Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Gorn Captain, Jan 17, 2014.
That is so much nonsense. You offer nothing just like the GOP does.
Really? After years!?! After the revamp of healthcare. After the democratic plan is in place, up, and running.
Now they want to make suggestions?
Absolutely useless. They didn't try to work out a bipartican plan before. They didn't try to work out a bipartisan plan during. They now years later, after its all voted on, in place, and running. Now they want to try to give suggestions.
Absolutely useless idiocy. To damn late and the american people agree.
I want to repeal ObamaCare before it destroys the private health system in America.
Which may already be too late but we have to try.
Libs may have the last laugh anyway because Boehner is such a fool that his alternative may not be something I can support either.
We'll just have to wait and see.
But there is no question that repealing ObamaCare and returning to the old system is still better than the piece of crap that the democrats gave us.
Coming up with an alternative before there is any chance of working towards its implementation would have just given the left more time to attack it. History has shown that the left does not treat Republican health care policies any better than the right has treated Democrat's policies. For example, back when Nixon tried to pass a form of single payer (things sure have changed a lot since then) Ted Kennedy led a Democratic filibuster against the legislation. He later admitted it was a purely partisan move and that the Democrats had just not wanted the Republicans to take credit for a possible solution. It makes perfect sense for the Republicans to have waited until Obamacare is imploding on its own to offer up an alternative.
There will be no repeal.
And the American people see this for what it is, absolutely nothing.
They are years to late for there to be any meaningful gain or even debate.
Now it's simple a few years to late.
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Bull feces. They could have put forward meaningful suggestions and input during the crafting of the ACA.
They did nothing but attack it while not putting forth meaningful legislation of their own.
You are quite naive, the Democrats passed Obamacare without a single Republican vote because they had the 60 votes needed to do so on their own, not because the Republicans had offered no feedback on the bill. The Dems had no interest in making it a bipartisan bill because they had no need to make it bipartisan in order to pass it. Why share the credit with the "bad guys" when you can have 100% of the glory to yourself?
As is typical of leftists, after they fail, they blame someone else instead of taking responsibility for something they had complete control over.
What failure? Hundreds of thousands of people now covered under insurance where as before they could not get any.
Now the reps are trying to interject with their own ploy for glory because they see that it's gained dems voters.
Keep trying. The GOP hada. Chance to present a plan. They failed to do so, for years. To little to late and the american people see that.
If I were a Liberal I wouldn't be too worried. Boehner & Co will change a few words and twist a few meanings to end up with the same thing as Obamacare. And Boehner & Co will side with Democrats to get it past the Tea Party anyway.
Leftists on this forum are getting pretty shrill, I wonder if that is a sign of things to come or if it's just limited to this forum. Bush is not still relevant (from another thread) and with public support for the ACA hovering around 40% even though it's clear that the Obama administration doesn't dare reveal the real numbers to us, the bill can't honestly be described as a success at this stage in any possible way.
Conservatives have offered sensible healthcare reforms.
Medical savings accounts.
Allowing insurance to be sold across state lines.
These changes would all help lower the cost of healthcare.
The problem is none of those ideas pay for those liberals stuff. You are just wanting to make them responsible for theirselves which is not the way the left thinks.
They will have to pass it before they know.......
Works best for younger, relatively wealthy people. A number of studies have found that people on these plans tend to not get preventive care, check ups, immunizations, etc. because of the up front cost. Most people living from paycheck to paycheck have a very difficult time saving any money.
Texas implemented very strict tort reform over ten years ago, it has not brought down the cost of health insurance or health care in that state compared to surrounding states, and Texas still has the highest rate of uninsured in the nation.
as I explained in another post in this thread
If you purchase a plan from say Wyoming, and live in PA, and you have a dispute with your insurer, do you have to hire an attorney from Wyoming to deal with Wyoming's Insurance Commissioner? Do you have to travel to Wyoming yourself?. How will you file your complaint? Or will there have to be a Federal Insurance Commission to handle interstate complaints.
Another issue, why wouldn't insurance companies flock to states with the fewest regulations and protections for consumers, the ones that make it the most difficult for consumers to appeal insurance company decisions. We saw that effect when we allowed credit card companies and banks to market their credit cards across state lines, the vast majority of banks and credit card companies, incorporated in the three states with the fewest regulations and the fewest consumer protections, Delaware, N.Dakota and N. Carolina. Almost all credit cards are issued from those three states, and to get those cards you sign away most of your legal rights, in case of a dispute with the credit card company, they get to choose the arbitrator, the arbitration takes place in one of those three states, the full burden of proof is on the consumer to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that the error is on the part of the lender. The consumer has almost no chance of success when challenging the lender. We can expect to see the same thing with health insurance across state lines.
