Black lives matter in Europe too!

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by LafayetteBis, Jun 14, 2020.

  1. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    A LESSON FOR THE U.S. FROM EUROPE ABOUT SLAVERY

    Oh, really? Then why is this happening: As I see on French TV, the signs Black Lives Matter (in English) on footage from demonstrations in both the US and France. (Yes, France has black citizens! But not in the same proportion as the US.)

    Why? Because the same phenomenon is happening in both the US and Europe (only to lesser degrees because blacks are a smaller proportion of the population.That is, black-lives come in second in Europe as well. And Arab-lives come in third.

    Slavery started in Europe a long, long time ago. The losers in battles between countries became "slaves" for the rest of their lives.

    The black slave-trade started in the 1400s when they were brought from Africa to Europe to be sold. But slaves had existed in Europe since before Christ. If a male was fighting a battle for anybody and they lost it, those captured by the winner became slaves for the rest of their lives. As did the females from those cities captured. (And if they tried to escape, they were slaughtered as a lesson to the others. The effective "worker" in Rome for construction were slaves, not free-Romans. (Let's try to remember that when visiting the vestiges of the Ancient Rome Empire - because your guide will not be dwelling upon that particular part of Roman history!)

    Like most, I thought all the blacks that I was seeing in France came in the recent past from the ex-French colonies in black-Africa. Well, yes, many but not all. There's been blacks in Europe who have lived here since the 15th/16th century. (See history here.) There were also slaves here "bought" by rich Spanish families in Valencia, which was the major European slave-trade port into which they were brought from Africa. Most were sold all over Europe, but mostly the southern European-states.

    Then, with the evolution of farming in the American colony, the slave-trade moved west from Africa to the southern US states farms. The north refused to employ them, which inevitably led to the Civil War in the 1860s, which the South lost to the North and the slaves were "supposedly freed". The smarter one moved north, the southern ones were treated "differently".

    Europe employed black-slaves a good many centuries ago. However, African-original slaves are not a major part of any European population. The movement of North African Muslims was more prevalent than blacks (I would say) amongst the hodgepodge that Europe has become - just like America! Many African slaves bred with whites and thus their children "became white". Most bred within their ethnic group - just like in the US - at first, but further generations have tended to mix in Europe.

    Which has known what to do with them better than the US - where many have remained in city-ghettos. Any such "ghetto" where blacks or Arabs were dominant in Europe are slowly disintegrating as free tertiary-level education has given them the ability for higher pay-scales and thus to move out of the poorer sections of large cities.

    THAT IS WHAT AMERICA MUST DO: Educate its poor out of comparative poverty ... !
     
  2. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Just do what the Europeans did with their jewish ex slaves.
    Encourage them to move to the middle east and take over a country of their own.
     
  3. Boosewell

    Boosewell Banned

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  4. gnoib

    gnoib Well-Known Member

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  5. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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  6. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    Europe and Canada allowed in tons of migrants from Africa. Now they are reeling a little bit, and will permanently be dealing with the same types of problems and social issues that the US has been dealing with for a long time.

    One almost has to question whether it was worth it.
     
  7. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Last edited: Jun 24, 2020
  8. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    THE POVERTY-THRESHOLD IN AMERICA

    Not just after WW2 they didn't. The phenomenon was recent, and I remember coming to France in the 1980s where most of the migrants were North Afrian muslims. They have since been integrated fully (their sons/daughters, that is) into France and there is no distinction visible between them and the native French-families.

    Yes, indeed, Canada allowed tons of Europeans to migrate as well after WW2. Between January 1946 and December 31, 1953 over 750,000 immigrants came to Canada.

    Given the circumstances at the time, it was the right thing to do. Did it hurt Canada. No, because it needed the manpower in a postwar then still largely Industrial Age..

    My Point:
    *We are changing ages. The Industrial Age (manpower driven) has moved to the southeast of Asia.
    *We are in the Information Age, which requires far more intelligence in manpower. So must enhance the throughput of our children into postsecondary degrees.
    *So it should not cost $14K a year to get through a state-school! Especially when the DoD is gobbling up $750B per year! That's half the entire National Discretionary Budget! (See here.)
    *And we have a $14K/year cost-barrier for the poorest kids to attend post-secondary schooling. So far too many don't!

    The Poverty Threshold for a family-of-four in the US is an income of $25K a year. How can we expect those families to send their kids into post-secondary education and thus lift themselves out of poverty? How? Huh? How?
     
