THE UKRAINIAN ARMY HAS BEEN DEFEATED. WHAT’S LEFT IS MOP-UP

Are you trying to make an honest comparison of **** woke cancel culture (which we will naturally evolve out from) to what Russia and China have? Which is actual laws on the books that can punish you should you say the wrong thing against the government?

China has a government developed social credit score ffs.

And here you are thinking these two things are the same?

Good. ****ing. Grief.

And no. I'm not a neocon. I don't think Iraq or Afghanistan were great ideas and now more then ever America has to shore up foreign relations by helping countries to build and grow/foster trade and relations.

I just understand the chain of events that will happen or would have happened if you let Russia walk over Ukraine. And I don't want that world.

 

My point was, Russia will never allow itself to be destroyed without lashing out with first probably massive cyberattacks, then infrastructure like sea cables and satellites, and finally nuclear or biological weapons. The path the Biden administration is on, if successful, leads to this.

 

Russia is part of the West. Looking to the East for allies has always been a snare and a delusion for Russian tyrants.

 

Russia has incorporated Crimea into Russia. You might not accept that. The Biden administration might not accept that. But that doesn't change the fact that, to Russia, if you attack Crimea, you are attacking Russia. Their responses will be in congruence with that fact. Meaning what the Biden administration intends to do in Crimea is dangerous to me and my family.

 

That's not actually true. The problem with the way Russia is governed is that it opens itself to the possibility of governmental collapse. That's what happens when you have all authority and decision making filtered to the very top. The scary part is what happens should Russia governance collapse and turn into a power struggle.

 

Crimea's already been attacked.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...ilian-infrastructure-ukraine-says/ar-AA18TBeb

You may not accept that. Putin may not accept that. But that doesn't change the fact that Ukraine seems to have zero ****s as to what Russia has declared with regards to Crimea.

 

And that's the chaos the Biden administration wants to cause. In the event of that scenario, 2 things make it very scary:

1. I can tell from the little Russian media that I can see that much of Russia feels they are in an existential fight with the West, and the 100k Russian corpses have galvanized their hatred for us.

2. Without Putin's control, in a chaotic collapse, there could exist many Russian nuclear submarine captains, and other officers, who are capable of lashing out with the weapons under their control. This collapse won't be like 1991 in which the Russians were keen to allow Americans into their country to help secure all of the nuclear material. No one will be entering Russia to do that. Not after we just killed 100k of them...

It's a very dangerous goal.

 

Yes, their recklessness is my whole point. I'm just waiting for it to hurt me and my family.

 

Nonsense.

 

Nobody wants that chaos, but here's the other side of the coin.

If you let Putin walk over Ukraine, the Baltics are next. Because of COURSE the Baltics are next based off of geographical weakness that Russia has always historically shored up. Based on how Putin feels about the Baltics, it's people being Russian...feeling emboldened because the West just gave him Ukraine without a fart. Because he thinks the collapse of the Soviet Union was the 20th century's worst travesty. Because of a million other statements made by Putin which tells you what his goals are.

So then what? Does article 5 apply then? Do you think NATO allies would have confidence that America - who just let Ukraine get taken without any push back - is going to be all in on small ass Latvia? Does Germany or France have confidence in NATO to the point they commit to soldiers fighting and dying for small ass Latvia? No. They wouldn't. NATO would fall apart. And when NATO falls apart, Russia walks over all of Western Europe because of course they would.

Oh and China goes full bore into Taiwan and suddenly every single thing you buy that has a microchip suddenly skyrockets in price.

Putin started this dangerous path. All the stupid **** had to do was continue to foster trust, trade and culture with the rest of Europe through positive relations and instead they went full midget Hitler.

 

Yeah, right.

Your constant fear mongering reads like a Kremlin troll script. Muscovy has been fear mongering about nukes since they started this ****-show, and yet nothing so far. It's all intimidation, all manipulation in a desperate bid to get western countries to back off from supporting Ukraine.

 

Your narrative that Putin will keep rolling through the Baltics doesn't comport with what he has done.

In 2014, he could have taken at least half of Ukraine, and he did not.

In 2008, he flattened Grozny, and could have taken all of Georgia with no military to stop him, and he did not. Georgia is still independent, and speaking out against Russia.

This isn't 1938. We aren't going to allow Russia to gain a qualitative and quantitative advantage over our military within the next year. We can't just take Putin out without causing world devastation, like Chamberlain could have just taken Hitler out in 1938 without major consequence.

And if Biden did what I said, and put a few hundred thousand NATO soldiers in the Baltics, Poland, and Romania/Bulgaria, then there would be no way he would keep going.

 

Russia's territorial integrity will not be at risk unless it launches a nuclear attack.
Crimea is not part of Russia.

 

Actually, Putler himself claimed that his military wasn't ready yet in 2014 and that is why he did not have them go further then.

 

No he couldn't have taken Ukraine in 2014. Which is exactly why the men he denied having sent to Ukraine were UNMARKED. He wasn't in a position for that kind of invasion and he didn't want culpability on Russia should it have gone sour. But it went swimmingly. Barely a shot fired. And because of it's success, it emboldened him to go further.

In 2008 we absolutely did NOTHING with regards to Georgia and now Georgia is a vassal state of Russia. Russia owns 20 percent of it's land and has installed a puppet government. It's basically Belarus.

