If a state outlaws abortion abortion should a woman be able to travel to another state to have one?

Discussion in 'Opinion POLLS' started by Reasonablerob, Jun 24, 2022.

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If abortion is banned/restricted in a state should women be allowed to travel elsewhere to have one?

  1. Yes

    28 vote(s)
    90.3%
  2. No

    3 vote(s)
    9.7%
  3. Don't know

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    For me I would say overwhelmingly yes, the middle ground in this argument is that states should be allowed to ban or restrict abortion if they wish but to prevent them travelling to a more liberal state where it is allowed would be a serious bridge too far. If I were a liberal rather than try to fight the decision I would start arranging volunteer services to pay and transport those seeking abortions to where they can have one.
     
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  2. Hotdogr

    Hotdogr Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Absolutely yes.
     
  3. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think trying to prevent women from getting out of state abortions should be a pretty easy case for a suit based on interstate commerce laws and/or HIPPA laws. Trying to enforce abortion laws is going to be just as bad as trying to enforce gun and drug laws.

    Really we just need to stop banning **** across the board.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2022
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  4. Big Richard

    Big Richard Banned

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    Yes. If your state won’t let you kill baby’s then go to a state that allows baby killing.
     
  5. Matt84

    Matt84 Well-Known Member

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    Private school?
     
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  6. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What would stop her?
     
  7. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    I understood that some states have introduced laws to prosecute those who travel across state lines for abortion (and those that aid them?).
     
  8. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There is no way to enforce such laws.

    How do they know who is pregnant?
    How do they know it wasn't a miscarriage?


    The level of government resources would have to be massive to catch a few.
     
  9. lemmiwinx

    lemmiwinx Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The only problem with travelling to another state to terminate a pregnancy is the high cost of gasoline to power your automobile. Maybe Biden and his brain trust could do something about that. And don't tell us to buy an electric vehicle they're still kind of expensive.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2022
  10. Junkieturtle

    Junkieturtle Well-Known Member Donor

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    They could fashion those laws in the same way they fashioned the law in Texas that allowed you to sue someone who provided or helped facilitate an abortion. And enforcement doesn't even have to be active, they could simply wait for people to rat others out. If legislators in a state are fanatical enough to even try enacting laws to that effect, enforcement is not what they're worried about, they'll find a way.
     
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  11. MJ Davies

    MJ Davies Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely. And, every person that can't conceive or carry a pregnancy but thinks he has the right to infringe on her rights has to permit her to dictate what medical care he can and can't receive for no reason other than she said so.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2022
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  12. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That seems to be the way things are going. As if its not bad enough having big pharma running government, lets get more lawyers doing their work!
     
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  13. wist43

    wist43 Banned

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    I'm pro-life and voted yes. I'm a libertarian, and see both sides.

    On the one hand there is a legitimate argument to be made about "life". When does "life" begin, how do you define that??

    Reasonable people can disagree.

    On the other hand, a person should have primacy over their bodies and possessions. Here again, however, there is another "life" in play.

    Again, reasonable people can disagree.

    Both sides have legitimate arguments.
     
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  14. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Market "Abortion Holidays" for persons
    in a State where the procedure is illegal

    Bus or Train customer to a high quality
    hospital / over night clinic and return.


    Investors, message ;)


    Moi :oldman:




    TaxCanada.jpg
     
  15. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    Justice Kavanaugh suggests that a state cannot criminalize such behavior and I agree with him. There is no way a state can prosecute someone for traveling to say California or NY to abort a fetus when they reside in Mississippi or South Dakota
     
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  16. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Donor

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    At first, I had thought this might be your attempt at sophistry, because of how ridiculous a suggestion it was, that any state would have the right to limit the movements of any citizen, based not on their being investigated for having been involved in a crime, but due to the state's distrust of its own electorate, not to do something in another state, which would be counter to its own laws. State laws only apply within the jurisdiction of their borders. A state cannot expect to exert any influence over its citizens' behavior, when they are out of state. Whether that means smoking pot, or even murder. That is, if someone commits murder, out of their home state, otherwise unconnected to that state, it doesn't have the right to try him (or her, in this case) for the crime. The state wherein the murder occurred, is the state whose laws were violated, and which is the only state (excepting, in some cases, the Federal government) which can prosecute the alleged killer. It is only the extradition arrangements, among the states, which allow them to hold individuals, who are suspected, in other states, of having broken any laws.