  9. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Post Scriptum: Somebody please explain why should we be allowing Indians with post-secondary degrees (which tuition was free, gratis and for nothing in India) to take the jobs of American kids who cannot get into a post-secondary program because they don't have the financial means to do so?

    That's pure idiocy ... !
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2020
  10. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And blather is doing well on this blog!

    I've lived in the UK. Evidently, you haven't.

    As regards the UK alone, here is:
    READ the article and get informed before pissing into a "Forum" ...
     
  11. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    If there's no distinction, then why do we see Black lives matter demonstrations going on there?

    I thought this was an issue that was only going on in America? Yes/No?
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2020
  12. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No doubt, the slave-trade was a great necessity for the US southern-states orientated towards farming. But, also, the fact that the northern states had a great many English-born migrants coming to America who settled in the north - and slavery in England had been abolished in 1809. (And I am sure this had an impact upon the matter that was being debated in the states between the North and the South even before 1809.)

    In fact, slavery did not functionally exist in much of England towards the end of the 18th century. But it was flourishing in the some English colonies. Namely the US-south but not the north of America, and on the islands off the coast of Central America. Which, by the beginning of the 19th century the UK and France had mostly abandoned.

    The US southern-states remained very needy of African slavery for their agricultural farming (cotton, tobacco, sugarcane, etc.). Despite the fact that the Industrial Age was also well-introduced in the South but perhaps to a lesser degree than in the North.

    Perhaps also it was due to the sheer numbers of black-slaves that were introduced (then freed) in the South, but whatever the reason, blacks having been sent to Europe (rather than the US) became integrated into the larger community.

    Here nonetheless is the historical reference to slavery in Europe. Note that Black Slavery is addressed in its own chapter titled Modern Era ...
     
  13. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Because the phrase made such a hit on TV in Europe during the coverage here of recent-past demonstrations in the US.

    On every bit of coverage of marches here in France - and they are almost daily somewhere - I see that phrase on signs in English. Along with others in French.

    As well, and it is significant, most of these marches are young-adults. The elderly don't march (for this matter) but they generally agree with the kids regarding what's happening in the US ...
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2020
  14. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    Huh? That makes no sense at all. Why would people in Europe care about something that's happening in the US?
     
  15. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Because they do care! Period!

    Europe does not treat blacks the way they do in the US and particularly the south. Over the years that I have lived here, I see far more educated blacks, who are simply the children of those migrants who have been here already since quite some time. (Said migrants are still infiltrating, but given the economic situation far, far fewer will ever be given European nationalities*.)

    But the facts that far too many blacks do NOT go on to a postsecondary education in the US (but they do in Europe) simply means (here in Europe) that when they speak on TV they do so very eloquently. Meaning that acceptance is far more readily as a consequence.

    The English-language is another factor that has become an international matter. It is today the de facto dominant language of human exchange. More in some countries, less in others.

    *And they are not only black, but Arab and Russian that infiltrate into Europe seeking work. They are taken care of (accommodations/food, so that they don't start stealing) but inevitably ( they go back when it becomes obvious that working in Europe for them is futile. Europe has very high rates of unemployment at the moment and citizens are first-employed.

    If a black is caught working without a work-permit in Europe, s/he gets a quick-flight home ...
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2020
  16. gnoib

    gnoib Well-Known Member

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    Why don't you open the link and try to read it and than inform yourself, before pissing into a Forum.
     
  17. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Europes track record on slavery is far worse than America's.

    It ended in 1945 and it was perpetrated against whites not blacks.
     
  18. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    Who is actually saying that Black lives don't matter?

    What is this "Black lives matter" thing actually all about? Eradicating white supremacy....seriously....what does that actually mean. There are a bunch of nutters around with skinheads and swastikas tattooed to the fronts of their faces but does that mean we're all fukced in the head because there's a small bunch of sub-normal wankers in the world that think they're God's gift....seriously...that's what they think? These tossers represent all "white" folk in the world???

    And as for inflicting violence on black communities buy whom....bands of roving white supremacists....or police....or are the two synonymous in the Black Lives matter world view...?
    Is it their view that all whites are racists and all police are racists...??

    Who is saying that Black Lives don't actually matter??
     
  19. gnoib

    gnoib Well-Known Member

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    If you had read the article I posted and were familiar with the football scene especially in the UK, than you would understand, which you aparently don't.
     
  20. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    Oh please, that's not believable at all.

    Where are the Chinese people complaining about George Floyd?