2008 led directly to 2014 which now has lead directly to 2022. And if you continued to have no reaction it would ABSOLUTLEY lead to further expansion. You are being incredibly naive and not listening to what Putin has been saying since he's been Russia's leader. Based on his own actions and his rhetoric, the Baltics are next.

Hell, he's already trying for Moldova right now. LOL.

 

What I might or might not 'accept is irrelevant to the ultimate outcome of this war. Same thing goes Biden (the US) and the rest of Ukraine's western allies. For that matter what either Putin or Zelenskyy might want or claim is also irrelevant. This is a war and in the end the final arbiter of who gets to hold what is decided by force of arms and not by mere claims to 'right' of possession. Nothing says either party will get all they want from this conflict. Instead what they'll get is what they manage to take or hold, by force end of story.

That aside your assuming (without providing any evidence) that the Biden Administration's ultimate stance is that Ukraine has the 'right' to retake Crimea and therefore must do so. I haven't seen one single statement made by the US and/or it's NATO allies that this is in fact the ultimate stance of the US and NATO. It might be Zelenskyy's publicly stated position but it's not the West's and it hasn't been since 2014 when Russia first occupied Crimea and parts of the Dombass. Yes there were 'words' and limited sanctions imposed on Russia at the time but importantly there was next to zero military action!

Instead America and it's allies only became directly involved in supporting Ukraine in it's the war effort once Putin decided via his invasion to 'liberate' the entirety of the country. In short if Russia hadn't decided to invade Ukraine 12 months ago we wouldn't even be having this debate. The territorial boundaries of Ukraine would have stood as they were in 2014 whether Zelenskyy liked it or not. But that is not the case now.

In short nothing and no-one (apart from Zelenskyy) says Ukraine can or must reconquer the entirety of its territory as it existed prior to 2014 before this war can end. What does appear to be essential however from a long term strategic perspective is that Ukraine manages to close the existing 'land bridge' linking Russia proper to the Crimea because failure to do so simply lets Russia preposition it's forces for a second invasion attempt at a later date.

In summery? If (and its a big 'if') Ukraine does manage to force Russia back to something approaching it's pre war 2014 starting positions in Crimea and the Dombass there's nothing that says the West will automatically provide ongoing military assistance to Ukraine in order to retake the rest of the country. Your merely assuming that's the case.

 

You realize mainland Russia has already taken hits during this conflict..... right? What was the response then? Where are the wunderwaffe bullshit weapons you people lie about having?
You realize that Crimea is Ukrainian territory Russia stole.... right?

 

Right? I cannot believe that people are so stupid they cannot understand that he's been doing this for years and isn't about to stop now if he JUST gets Ukraine.
As you have said, he's already making noises about Moldova that he made about Ukraine.

 

For sure. One thing that has become abundantly clear is that he can use nuclear blackmail to get just about anything out of the west. I'm sure there would be a foreign presence in Ukraine either preventing this invasion or defeating it now if it hadn't been for that.

 

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Never made any such comparison .. nor think is SCS -- Whats with the made up nonsense .. you are trying to attribute to my good nature..

I compared the "Woke Joke" to you mate .. Your the one with the Commie desires wanting to go down the path towards not "Social Credit" .. . (why are you claiming I mentioned this .. in some loopy fantasy fallacyland ) What you desire is to censor out ideas .. if you wish a comparison to the Chinese .. call it Commie Light - They like to censor out ideas as well ... and demonize those with views that deviate from the party line .. just like you paddy .. .. Mr "Tough Talk" .. Say to yourself like Arnod Arnod Swartzenegger..

Good grief is right .. ..

Of course your a neo con .. by definition I would say .. demonizing the anti war voice .. all night and all day... cancel that message, cancel that call .. cause the woke police .. there commin for y'all.

"I understand chain of events that will happen ... or would have happened if you let Russia walk over ukraine ... and I don't want that world"

Really .. and who made you prophet ..then tell us what would the world look like when we let Russia walk over Ukraine .. because that is what is going to happen. No way Ukraine is getting the 400 yr old port in Crimea .. Not happening .. and we go nuclear if Ukraine would ever get close to succeeding in taking Crimea .

So at some point the attrition rate of bodies will force Ukraine to the Table .. that and/or shortage of Ammo .. likely a combo of both ,, there will be negotiations .. Russia gaining at least Crimea .. not that they didn't have it prior to the Special OP

Tell us what happens from here out ... and why you don't want to live in that world .. how any different than current . other than a small change to the colors on the map .. tell us the horrible nightmare you envision .. after the walking over Ukraine.

 

Nukes are a complete non issue. Russia can't use them without destroying itself so MAD remains in effect. The reason the midget Putin keeps bringing up nukes is to distract people from the disasterous loses on the battlefield. Ukraine has killed almost 200,000 Russians now and he is sending rusted out hulks of T-54s because that is all he has left.

Worse, financially Russia is in a huge mess and there is nothing Putin can do to fix it so it will be off to the money printers with all the inflation that will entail.

 

In regards to 1., since you see little Russian media you can't see much and so make up and so in fact fabricate the rest of what you stated posing it as being the opinion of Russians.

In regards to 2, your posing Putin as being control of his military and able to control his underlings is no different than your belief Biden does the same. You create Goda of good and vil posing Putin as Jesus and Biden as Satan.

Its lame.

 

What has it gotten him lately D? It may have worked. I am not so sure anymore.

 

Would you least make an effort to research how much US and other NATO presence is there already

 

None as far as Ukraine. The border with Russia and Belarus will get 300,000 just to make sure Putler doesn't get funny ideas.