than in the USA.
How is that explained away?

 

Ofcourse you are, you want to keep your guns. You love them so much.