Conservatives and misinformation

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by LiveUninhibited, Jan 6, 2022.

  1. LiveUninhibited

    LiveUninhibited Well-Known Member

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    Oh and here's examples of mainstream conservative media promoting birtherism: Flashback: How Fox News Promoted Trump's Birtherism | Media Matters for America I'm sure you don't like the source but I'm not going to archive all of that myself.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2022
  2. Hey Now

    Hey Now Well-Known Member

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    Have to agree SOMEWHAT, not sure why but it may be a hyperactive primitive fear response gene? And the SOMEWHAT, it's not conservatives in general, it's the Trumpers.
    A very large portion of the populace are in the middle of the political spectrum range.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2022
  3. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Wow you are not good at this.

    The poll was about Obama being a Muslim, not if he was born in Kenya.

    Also, the quote was was not germane to the actual poll results. You brought that up as a response I made to this quote:

    Again, he didn't say that and that wasn't his conclusion. There doesn't seem to be a reason to double down on a side issue unless you are trying to avoid the the actual issue of your thread.

    I assume that's why you brought up the poll in the first place, because the headlines stated most Republicans thought that Obama was Muslim, and ONCE AGAIN, that has nothing to do with your topic of misinformation.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2022
  4. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    The irony of you using Media Matters...

    Not surprisingly, most of the references were to TRUMP using the birther argument in interviews! So your argument seems to be that if candidate Trump spouted Birther rhetoric during a FOX interview, Fox is spreading birther propaganda, but if he does it during an NBC interview...what? NBC is birther?

    Since Trump's candidacy nor Presidency revolved around Birtherism, I'm unclear how that relates to your thesis, "Part of the problem is widespread suspicion of facts—any facts. Both mistrust of scientists and other “experts” and mistrust of the mass media that reports what scientists and experts believe have increased among conservatives (but not among liberals) since the early ’80s. The mistrust has in part, at least, been deliberately inculcated. The fossil fuel industry publicizes studies to confuse the climate change debate; Big Pharma hides unfavorable information on drug safety and efficacy..."

    What do conservatives believe that you and the experts know for a fact is wrong?
     
  5. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Yes, and that path is?
     
  6. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Donor

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    It's hard to explain to a person of a fixed mindset why they don't see what is obvious. They have a set of perceptions that are absolute; you can't get them to walk around the elephant and see the whole picture of the perspective others have.

    If anything- the belligerent people with the characteristics you speak of are not the conservatives... they are the liberals. IF they could look in the mirror with honest eyes, it would be a very uncomfortable experience. Conservatives certainly don't want to control others. That brings a responsibility they don't want- and while conservatives are responsible people, they don't accept responsibility for other peoples problems and things they have no control over. Liberals think other people control their lives or happiness- and seek to improve those things by controlling others. It's like- "If everybody did what I wanted them to do, I'd be happy...."
    And that is as far as the thought process goes.

    Conservatives believe YOU are the person put here to manage YOUR life. It is YOUR decisions that control YOUR consequences. It's like walking a path across the cow pasture and encountering a fresh cow patty. The liberal takes it personally and demand it be fixed so they can proceed. The socialist, steps in it first, then decides its a personal assault on their rights. Nature- offends such people. It's failed to give them the life they think they are entitled to. The conservative simply steps around it and continues to progress.

    As a conservative- I do not want to make their life difficult, and I don't want to make their life easier, because that would prevent them having the opportunity to learn how to be happy. I will share the tools of success with those who are interested- but I won't carry them down the road to it. IF you want to be a happy person- you have to take full responsibility for yourself and the consequences of your own decisions. People who won't do that are generally- unhappy. Maybe successful in one way or another- but not at peace with life, nor with anybody who is..... thus angry with those who disagree with them, those who seem greater than them, richer than them, more efficient and happy than them. Pretty much anyone not in the same boat..... such misery loves company that will tell you are the victim of others. Thus, a psychological basket of malcontents, thinking that they are the normal ones- but with a constant need to make others as miserable as they are. They perceive a bill due them that never existed, and are angry they can't collect it. Sad.
     
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  7. Pants

    Pants Well-Known Member

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    Please go back to the original post to which you responded. I think I made myself perfectly clear - and as clear as I will make myself in that post.
     
  8. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    I'm asking again, because I wanted you to spell it out in detail.
     