Given the history of the GOP over the last five years, I don't expect them to offer any sort of real plan at all.
They won't want to propose anything that they might be held responsible for.
What we'll get is a collection of unworkable gimmicks wrapped up and called a plan.
That has been the GOP pattern since the end of teh Bush era.
And that has been the problem with our Government for sometime. You elect these Reps and just what the hell do they do? They don't write tchhe bill
and it seems like there is no input. Just a bunch of stooges.
You act like it's never been done before. Newsflash: Car insurance is already sold over state lines. To answer your questions, they are all simple. Everything is done in the state that the insured lives in. People insure over state lines by a licence in that state. Nobody cares if the home office is in Colorado. If your insurance is in Louisiana, and you live in Louisiana, everything is done through Louisiana. FYI: I have a college degree in insurance and risk management.
You may want to tell that to the auto insurance industry.
Leftists? Have you seen some of the hateful propaganda on this site from the right wing posters?
Don't make me laugh.
And go back to the system that was destroying the American economy.
What did you try in 2005 or 1995 or 1985?
You do know that much of the 2008 election was about fixing the health care system. The majority of Americans were saying that "old system" was bad.
The only time people want to step in is after the Democrats try to fix something and the only thing you offer is to go back to the original problem.
Auto insurance companies are under the regulations of the state they operate in. For example, the requirements for a policy to be sold in DE are different than they are for a policy in MD. Auto policies that are offered in other states cannot be legally sold in DE if they don't meet Delaware regulations. Many insurance companies do not sell auto or property insurance in DE, because they don't want to abide by DE regulations.
What the proposals to sell health care across state lines want to do is prevent the local state from regulating what has to be covered under the policy and have them operate under the regulations of the originating state. No state insurance commission is going to be willing to have their staffs enforce 50 states different sets of regulations depending on which state the insurance was issued from. That's just insane. and that is not the way auto or property insurance is handled.
ObamaCare is a welfare program for deadbeat libs.
Oh, you mean the same way that the GOP is doing now. It is harder to propose a plan if you start out knowing that it will not work but it might stop the other guy's plan. You are admitting that right now.
Yep, Ted did admit that and I lobbied to try to change Ted's mind. Democrats do admit on occassion that it was political but the GOP doesn't.
ACA is not imploding but the right hopes it will. ACA has flaws so we should try to improve it. The GOP thinks that going back to the original problem of screwing people out of health care - is a good idea.
And just by saying that ACA "is imploding" shows that you are with the GOP.
You are quite naive. Baucus tried desperately to modify what the Democrats wanted by getting the GOP to back his proposals. They only used Baucus to delay the final product. And still says nothing about why the GOP didn't act when they were in power.
Every mark up of the bill had Republicans in the room. If they had something better, they should have got media attention on their "alternative".
Don't worry. Leftist will take complete credit for ACA and will push to make it better. Obstruction is the GOP only tool today.
Just because there are differences in rates between states, it doesn't mean that those differences wouldn't exist if they allowed insurance to be sold across state lines. I'm in Massachusetts where insurance is relatively high, because we have a huge medical infrastructure, 4 of the top ten hospitals in America are in Boston, as well as many leading medical schools and teaching hospitals, so health care costs more than it does in a state with few facilities, because people die there, rather than getting the level of care they would get in Boston or NYC and that saves a lot of money. But if I bought a policy from North Dakota, and it was a HMO or a PPO type policy, then my primary care physician would be in Bismarck, and anything and everything I actually needed would be out of network, and a lot of it wouldn't be covered, because I'd need a referral from my primary, who I would never see.
I had the option to buy a policy at work that covered me anywhere in the world, and covered every doctor in the world, $25 co-pay, that was $2500/mo, I opted for $600/mo to get the HMO, $20 copay, no deductible in network. Now the network is all in Massachusetts, and I am covered for emergency care anywhere in the world, but if I decide I want to see a doctor in Switzerland or New Jersey, it's going to cost me, because it's out of network.
So what you'd be able to buy is that expensive kind of policy, or the same HMO or PPO plan that you buy now.
Tort reform, that's been done in Texas, we don't have to speculate, we have real data, it didn't make any difference, that's what really happened.
Medical Savings Accounts? That works for the wealthy, but in a selective way that undermines the rate structure, and would increase the cost to most people.
What the GOP is going to come out with is what they have come out with in the past.
A single sheet of paper, double spaced, large font.
with a half dozen platitudes like
"1. Harness the power of the market place to drive down costs"
With "Repeal ObamaCare" being the only specific action item on the list.
Like they have always done before.
Sez the libs looking for a new government freebie.
My healthcare was affordable and highly satisfactory before ObamaCare as it was for most people in America.
This was just a power grab by the usual big government suspects.
Separate names with a comma.