Current results of Sweden's approach

LOL.... I forget that you never get around to actually suggesting something. That's fine. I still haven't seen an answer to the "if you do everything as expected" why anything must then be shut down, but sure... you go ahead.

 

I live in TX. I worry more that someone on the road will cause an accident for me than any other concern. We mask, we distance, that is what the "experts" tell us (actually it is a state wide executive order based on those orders) will save us. If we do it, what is there to worry about?

 

Their economic cost was minimal. Their loss of people came in the beginning when no one knew how to handle the virus.

100 Million people live in Sweden. Their deaths are lower than NY by a WIDE margin with 5x as many people.
https://fee.org/articles/sweden-s-a...compared-to-what-modelers-predicted-in-april/

 

Yes, and they did that without government forcefully closing down their economy.
https://fee.org/articles/sweden-s-a...compared-to-what-modelers-predicted-in-april/

 

You are more likely to die of an auto accident than covid. As are most of the people in the world. But those ignition keys keep turning and cigarette and alcohol sales just keep on a turning which are also more likely to kill than COVID but these are essential services!? Thank you for recognizing this!

 

The American people will go through all of this mess screaming "we must listen to the government", but yet we cant limit EBT card purchases that lead to diabetes and heart problems. Its amazing what people will be scared into by the media while fighting for the "right" to do much more harmful activities.

 

Which is the point I was making about compliance versus mandatory.
Sweden didn't lockdown as much as some places because the public kept to the rules without being forced to.
They did close all high schools and colleges, ban meetings of over 50 people, shut theatres etc.
The shops, bars and restaurants did stay open but people stayed at home and they ran at a loss.

 

And by cell phone metric, in states that didn't shut down, Americans did the same. Our problem is that there were lock downs and people by decree stayed away from everyone, now they are becoming the second wave.

 

“If a man is alive, there is always danger that he may die, though the danger must be allowed to be less in proportion as he is dead-and-alive to begin with. A man sits as many risks as he runs.”

Henry David Thoreau, Walden

Yes but a second wave in a minor human threat. If one doesn’t believe that then ask the many more millions that die of starvation every year.

They don’t give a **** about COVID because their priorities are solid!

 

"Amid fears over a potential second wave of the novel coronavirus across Europe, new infections in Sweden, where full lockdown measures were not implemented, have mostly declined since late June.

The number of new cases per 100,000 people in Sweden reported over the last 14 days since July 29 dropped by 54 percent from the figure reported over 14 days prior to then, according to the latest report Wednesday from the World Health Organization (WHO).
Meanwhile, other parts of Europe have reported large spikes in new cases over the same period, including Spain, France, Germany, Belgium and The Netherlands, which have seen increases between 40 and 200 percent over the last month, according to the latest WHO report Wednesday.

The seven-day rolling average of Sweden's daily new cases has been dropping consistently since June 29. Its daily case count has been mostly decreasing since June 24, when it reported 1,803 new infections, its largest single-day spike since the outbreak began, according to data compiled by Worldometer.

The seven-day rolling average of daily new deaths in Sweden has also been declining since around April 15, when it reported a record daily death count of 115. The country's latest seven-day rolling averages for daily new cases and daily new deaths stand at 154 and 2.

"The failure [of the strategy] has of course been the death toll…that has been very much related to the long-term care facilities in Sweden. Now that has improved, we see a lot less cases in those facilities," Tegnell said.When asked whether having a lockdown in Sweden could have made a difference on the impact of the outbreak, Tegnell told UnHerd: "It would have made maybe some difference, we don't know…we also have to look at what are the negative effect of lockdowns, and that has not been done very much so far."

Instead of a lockdown, Sweden aimed to develop "herd immunity," hoping that an increased number of people exposed to the virus will help to prevent a second wave of infections."

https://www.newsweek.com/sweden-whi...ses-plummet-rest-europe-suffers-spike-1521626

Sweden's charts are excellent, superb. Looks like Sweden is in a mopping up phase, largely done with COVID-19. Put a vaccine on top of all that and COVID-19 has little if any chance of a future in Sweden.

And nobody HAD to obey any public health measures in Sweden.

 

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Herd immunity worked even better here in the Netherlands.

 

There are many issues here that are not as cut and dry as the media coverage would suggest - That the media has become so biased is unfortunate.

Sweden had a higher initial number of cases - but - not ridiculously higher. This higher number resulted in a higher number of deaths "Initially".. Because of this many point the finger and go "LOOK LOOK SWEDEN DONE WRONG" - one poster "tell that to the dead people" - in a mindless fit of fallacy.

But this is a long game - The number of deaths dropped rapidly for Sweden - as did the cases requiring hospitalization. . Sweden was able flatten the curve.

They will presumably develop herd immunity faster - so over the long run - Sweden may well win. The number of cases and deaths in Sweden was not that much higher than the average either - not an order of magnitude. Believe it was roughly double the ave if memories serves.