  9. LiveUninhibited

    LiveUninhibited Well-Known Member

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    Your post is too vague to be meaningful. What issue in particular are liberals not seeing clearly? Other than gun control because I generally agree with conservatives there, albeit by a different thought process than they typically use. Seems conservatives want to control women through abortion (well they think a fetus is a person is the issue I suppose), they want to control immigration, they want to have such a huge military they control the entire world, so your libertarian escape is mostly a fantasy regarding the conservative party today.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2022
  10. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Donor

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    Depends on your scope, what you chose to allow on the table- and the weight you give such things.

    IF people are to actually have a working society, they have to discuss and develop policies and values that make it work. To do that, you must be willing to at least acknowledge the various factors that are involved- not approve of disapprove, but not deny what is obviously real, and not claim things to be real that don't exist. That shouldn't be too hard for anyone to understand- provided they actually want a working society.

    Liberals seem to assume that having a view justifies imposing that view on others. I'm conservative, and like most conservatives- I say absolutely not; you have zero rights to control the personal decisions of other people that do not directly affect you. No blanket approach properly defines all those in a category, either. For example, I'm not religious in the normal sense. I think abortion is the business of the pregnant woman. I'm not opposed to some restrictions, but the ultimate choice belongs to the people who ultimately pay the price for the decision. I absolutely demand that immigration be controlled, because uncontrolled immigration is giving the nation free to those who have not helped build it, not come to the door with enough respect for the laws to ask.... and that makes them invaders. Immigration is not invasion, it's a process. Invasion is not immigration- it criminal and illegal occupation.

    None of that is vague unless you aren't willing to look at the full scope of things. If you drive down the highway and never look more than 50 feet ahead- you make well-intended stupid decisions but experience one crisis after another. Liberals, in my opinion- do that. It's myopic; near-sighted as well as based on confused priorities and values. They may think they are swerving to save a squirrel- but they are ignoring the bridge column they are going to hit as a result. NOT smart. If they do that to themselves, that's their choice and consequence. When they want to drive the public bus, I say- they aren't qualified to put others at the risk of their short-sighted decisions. You simply don't gt to force your opinions on others because you think it's for their own good.
     
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  11. GlobalCitizen

    GlobalCitizen Well-Known Member

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    It basically says conservatives don't trust the "experts" and/or media, and here's why: lack of education, irrational beliefs, etc.
    The problem with that narrative is that mistrust in the experts and media has increased in all groups except liberals...
     
  12. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Donor

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    Keep telling yourself what you want to hear. Comfortable lies are always more acceptable than uncomfortable truths- at least to liberals.
    I don't think liberals are smart enough to know when they're being spoon-fed hogwash so long as they are being told thy are right. That comes from- thinking you are smarter than you are and wanting to hear it..
    When your ideas work, you are probably smart and competent. When they turn things into a kind of cesspool disaster- probably not.
    Today's government is worse in terms of competence and integrity and performance than any in my lifetime by far- and I'm old.

    Better learn to trust yourself before you blindly trust people who call themselves experts. Until you know your own limitations, you won't be able to tell the difference between a burro... and a burrow.
     
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  13. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Anyone who thinks conservatives are the only people susceptible to misinformation, or that conservatives are more susceptible to misinformation that liberals, is either not paying attention, or is lying to themselves.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2022
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  14. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    The American public is not "woke" and it doesn't like "wokeness." It did take a while, though. You can generally count on the public getting things right but not very quickly.
     
  15. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Bingo.

    I'll run with 'lying to themselves'. It's a comfort blankie, I guess.
     
  16. Zorro

    Zorro Well-Known Member

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    I'm a little amazed that anyone would cite Slate as a credible source, but, let's dig in:
    1. The First Birther was Obama, the second was the Hillary Clinton Campaign.
    As for election rigging, now that Dems expect to lose one: Suddenly it’s no longer ‘deeply dangerous’ to talk about rigged elections.

    Basically this decision tree works for far more than just the filibuster:

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2022
  17. LowKey

    LowKey Well-Known Member

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    I disagree. I would say it's true that American Conservatives are more likely to believe lies that are told with a certain moral gravitas. Liberals are more likely to believe lies told with more emotional gravitas.

    We are all capable of being deceived. We just require different tactics to accomplish it. The effort involved is also largely dependent on whether we are being lied to about something we are already inclined to believe. When thinking out a subject I try to construct arguments for both sides.

