A very logical solution to reparations

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by logical1, Feb 21, 2021.

  1. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    So far, there is ONE wrong.

    And, heavy resistance to every single direction related to reducing that wrong.
     
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  2. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Holy mis-information Batman!

    They were only given money if they give it to their employees (trickle down!) Or pay rent/utilities.

    None of that money went in their pocket, and if it did it was a loan and must be repaid.

    Are you intentionally speaking non-sense or did you not know how this works?
     
  3. logical1

    logical1 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The police arrest people that commit crimes. They arrest people no matter what color they are.

    Dont want to be arrested, dont commit a crime.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2021
  4. Just A Man

    Just A Man Well-Known Member

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    Negative hoss. That wrong was corrected by Abe Lincoln 150 years ago.
    You got that right. Strange that some morons can't understand such a simple concept. But you can't fix stupid.
     
  5. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Wow is THAT ever total blatant BS.

    Lincoln made progress on slavery. He absolutely did NOT cause anything remotely similar to the equality declared as a fundamental right in our founding documents

    And, that equality is not present today. In fact, we just got through having a white supremacist PRESIDENT.

    Now, our major domestic terrorist problem is white supremacist violence against minority groups. And, our policing is disproportionately violent in ANY contact with civilians of minority groups.

    We had a white supremacist driven insurrection on Jan 6, where people died in defense of our country. Yet when officials forces showed up they didn't even bother to detain ONE SINGLE PERSON!!
     
  6. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    I would want to see where you came up with "trillions" as the current value of "40 acres and a mule" in today's dollars. I'm sure the actual amount is much less. Although there were about 4 million slaves by emancipation, the Freedman Bureau only gave them out per household (before they were reconfiscated again).

    But counting readlining and jim crow is a totally different animal. That's not slavery reparations and you shouldn't try to mix those.
     
  7. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    I'm not so sure that the objective here is limited to paying off people for work that can be proven to have been performed by their ancestors who weren't paid at the wages of that time.

    The problem we have today is cumulative and far larger than that.
     
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  8. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Well then you are talking about something totally different from slave reparations.
     
  9. Just A Man

    Just A Man Well-Known Member

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    Sure we have white supremist as well as black supremist. We have supremist in each and every race. It's a human flaw/trait. But majority of people in the USA don't believe it, don't practice it, or care about it.
     
  10. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    The thing is, the pay those slaves didn't get has set back each generation by some amount and the affect has not been limited to those who can trace their ancestry to some specific slave. It has meant that progeny were less likely to get a reasonable education or otherwise become a successful part of our economy. And, that just builds over time.

    Attempting to locate certain progeny and giving them a percentage of what their great great great great grandpa didn't get paid doesn't "repair" anything, nor is it even a representtion of the damage done.

    And, reparations is about"repair".
     
  11. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    No, you really need to get in touch on this subject.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:White_supremacist_groups_in_the_United_States

    Plus, the FBI identifies these groups as the source of domestic terrorism in the USA and a serious threat.
     
  12. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    "The thing is, the pay those slaves didn't get has set back each generation by some amount ..."


    No. Otherwise there would be no poor non whites in the US since they would have benefited from some generational wealth transfer. After all, during slavery those folks worked for wages or farming, selling their crops, so we would see everyone rich accept Blacks.

    Again, it's not reparations for slavery if you are not concerned about trying to "locate certain progeny and giving them a percentage of what their great great great great grandpa didn't get paid." That's literally what the whole reparations argument is about.

    If you just want to give Black people money, whether descendants of slaves or not, just say so.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2021
  13. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    I don't see any logic in that at all.

    We maintained African Americans in generational poverty by our failure to pay equal wages earned from the days of slavery to today. That poverty is desperately hard to escape even for white folks in poverty who don't face the racial hatred.
    You may be right that the general view of "reparations" is limited in that way.

    I'm not big on the money thing. I think there may be more important ways in which we can work toward ensuring both a step up and a more even platform for us all to deal with.

