Educated vs "Non-Educated"

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Kal'Stang, Dec 22, 2019.

  1. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    Nothing could be farther from the truth. There are many of we Manual labor red neck liberals. But we aren’t too uninformed to realize that more formal education correlates to more earning power. We had no problem working multiple jobs so our kids could get college degrees. That’s the world we live in now. The good paying jobs for just HS educated are harder to come by. If you think we should be proud, uneducated Americans trying to compete on the world stage for jobs, that’s not how we feel. America has the greatest collection of universities in the world too. Be proud of that as well.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2019
  2. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    I'm saying you've done nothing more than offer opinion, with no substantiation, and claim "science".

    Sorry, I'm not laughing at you, ........wait,........yes,........I really am laughing at you
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2019
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  3. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    [QUOTE="squidward, post: 1071288975, member: 12221]


    Sorry, I'm not laughing at you, ........wait,........yes,........I really am laughing at you[/QUOTE]
    More likely you're looking in a mirror.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2019
  4. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    I know you are but what am I .
    I'm rubber and you're glue ........
    classic
     
  5. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    Merry xmass to you too.
     
  6. Collateral Damage

    Collateral Damage Well-Known Member

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    So you support income inequality?

    Apparently, everything important to you is based on earning potential. That would make your basis also about material goods, and what you can 'buy', rather than enjoying non-monetary things.
     
  7. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    You’re right, I’d even learn how to spell “ haw”.
     
  8. perdidochas

    perdidochas Well-Known Member

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    College, of course, is learning how to think, and how to systematically apply information. My current job didn't exist when I was in college, yet what I learned in college I have applied to this job. Also, critical thinking and learning how to think is the key to success, outside of a few limited fields. It's not a luxury, and in fact, it's probably the key to why college educated people make more money and have lower unemployment (even during recessions) than those without college education.
     
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  9. perdidochas

    perdidochas Well-Known Member

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    Exactly.
     
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  10. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    Bet your asteroid. People who are able should work. The world is competitive. . I support being rewarded for your efforts and getting paid according to your performance. Get trained or educated if you want to earn more. I don’t support giving people Free jobs in a coal mine so they can get black lung and drive up everyone’s insurance because they’re not willing to move or retain or get an education. It’s like jumping on a boat and trolling the deep seas for whale oil. It’s a pretty useless, dangerous and counter productive occupation...
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2019
  11. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    good points...
    And, Some people think college is all, fun and games. It’s the most stressful and hardest part of your life. Working in a mill doing the 11 to 7 shift is a cake walk mentally to the stress of paying out tens of thousands while under the pressure of losing it all if you fk up.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2019
  12. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    Do you support giving loans to morons, to go to college, to study crap, driving up the costs for worthy students?
     
  13. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    I agree. But many are too dumb to understand this, waste time and money studying garbage, for little return, and drive up the costs for worthy students in the process.
     
  14. StillBlue

    StillBlue Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely. I think the disconnect here is that formal education is more appreciated than other forms. I had a long debate with my educational policies studies prof on this very thing. Michelangelo would have been just as brilliant today but without formal study he would never reach his true level of brilliance. He didn't design a cold fusion reactor because he would have known nothing of the process to work from but I'd give him a good shot at it if he studied nuclear physics and with his abilities to take from here put it with something from there and arrive with something never even considered.
    But there are other forms of education that need to be addressed. When you pull your car into the bay at a good mechanic by the time you've stopped your engine the mechanic will tell you that you thingamabob is out of alignment with the whatchamacallit and tears your engine down, fixes it and never once checked a manual. There's an enormous amount of knowledge being displayed there. I also had a course where I was to put all the skills required by my subject onto 3X5 cards from which I was to determine which are the entry level skills that should be taught. I was teaching machine tools at the community college at the time. I gave her 700 cards on one machine, the lathe. She had no idea a skilled machinist would have such a skill set. That's why it's typical for a machinist to apprentice for 10 years and another ten or so before you become a tool and die man.
    I firmly believe that almost everyone can learn, the knowledge gained obtaining a high school diploma today would have been considered a phenomenon 200 years ago when a primary school education was considered the big time. Many people from all levels of society use smart phones which are actually computers but would claim no skills using a computer. I knew a kid hated math in junior high until they started studying fractions. He already knew them from his shop class but we didn't call them math. He did much better after that.
    If the US is to maintain it's status as intellectually superior and a leader everyone should go on to post high school and all forms of learning need to be exploited. The blacksmiths in every town 120 years ago are the engineers today. We need to recognize that if we don't rather than other countries aspiring to be us they'll be passing us.
     
