CAN WE GET RID OF THE ELECTORAL COLLEGE

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by LafayetteBis, Dec 3, 2020.

  1. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    Nope.
    Trump could appoint Supreme Court justices. He also appointed a lot of conservative judges around the country. Biden won’t have this luxury, as the senate is in opposition. If senators really wanted to screw things up for Biden, they could block Bidens nominations to his own cabinet and he would be a president with tiny government that gets to ride through only by using recess appointments.
     
  2. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trump is history. Bad history ...
     
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  3. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

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    True but how long will it take to fumigate the stench of Trumpism out of the our government, restore democracy to our republic and restore sanity to our Republican Party?
     
  4. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    I don't red bait. As a democrat, I get red baited on a daily basis.
     
  5. HurricaneDitka

    HurricaneDitka Well-Known Member

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    They could go further than that and refuse to recess, so that Biden doesn't get the chance to recess-appoint anyone either.

    https://www.scotusblog.com/2014/06/court-strikes-down-recess-appointments-in-plain-english/
     
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  6. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What the states WANT is decided by the law that describes a political process. The American voter of today is not the student taught 20-years ago a proper course in Civics.

    Civics is more than a set of ideas related to governance. It is more so a duty of paramount importance regarding both the law and those who make the law and oversee it. From here: Voter Turnout in the United States:
    2008 - 57.1%
    2012 - 54.9%
    2016 - 59.2%
    2020 - 66.4% to 72.1%

    In Europe, it is even lower - 50.66%, which some say is low because the new Eastern (once Communist) countries simply havent learned the process yet.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  7. Curious Always

    Curious Always Well-Known Member Donor

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    I know how it works.

    Wyoming gets 1/2 %. That's as little as they can get.

    PEOPLE do not vote for president. You never never voted for president. Your state LETS you tell them your preference. They don't have to ask. States vote for president.
     
  8. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The Electoral College is the most detailed and extensive part of the U.S. Constitution for a reason. Without it, there would have been no U.S.A. If we get rid of it.... the U.S.A. will break up.
     
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  9. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    It serves no relevant function and never did. It was a device to avoid runoff elections in what was thought to be a true multiparty system and a sop thrown to slaveholding states so they would ratify the Constitution. Once we started using Parties, which most of the Founding Fathers had been against, there was no further need for the Electoral College. Right now its only function has been to enable Republicans to steal elections they can't get enough popular support to carry.

    This whole dispute does nothing but shows how much Republicans hate democracy. They truly believe that it's like asking cattle how they want to be herded or pigs when they should be slaughtered. We non-rich are like beasts in the field to them, and I constantly wonder how much longer we will continue to let them get away with it. As Lincoln said, "God must truly have loved the poor, he made so many of them"
     
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  10. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    If it ever gives us another Trump it might break up right there. The States electing it wouldn't have to secede, we'd throw them out.

    The USA hasn't had this topsy-turvy loser winning bs but 5 times and each time was a disaster. It makes no sense whatsoever, silly arguments where 50 States elect Presidents over 300 million PEOPLE notwithstanding.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  11. HurricaneDitka

    HurricaneDitka Well-Known Member

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    There's not a mechanism to do that, and you don't have the votes to create such a mechanism.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  12. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Given the proper circumstances and they could and would be found.
     
  13. HurricaneDitka

    HurricaneDitka Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like November 2020 all over again. :wink:
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  14. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    When you say "we", that phase means yourself included.

    Aren't you not even American?
     
  15. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Its almost like people don't understand how our government balances power through mechanisms like the EC.

    Another example of public school failure, in this case 6th grade civics.
     
  16. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The left LOVES the idea of controlling other people.

    The EC is just another hurdle in the way of that desire. Placed there for this exact reason. The founders would think you agenda needs safeguards, and thankfully they were smart enough to build them in.
     
  17. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yup.

    Exactly how intended.
     
  18. perotista

    perotista Well-Known Member Donor

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    So far that has been purely a blue state initiative. Now any state legislature can vote to join it, when and if that state legislature changes stripes, it can also vote to leave it. There's nothing binding about it that can't be changed by any state legislature.