    Therefore, your trying to act like this loophole, of any pregnant woman in a non- abortion state, simply being forced to travel to the nearest state, still offering abortion services-- which could mean, in some cases, requiring the crossing of numerous states (as well as traveling significant distances, through large states)-- for a basic healthcare need, was at all, a reasonable, "compromise," did not strike me as a sincere argument. In previous studies, most Americans would not have as little as $400, for an unexpected, emergency expense. You expect them to be able to travel hundreds of miles, have an abortion, and return, in time for dinner? What if there are other kids at home, with no one to watch them-- take 'em with? And what if the woman is unable to get an appointment which would allow the trip, w/out need of missing any work? The fact is that it is those poorest of women, who are the most likely to need avail themselves of abortion. Perhaps there is no money in the household, for birth control; or perhaps this birth control just failed, as most do, at least 1% of the time. In principle, at least, what you suggest, is somewhat of an analog to an attitude which would ignore anti-Semitic laws in Hitler's Germany, as long as Jews had the option to emigrate. (BTW, this is not the same thing as my saying that your attitude is tantamount to supporting Nazis, so please show that you understand that analogies can be between aspects of two situations, without equating the situations, overall.)

    Anyway, I then saw this post:

    So, now, I accept, that you had merely been misinformed.
     
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  17. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Donor

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    Oh boy, what a real stand-up guy, is that Justice Kavanaugh!

    I am, with that term, referring to the idea, of course, of his being a real joker.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2022
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  18. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    I think the guy is so much smarter than the twits who attack him. I don't know him personally, but one of my best college friends was his mentor at Yale Law. He's brilliant and was one of the best judges on the DC circuit
     
  19. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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    So the only people who will be prosecuted under abortion laws will be
    poor people ... which takes us right back to why the Supreme Court ruled the way it did in the original
    Roe v Wade decision ... holy crap, we never learn anything.
     
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  20. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    it is not an issue that should be federally decided. I realize that many on the left don't like the constitution and hate the concept of federalism. I don't think a state has a valid reason to ban abortion prior to viability nor in cases of rape, incest or medical situations where the life of the mother (or if the fetus is going to be dependent for its life) is at stake. That being said, I don't think the federal government is the place to do everything one wants.
     
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  21. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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    So we'll have a patchwork of abortion laws across the country.

    A rich woman in Texas simply takes a "vacation" to another state and never has to worry about prosecution.
    A poor woman uses a back ally doctor for an abortion and goes to jail.
    That's exactly what was happening in the 1950's and exactly why the Supreme Court ruled on Roe v Wade originally.
     
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  22. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Donor

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    So you say, but why should I put any stock in your opinion? Because you are so smart, & I am too dumb to trust my own opinions? BTW, it seems that you have missed the point of my post, which was being sarcastic about Kavanaugh making this incredibly lame suggestion, as if this was something which had either escaped the notice of simply everyone else, or which anyone might feel it was "big," of the Justice, to "allow," the option, of flight to another state. There was nothing about his statement which portrayed even a hint of the "brilliant."

    I also had watched some of his confirmation hearing, and was not impressed with anything that might have been mistaken for brilliance. As far as your saying that he "was one of the best judges on the DC Circuit (Court)," this has no more relevance, than if you were claiming that "Slayer," was one of the "best" bands, of their era. IOW, as you make no mention of being an accomplished, Constitutional lawyer, or at least scholar, yourself, your definition of "good," judgeship, would be expected to mean no more than, agreeing with your own opinion.

    So let me total that up, for you. Your praising of Kavanaugh's intellect, acumen, and sage wisdom, on the bench, boils down to your saying that his perspectives on many issues, jibe with your own. So, if I were to accept your word then, logically, I would also be accepting the notion that you would, yourself, probably make a decent addition to the Supreme Court.

    I don't.
     
  23. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    exactly :)
     
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  24. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Donor

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    Demonstrating, once more, how beyond your grasp, is even basic sarcasm.

    I guess you might fit in well, with, Brett "I like beer!" Kavanaugh, and Clarence, "Is that your pube, or mine?" Thomas.
     
  25. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    Your rants about Kavanaugh seem to be the product of a leftwing political agenda rather than grounded in any legal education or understanding of constitutional theory
     
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