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  15. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    Many is not all. It’s not most either. It’s a small percentage.
    The average American is not a legacy baby waiting for a free ride so they can only party in college. There are tens of thousands of engineering and medical pistons that pay big bucks, begging for employees with a college education. .

    Also...Anyone can get off their asteroids, join the service, get help with tuition and commit to a few years of service. There’s nothing that straightens out your priorities as having some one scream obscenities in your ear at three in the morning to “ do your job”. The service is very big on education and being smart. You increase grade and pay by taking classes, becoming more educated and increasing your intellect. Its called survival of the “smartest.”
     
  16. AKS

    AKS Well-Known Member

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    This is exactly what I did. Got my education, served my country, developed discipline, and learned a trade to boot. I highly recommend this path.
     
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  17. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    OK, so you're back of science and math. Has anyone disagreed on the value of this type of curriculum ?
     
  18. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    or "pistons"
     
  19. Collateral Damage

    Collateral Damage Well-Known Member

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    Of course people who are capable should work to support themselves. But not everybody is working based on new and better X, bigger and gaudier Y. Why you should focus on coal miming is beyond me. People are made aware on the intrinsic health dangers, and if enough of them choose not to do it, the industry would adjust, hopefully to automation, or die out completely. That has nothing to do with 'education'. Their willingness to move also has nothing to do with education.
     
  20. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    Coal mining is one of the disastrous occupations trump seems to be fixated on...why ? As far as I can tell, he’s foolish. Coal mining has no future as a big employer as much of the digging is done robotically even if coal is used for energy. Just in case you need it mentioned, the coal industry does not adjust to workers, they adjust to the coal industry. The same can be said for much manufacturing. The future is in engineering, technology and the service and healthcare industry.

    Do you want to work in a mine, only a robotic does. I see Some need to be explained. When jobs are lost and not coming back, the need for re education AND/OR relocating is necessary. Does that help ?

    What x and y refer to something...I don’t have a clue.
     
  21. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Donor

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    The democrats keep talking about how much better educated democrats are than republicans. What else is that supposed to mean?
     
  22. YourBrainIsGod

    YourBrainIsGod Well-Known Member

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    Sounds very 1984.

    The Iraq war was a real showcase of the propaganda model. Dissenters were rooted out in that campaign, and the war narratives were pushed by every network. That's who the corporate media hires, those who won't rock the boat. At one time they needed dissenters to project a level of integrity, but wartime didn't allow for those who disagree to have a voice.

    I too put a heavy value in politicians that push back against the status quo of endless wars, the shame is there are so few who actually do. This has skewed the conversation, it's pretty much settled that increasing the war budget and fighting a nebulous myriad of terrorist organizations with no recognition of national borders is necessary. It's not. Actually it has some awful consequences, the absurd expenditure of resources alone is shocking.

    There's a failure to understand the new geopolitical game. Limitless wars are the intention of groups like ISIL who are playing a game of attrition. China has jumped on the failed state that is Iraq, offering them infrastructure investment for resources, along with everyone's favorite chain: debt. This seems a much better way of turning an enemy into an ally, the coups and proxy wars are quickly becoming a tactic of the past.
     
  23. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    When you post that math only developed math muscles, they are fighting words to any one from business to any engineering to medicine and a plethora of other occupations.

    . the idea too, that you can say any other major is not practical or whatever words you want to use, is pretty contrary to how businesses hire and pay salaries. The military values degrees in absolutely any area and gives people a chance at OCS because of it. They get that even college in general gives you distinct advantages.
     
  24. dagosa

    dagosa Well-Known Member

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    No they don’t.
    They simply argue that the willingness to listen to ideas different from your own, is essential for education.
    That is the definition of liberalism. It makes sense then that more democrats would support higher education. Conservatives keep arguing that formal education is not as necessary. That’s pretty ridiculous........
     
  25. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    I didn't.
    How do you know I'm not one of them?

    I think a ton of students are wasting time and money on crap, driving up the costs for everyone.
     

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