    That may include money. But, how much, what reason, what else is done, etc., are required in order to form what could actually cause repair.

    The damage that has been done since we became a nation is certainly not limited to those who today can trace family history to a slave who didn't get acreage or a mule.

    Here's an article pointing to communities in BOSTON where the MEDIAN NET WORTH of blacks there is $8. Not $8k. Not hourly wages. That is NET WORTH of EIGHT DOLLARS.

    Finding if a few of them who can trace their lineage to a slave and writing them a check is NOT a solution to the kind of problem we face. It's not a step of any kind.
     
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  14. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Dupe.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2021
  15. 9royhobbs

    9royhobbs Well-Known Member

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    It ain't bragging if you can back it up.
     
  16. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Well if that's the case, that just puts you back to a very old question of, "how do we raise up African Americans economically?" That's not exactly new and not really tied to reparations; it's more of the tiers of the civil rights movement.
     
  17. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    If someone is happy with the economic conditions of minorities today, then why would they even consider reparations? We don't arbitrarily sift through history to find injusticies to repay.

    The Korematsu decision resulted in the uncompesated taking of real estate and posessions of large numbers of Asians purely on the basis of race. Are you thinking that there should be reparations in THAT case? I don't believe for a second thats going to happen, even though we know their names what was taken and can identify many who remember going through that devestation. I personally know people who lived through that. But, we more or less accepted them back into our economy/society.

    I just don't see any evidence that there would be a reparations movement concerning promises to ex slaves if it weren't for the subsequent continued and purposeful economic devestation wrecked on blacks that continues to this day..

    If America had accepted blacks into our economy and society as well as, say, Korematsu victims, I just don't beleve we would be doing more than noting the catastrophic moral failure of our white supremacist forebears who treated human beings as animals.
     
  18. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Uh...you do know there actually were reparations for interned Japanese?
     
  19. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Woops - I sure was wrong on that one!

    I completely misremember that.

    Still, over 5,000 men were immediately arrested and relocated, leaving everything they owned behind. Plus there were another 110,000 forecefully removed to concentration camps, and with everyone knowing they were being removed they had no time nor was there a market to sell all their belongings, homes and farms before being removed. They were allowed to bring almost nothing with them.

    The idea that $20K made them whole again for losing all they owned and being confined by the military in hastily constructed concentration camps is ridiculous. Also, that was restricted to those who were citizens. Those not citizens (though legally here) received nothing - even though they were here legally. The US had long made it hard for Asians to get naturalized, though their labor was considered desireable. Some of those were actually deported.

    Still, that was a bad example, but I don't see my argument falling apart because I picked an invalid comparison.


    It's also interesting that the heinous Korematsu SC ruling STILL STANDS.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2021
  20. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Well I agree with the decision not to compensate non citizens. It's a common wartime practice to intern citizens of hostile powers. We did it to some Germans and Italians on the East Coast too. If you are a foreign national in a country which is at war with your home country, you should expect to be interned until the war is over.

    You can argue that the reparations were not enough, but really, people lost years of their lives so you really are never going to be made whole from that. At least they got something and more importantly, they got an acknowledgment that they were done an injustice.
     
  21. Cybred

    Cybred Well-Known Member

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    n501hhrjr0rz.png
     
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  22. Cybred

    Cybred Well-Known Member

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    This is fixing a wrong.
     
  23. Cybred

    Cybred Well-Known Member

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    Well there's also things like this.

    Tulsa race massacre - Wikipedia
     
  24. nra37922

    nra37922 Well-Known Member

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    How about NO REPARATIONS WITHOUT REPATRIATION. Lincoln's plan was to ship them all back to Africa.
     
  25. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Most of the non-citizens were those who had permanent residency status. Plus others included those here from countries not involved in the war - like Peru.

    But, the real issue in the thread has to do with reparations for slavery, which is a situation with some VERY different factors.
     

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