    Original arguments don't just regurgitate. You'll just default to the person you like more. The entire point is to work your brain, and find some good points for the other side. If you can't find any you are not trying hard enough.

    This way you limit your bias although you can never totally remove it. I happen to be pro choice but I could argue pro life passionately and convincingly. I also happen to be pro 2nd amendment, but I could argue for a gun ban just the same.

    Limiting bias is what I've found to be the most effective way to avoid being deceived particularly in political matters.
     
  18. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

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    What nonsense. No particular political affiliation has a monopoly on beliving disinformation.
     
  19. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

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    The average person embraces that which confirms his biases and rejects that which does not. This is human nature.
     
  20. EyesWideOpen

    EyesWideOpen Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well, its so typical that the leftist author goes right in class bigotry to denigrate people based upon whether they are a blue collar or white collar worker.

    Meanwhile, 2017-2022 it was the Democrats who have been the dumbest, uninformed, easily duped fools, repeating one false narrative after another.

    The Trump-Russia collusion hoax went on for years
    The false claims of "hands up don't shoot" is still popular among dems, so to is the false claim that Trump said white supremacists and Neo-Nazis were "some very fine people" or that he told people to drink bleach or inject Lysol into their lungs. And we saw plenty of the brightest minds in the Democratic, elected politicians and news anchors and hosts on TV and cable, clamming for year, that Rittenhouse drove an AR-15 across state lines, and even claiming that he shot two black people.

    I could go on, but it's not necessary, because we all know that the Democrats are the worse culprits at falling for false conspiracy theories and false narratives, and repeat the same lies and false claims for years, never bothering to quit doing so, even when we show them the facts.
     
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  21. EyesWideOpen

    EyesWideOpen Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I can't speak for the others, but I am not referring to Joe Sixpack who nobody knows, or the blue painted shaman of Jan 6th, who repeat false stories. Nope. I'm referring to the highest paid hosts, reporters and editors at CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, NYT, Politico, Vox, Newsweek, Time, and elected Democrats serving in public office, and the leaders in the Democratic Party.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2022
  22. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

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    Which of course has nothing to do with how those people treated others and/or were qualified for the roles they assumed.

    Hillary is quite possibly the biggest phony to hit the national scene, and Obama was barely qualified to become the leader of the free world, having a resumé that read "Community Organizer, and a few years as a U.S. Senator with no notable achievements of any kind."
     
  23. Bob Newhart

    Bob Newhart Newly Registered

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    Nothing about this post seems liberal. Everything about this post seems leftist.

    Let's test this. How many genders are there in humans?
     
  24. LiveUninhibited

    LiveUninhibited Well-Known Member

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    It was never a hoax. It was an investigation that needed to happen. Fortunately the president wasn't conspiring with them, but it's good we saw what the russians were doing to us.

    Not sure what the false claim is. Black people who protested against police violence said it. I think the point is police shouldn't use deadly force when there is no deadly threat, which would include not shooting people who are running away or have their hands up. What's debatable is how frequently it occurs and whether it's more likely to occur against black suspects. It definitely has occurred. We've seen video footage and police have been prosecuted for it. But is it common enough to be called a systemic issue vs a few bad apples. That's the debate. And it honestly isn't an issue I've cared enough about to research enough to answer that question.

    The quote was somewhat taken out of context, but he did call some people in a white nationalist group fine people and equated them to those protesting against them. It sort of depends on if you think white nationalists are white supremacists. Some people think by definition the former implies the latter, and that's where the assertion comes from. I can see where that definition could be challenged.

    He (stupidly) suggested it as a possibility, and then it's true it got a bit blown out of proportion. Presidents should be more careful about that kind of thing, casually suggesting that people try disinfectants to get rid of covid might not be an explicit recommendation, but it could still cause damage to stupid but generally productive citizens.

    The above just illustrates how brainwashed you've been by Fox news or the like. How about a clear misconception that actually matters, like how the right has been against vaccination, resulting in deaths.
     
  25. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    The answer is rather simple - conservatives don’t trust most mass media because they literally lied non-stop for the past 5-6 years. Mass media have only themselves to blame - covering up Hunter Biden story, Russian collusion, racism where there is none, etc etc.
    Why should I listen to CNN or MSNBC if I know they are either going to straight up lie, or omit something?
     
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