    Why aren't people in Europe concerning themselves with what's going on in Brazil?
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2020
  21. Bjorn

    Bjorn Active Member

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    Because of the cultural Americanization of Europe. Since at least the end of WW2, American culture, American English loan words, American products, and American music, television and movies have swarmed Europe. I grew up with television stations where more than half of the programming was American TV shows, series and movies, and my native language isn't English. The mark you've left on the world post WW2 is significant, culturally speaking. America feels... "closer" one might say, to a North and Western European, than whatever's going on in Brazil. No major power in the history of the world has had the cultural impact America has had on the world - and alot of that simply has to do with the age we live in. Culture travels fast these days, after all.

    And the Chinese certainly are complaining about George Floyd. Communist state media is focusing hard on that, which just takes focus away from how badly they'd been treating Africans living in Ganzhou, I believe the city was called. They're also using it to dismiss the US criticism about Hong Kong protests, saying "Well, you club protestors too!". Gotta love totalitarian whataboutism. Hasn't changed a bit since the Soviet days.

    It really makes no sense that Americans are so unaware of the cultural, both pop-cultural and generally cultural, impact they've had on particularly Europe for generations now. It's not excatly new, neither the specific cultural fascination with the US, nor the general historical tendency of mimicking the behaviors and trends of the most powerful and prestigious.
     
  22. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    Yes, I've certainly noticed this too. Except a lot of the "culture" that has been exported to Europe comes from New York City.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2020
  23. Bjorn

    Bjorn Active Member

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    Can't say, but certainly from Hollywood. NYC is certainly a favorite shopping destination in travel agency ads, though, so you might be correct. However, social media has spread both the progressive SJWism, as well as its Pepe/kekistan/alt-right nonsense to Europe as well. As if we didn't have our versions of that. Back in my day, you could tell a Nazi by his bald head, red tie and white shirt. Now they're long haired, bearded skinny men wearing t shirts with obscure meme references. Things in Europe were easier in the old days before the interwebz..
     
  24. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That depends upon the country. The northern European countries did not have the same level of fighting in WW2 as did the more southern nations. After all, the "Allies" landed on the French coast and fought their way inwards - and to this day that historical fact is celebrated in the place where the landing of forces occurred in Normandy.
    [​IMG]

    Postwar, the northern peoples did go on an American-binge - but let's not forget that they were a primary source of immigration to America and Canada since a long, long time. Much fewer French, Spanish, etc had migrated. Some French migrated to their colonies, such as the French Canadians - but in Nouvel Orléans (named after the French town Orléans) where only English is now spoken. Excerpt for the Cajuns - that is , those French who migrated from Arcadia in Canada to the place that they baptized Nouvel Orléans.

    Mimicking American values is old had largely because American films were early-on the most popular in much of Europe - of coursed dubbed into the local language. That is what gave Europeans the idea that America was living better than them - and this was well before WW2. But most certainly after WW2 also when the Europeans were facing massive-devastation, particularly in Germany that the Brits/Yanks bombed very, very heavily.

    Given WW2 why not mimic the winner, the conqueror. It had already done that once before when the Roman Empire spread its wings, and for nearly 5 centuries the people conquered were speaking Latin. And to a great extent Latin-language offshoots are still the predominant language in France, Spain, Portugal and Italy. (English has become the second-most popular language not only due to WW2 but because in business it is a popular inter-communal language.

    Having said all that, it's worthwhile to considering the evolution of the European Union vis-a-vis the US. Europe is a far better place to live principally due to some very acute necessities that have become Central Government Programs: A damn fine and low-cost National Healthcare System, a Free Tertiary Education and subsidized basic human necessities by governments (like housing).

    In general, we live better in Europe than Americans do in the US ...

    PS: And why? Because Europe does not waste tax-revenues on "Defense" one-tenth of what the US does. I will remind my Fellow Yanks, that no country is about to invade the US. It's too good a market for their exports ... !

    PPS: There are many ways to contrast the differences between the US and Europe standards-of-living. They are all pertinent to the question, "Who lives better?" So, I suggest you google the question, "Who lives better Europeans or Americans?" See what comes up! It is very interesting. And, expect no definitive answer to the question. Because there is none.
     
  25. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Black Lives Matter is most certainly not supported by politicians in power in the UK. Starmer made clear some days ago that he does not support them. As far as protests are concerned you have the fact that the Government is hoping to give any who do any kind of vandalism on any statue, ten years in jail - following Trump of course, it looks like the UK is following the US into a Police State.

    .................and then while on the subject we have the fact that 2 young black women were murdered in the UK and the police did nothing to look for them. They were found by a search by family and friends - possibly the boyfriend of one when they went out to search as the police were not. When the Police eventually got involved they took selfies of themselves with the dead bodies

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-53198702
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2020

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