Now though - out of 69,384 Active cases - 69,351 mostly "Mild" 33 "serious or critical" - hospital

So in a nation with 100 Hospitals - you have 33 Covid residents .. or one out of 3 Hospitals has one (1) Covid patient.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/


Compare to Italy - which also was able to flatten the curve - 13791 "mild" 53 "serious or critical"

Germany -- 10479 cases total - "mild" 236 "Serious or Critical"

France-- 90581 "mild" 391 "serious or critical"

What is so out of whack with Sweden's numbers - other than a higher number of active cases .. but - despite this - the serious or critical number is extremely low.

Compare to North America and something strange happens

Canada -- 4598 cases 2309 "mild" 2289 "serious or critical" The serious/critical is very high by comparison - "Something is wrong"


Regardless - Sweden is doing by far the best with respect to "serious Critical" - and ridiculously better than Canada - which seems out of whack.

For those who are mathematically challenged - a low ratio of "Serious/Critical" to cases means less death over the long run.

I have heard it postulated that as the virus mutates - it becomes more contagious but less pathogenic. The numbers seem to back this hypothesis up.

 

All I’m saying is that the greatest government allocation of resources should be to the greatest health threats and COVID 19 can’t begin to be a contender.
The Netherlands, Japan, Sweden and the US when this is over soon (Election Day in the US) will tell the tale and the international media will move onto the next media induced crisis.

 

You overstated the population of Sweden by a factor of 5.

And the CORRECT comparison would be Denmark, Norway and Finland...who have had a FRACTION of the deaths and about the same economic impact

 

OK...I'll do it again. And you'll ignore it again

Wear masks. Sanitize and wash hands. STRICT social distancing. DO NOT hang out in close proximity to people who do not live in your house

And for God's sake don't open schools until you can meet at least the CDC guidelines (14 days of decreasing infections and certain levels of testing and tracing)

 

Well I'll be...

 

So there are 50 million in Sweden? That means the death rate is much much lower, right?
There are a little more than 10 million in Sweden. I’ve spent time there.
The Netherlands has nearly twice as many with about 17 or 18 million concentrated in a much smaller area and doing so much better than its neighbors in Belgium and the UK. Better than Italy or Spain given that The Netherlands never shut its borders. Maybe luck or maybe the science of herd immunity. My money is on the latter!!

 

Wow. Work on your math...and your logic

And don't make claims that you have no inkling about

 

Sweden is just proof social distancing works.
Sweden 6,000 deaths.
NYC 32,000 deaths.

 

What!?

 

Ok give me a break! restaurants and most close contact industries industries like barbering remained open in Sweden throughout and the death rate is still extremely low and look at Japan which is approximately the same size with almost 17 times the population where social distancing is essentially impossible and even bars remained open and the death rates are even way lower. Lockdowns are completely non correlable to containment of the virus.

 

10 million in Sweden. A little more. Cigarettes and auto accidents and alcohol poisoning are larger threats. But people turn their keys in ignitions, and light up and inhale and love their vodka. I’ve done all three when in Sweden as have they. The Swedish have done their math homework and made the right decision about c-19 without destroying their economy. So have the Japanese and The Netherlands middle response has been quite effective indeed. I’m very proud of it.

 

Are you trying to tell me that doing something is worse than doing noting? Cause if you are, I'm not buying it.

Japan, however, has never enforced a lockdown with penalties, even when a national state of emergency was declared on April 15 in an expansion of the state of emergency for Tokyo and six other prefectures declared earlier on April 7. Instead, the government “requested” that people refrain from going out and that restaurants and bars suspend their business, without ever forcing them to close down. This soft approach was enough to achieve a de facto lockdown as people practiced risk aversion rather than bearing responsibility for spreading the virus, and those who feared social sanctions bowed to social pressure.

The “requests” to practice risk aversion helped to accelerate a decline in new infections that had already started before the declaration of a national emergency, but there is no doubt that there was another factor in play as well and this was the call to avoid the “three Cs”: closed spaces with poor ventilation, crowded spaces open to the public, and close-contact settings putting people in range of flying droplets from speaking, coughing, and sneezing. All three of these situations increase the risk of droplet infection, so avoiding them will naturally decrease the possibility of infection. In other words, even if the mandated 2-meter physical distance cannot be maintained, it is still possible to lower the risk of infection by avoiding the three Cs as we continue to go about our daily activities.

Of course, adding physical distancing to avoiding the three Cs will lead to even better results. During the national state of emergency, experts advised reducing daily contact with other people by 80% and many made a special effort to comply. When circumstances required interaction, people still tried to avoid the three Cs, and this proved effective in keeping the number of infections down. Infections among essential workers have also been limited in Japan in comparison to Western countries, which is probably due to avoidance of the three Cs and wearing of masks.

https://www.nippon.com/en/in-depth/d00592/

 

They're all the same.
When Japan lifted it's state of emergency on July 10, this is what happened.