End Affirmative Action. Yes / No & Why

That's a stretch. I suspect most know that institutionalised racism and sexism was sorted by the end of the 20thC.

And that IS what we're discussing, right? Or are you wanting to police the private thoughts of private citizens?

 

Yes and we all know that when segregation defining black people as inferior human beings, suddenly becomes illegal..racists see them as equals (sarcasm alert)

 

FoxHastings said: ↑
I hope you realize that you are conversing with people who think racism ended when the slaves we freed and sexism never existed...

No, it's not...I know people like that and there are some here.

LOL! See the post you quoted for the facts.

It was "sorted" ?? What does that mean? It certainly doesn't mean it ended....

Was that at 12:01 on 2001?

Why would anyone worry about the thought police since you claim there is no racism or sexism ???? (since 12:01 on 2001 )

 

Is instituationalised racism and sexism now outlawed, or isn't it?

Every time you avoid that reality, you reveal that your interest is not in racism, but in controlling thought.

 

So this IS about Thought Policing?

Racism is just the 'reason du jour' for wanting to control how people think.

 

If they end legacy student admissions the same day, go for it.

 

FoxHastings said: ↑
I hope you realize that you are conversing with people who think racism ended when the slaves we freed and sexism never existed...

No, it's not...I know people like that and there are some here.

LOL! See the post you quoted for the facts.

It was "sorted" ?? What does that mean? It certainly doesn't mean it ended....

Was that at 12:01 on 2001?

Why would anyone worry about the thought police since you claim there is no racism or sexism ???? (since 12:01 on 2001 )

WHERE exactly did I say anything different? I didn't....

Every time one avoids the fact that there is racism and sexism, it's promoted.

 

So you admit that sexism and racism are outlawed. What is this really about then?

Why do you want to control the thoughts of others? As far as I'm aware, we're still free to think racist and sexist thoughts, no?

 

DUH, the fact that outlawing them doesn't make them disappear as YOU claim.

WHERE, show me WHERE I said I wanted to control the thoughts of others?

I didn't....so you know what that makes you

I never said otherwise.....yes, if people want to remain stupid , ignorant, backwards, hateful, sick and twisted they are most certainly free to think racist and sexist thoughts...


I see you used the word "we're" in your sentence above …..




Oh my goodness...….My original comment was : FoxHastings said: ↑I hope you realize that you are conversing with people who think racism ended when the slaves we freed and sexism never existed..."

Maybe it should have been , "You realize that you are conversing with people who think because laws protecting blacks and women were passed that racism and sexism no longer exist."

For some we must get down to very basic concepts or confusion ensues

 

Affirmative action is absolutely necessary. Without it, the minorities it advantaged would not be able to have the outcomes that they now enjoy. Equal outcomes cannot come from equal opportunities because of the differences between peoples. If we're going to have equal outcomes between the various peoples, affirmative action is necessary.

This isn't a matter of individual responsibility; it's a matter of individual ability. We all have our limits. Even if every opportunity were equal, some people would be limited by their will, others by their ability.

FROM EACH ACCORDING TO THEIR WILL - TO EACH ACCORDING TO THEIR ABILITY

 

Why would that be? Skin tone and lineage does not determine competence. Affermative Action breeds more racism because (1) it is based on the racist premise that minorities cannot advance in life unless the omnipotent State helps them out and (2) when people who do not belong to a minority group see that minorities get special treatment and privileges, they may direct their anger towards the minorities rather than the legislators.

And the thing is that we are not to have equal outcomes because that is a horrendous idea that can only be realised by genocide. I would not want to live in a society of equal outcomes.

Exactly and this is why we only need equality of opportunity. Equality of outcome is a revolt against nature because it is a notion that denies individual variation.

 

Minorities overwhelmingly agree that they cannot compete without affirmative action laws to advantage them. It is my experience that, whether people think they can or they think they can't, they're probably right.

 

Your premise is wrong. So you believe that the only reason minorities didn’t get ahead for centuries was because they weren’t capable?
do you think the only reason women didn’t go to Harvard was because they were not capable? No these groups were held back for centuries while white men didn’t have to compete with them. I guess we should conclude that white men were inferior because they had to have special treatment? You’re getting angry now because you have to share of the pie.
Imagine a running a race were white men had to start five minutes later......the gun goes off, the white guys Can’t run for five minutes, then five mi utes later they’re told they can....By that time women and minorities were almost at the finish line. Do you think that was a fair race?

 

So, discrimination made them less capable and now in need of affirmative action advantages?

 

No ....discrimination did not make women and African-Americans less capable, they were denied the ability to use their capabilities because they were denied the opportunities. How do you suggest leveling the playing field.? If great baseball players had to play with one hand behind their back‘s would it be a fair game?

 

Reach out of your deep past, Renee, and join us in the now.

ASIANS are at the top of your leader board.

 

By LEVELLING it. Not by making it hilly at one end and flat at the other.

You do realise (I hope) that laws against institutional discrimination, free education, and free healthcare ARE the level playing field, dontcha? Once you have those, there can only be excuses. And most of the Western world has had all three for decades.

 

At this point, in the democratic First World, that is literally the only obstacle remaining.

Sadly, I wouldn't put it past Progressives to try and police 'will' at some point. Or legislate for it in some way.

 

We must have affirmative action laws if we're going to have relative parity.

For whatever reason, there is absolutely no way that the minorities that affirmative action now advantages could ever even hope to achieve at the same level as those not advantaged by affirmative action. It's just not going to happen, never has, never will. It's not as if affirmative action seeks to restore relative parity; affirmative action seeks to establish a relative parity that has never existed.

 

Out of opportunity, ability and will, most are limited by their will. That's especially true among those who complain the most about their lack of opportunity or boast the most about their ability.

 

We are not speaking of the past.

Blah, blah blah.

What pie?

I think that was a terrible analogy.

 

That’s the oro

Of course because everything begins for you today so you can ignore the past and pretend that it didn’t happen so you can do it again
Of course you would think it’s a terrible analogy because I’m sure it went right over your head.

 

When you analyse the past, it is important that the past you are analysing is the actual past and not one that is a made-up mishmash of Feminist nonsense and Intersectional wish-wash.

It is also important to note that we live in the present and not in the past.

Having read most of your posts, I do not think it would be an insult to say that you know very little about history.

Nope. It was just a very bad one.

 

Yes I remember being told that when I fought for equal rights in the 70s. Same rhetoric but we ignored you and people like you and we got more equality.I probably know more about history in my little pinky than you do in your whole body.

 

"all diversity considerations"? You consider that affirmative action? I can hardly think about this broad swath of a category. That leaves Niel de Grasse Tyson, does it, and now, the advancement of the Black man.