    Also, I'm sure it will last as long as it is a Republican winning the electoral college while losing the popular vote. The first time it becomes apparent that a Democrat would win the electoral college while losing the popular vote, the compact is history, gone, done with. If you think a blue state, California or New York for example after voting for the Democratic candidate probably 60-40 or more are going to cast their electoral votes for the Republican Candidate just because he won the popular vote, but lost the electoral college, you're crazy as a bat or very political naive. It just ain't gonna happen.

    Then how do you think the voters of a state in your compact will feel, act, if their vote is canceled out because of the compact after voting for the candidate they wanted their state to win and succeeded in so doing?

    I think this is nothing more than a knee jerk reaction to 2016 without thinking it thoroughly through. As long as it is the Democrat winning the popular vote, you're fine. But just let a Republican win the national popular vote, then you'll see.
     
  19. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    ehem...how many of the GOP voted in the House to decriminalize marijuana?

    5?????
     
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  20. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm going to point out that that's not such a great argument, since the US is trapped in a two-party system, a point many political theorists have complained about.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  21. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Republicans allege that the other side may not actually indeed have the level of popular support they claim.

    That the popular vote totals are fraudulent, even if the outcome of who won each state (and thus the ultimate election outcome) are not.

    If you start having elections based on nation-wide popular vote, you are going to have to prove that your state elections are indeed secure, and most Republicans states are never going to be willing to tolerate things like mail-in ballots and no verification.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  22. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm a Liberal Democrat, and definitely see the value of the Electoral College.

    if we just go by Popular vote and say have 4 candidates, the guy with the most vote wins.

    that means some Fascist ******* can win the Presidency with only 35% of the vote.

    unless we would then do a run-off with two winning candidates, but they still might be scumbags as the vote was soo scattered

    Electoral College also allows an emergency rejection of a candidate if he say commits murder before the Electoral College votes, or it turns out he's a drug dealer or whatever.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  23. undertheice

    undertheice Well-Known Member

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    therein lies the problem. these fools who would have us revert to mob rule would also have us embrace a massive centralized government. they have already minimized local and state sovereignty and now seem to think that those areas with the most concentrated population should be allowed to tell everyone else what to do. personally, i wouldn't mind getting rid of the electoral college, but only if the influence of the federal government were drastically reduced. of course, these authoritarians will never go for that. they seem to think that only an all-powerful federal government can cope with modern problems. they seem to have forgotten that this nation was set up as a federation of independent states, guided by an over-all constitution that was to be enforced and protected by the federal government. what they want is that single party state that tells everyone, no matter their circumstances, how to live their lives. they want this as long as that centralized authority agrees with their own philosophy. as soon as the feds alter their philosophy these short-sighted fools will change their tune.

    the problem with what progressivism has become is that these fools have no sense of history. they seem to think themselves enlightened, that they are on the leading edge of social progress. the reality is that they are nearly a century behind the times. governmental control of the private sector? hitler tried it eighty years ago and history has consigned him to the dustbin. governmental ownership of the private sector? the the soviets, the chinese and myriad smaller, less fortunate nations have tried it and the result has always been disastrous. germany might well be an unstoppable powerhouse if only the the single party nazi state hadn't decided to try and take over the world. if the single party state headed by stalin had used the carrot instead of the stick when dealing with their satellite states, russia might well be the center of economic progress. if mao's single party state had allowed the chinese provinces some autonomy, then china wouldn't have had to base its rise on slavery and theft.

    is anyone starting to see a trend here? it isn't conspiracy theory, it's simply human nature. the accumulation of power in one point will lead to the rise of authoritarian excess. the fact that the federal government has become ever more powerful only means we need things like the electoral college more than ever. it, like many other aspects of our government, assures that power will not be accumulated at any one point or merely a few points. the electoral college gives the minority a say in what has become a tipping point in american politics. i would think all of those enlightened progressives out there would be all for supporting minority opinion, but i guess it is only certain minorities they are concerned with.
     
  24. hellofromwarsaw

    hellofromwarsaw Well-Known Member

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    Yes the GOP is a giveaway to the rich disgrace.
     
  25. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And the Democrat's recent globalist trade & immigration policies haven't been?

    If you want to go off-topic, I can play that game.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020

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