France: Muslims assault Jews in unprovoked attack

Even if this is true, big whoop.

 

Your problem relates to your generic description of Muslims as a collective. You have also relegated specific nationalist determinations within your critique. For example, the poll doesn't demonstrate that the majority of Muslims IN GAZA support Sharia as the only source of legislation. There is also the difficulty in dissecting nationalist aspirations of the people on the ground from the government's' who purport to speak on behalf of Muslims. The two do not necessarily coincide.

 

Spoken like true, mid-stream muslim

 

They do not in the slightest, Bin Laden was "ordered to fight the people until they say there is no god but Allah and Mohammad is his prophet," as per his own words it has everything to do with Islam and offensive Jihad in order to kill or convert the infidel.

When it comes to dealing with primitive Islamic expansionist swine we can.

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Yes he declared war on America because we are infidels and according to him spreading Jahilliya, his motivation was only Islam, now provide the excerpt from Milestones in which he claims that American support from Israel was his rational I'll be waiting with baited breath.

 

I clearly said the majority and the vast majority not all.

That was an extrapolation based on the results found in Jordan and Egypt which would likely be representative of the West Bank and Gaza respectively (in fact Gaza is far more radicalized) and it was likewise based on the indisputable fact that they already voted for the radical Islamic fundamentalist of Hamas which since obtaining power has in fact initiated a program of Taliban style Islamization in the Gaza strip.

 

Yes, and why was he "ordered to fight the people until they say there is no god but Allah and Mohammad is his prophet?" You are simply going in circles.

Recent events have shown otherwise. Even when you directly engage them, you fail. Lol.

Mere repetition; evidence has already been provided.

 

Right. Bin Laden's mentor Qutb made the ideological, imperialistic and revanchist goals/motives of jihadists quite clear for all to see.

My country has had its own problems with Britain and France, so I can relate to your own situation. However, I can't say the Arabs were any better - their unprovoked aggression against Americans sailing in the Mediterranean Sea provoked our first conflict abroad (the Barbary Wars). When I read the excuse that Ambassador Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja made for this unprovoked aggression, "that it was founded on the Laws of their Prophet, that it was written in their Koran, that all nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as Prisoners, and that every Musselman who should be slain in Battle was sure to go to Paradise", I realize how little things have changed in your part of the world. What you say about the West can easily be said about the Arab world.

 

If the US had reverted to its isolationist stance after WWII, and simply engaged in commercial activities with the Arab world, would the twin towers be standing today? There is a reason why the Arab world ditched nationalism and opted for Islam after the '67 war.

I'm more concerned with America's policy towards the Arab world post WWII. With regards to the Barbary Wars, well, it was a war against pirates (who weren't even Arabs).

 

That's pretty persuasive I must say. I would, however, add a caveat that I think what is often overlooked is that support for radical groups like Hamas are often - at least in part - an expression of wider socioeconomic and political factors.

 

Hamas has a hard job in Gaza keeping militancy down!! There has been a massive rise in jihaddist groups including many leaving hamas to join them. The move towards the jihadists has been because Hamas, democracy, political means has been seen to produce nothing and this in a place the UN has said will not be fit for human habitation by the year 2020 because of several reasons concerning the occupation and that 90% of the water it receives is contaminated.

Israel has for some reason ignored this but the reason for the rise in jihaddism is no political movement.

Hamas was originally voted in because of corruption and don't forget that they have always had good social welfare plans. They expected to be able to be the voice of the people of Gaza but this did not happen as the Western world only agrees with democracy if people vote for who it wants.

 

Because they aren't Muslims.

And yet Bin Laden was shot in the head and chucked into the ocean like the piece of trash that he was.

You have provided no such evidence, cite the quote from Milestones in which Qutb blames the US support of Israel. I have already provided the quote in which he makes it absolutely clear that his nothing to do with US foreign policy but rather that it was a spiritual war based on western decadence attracting Muslims to Jahilliya.

 

I've actually studied this subject as well and the typology for terrorists adhering to radical political ideologies actually shows that they are generally middle class and fairly well educated.

One of the best known, most comprehensive, and most often cited of these efforts is a profile developed by Russell and Miller (1977110) based on a compilation of published data regarding over 350 individual terrorist cadres and leaders across 18 different Palestinian, Japanese, German, Italian, Turkish, Irish, Spanish, Iranian, Argentina, Brazilian, and Uruguayan terrorist groups active during the 1966-1976 time span. The prototype derived from their composite described a young (22-25), unmarried male who is an urban resident, from a middle-upper class family, has some university education and probably held an extremist political philosophy.

http://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/208552.pdf


102 Salafi Muslim terrorists from Saudi Arabia, Egypt, France, Algeria, Morocco, and Indonesia

Average Age: 25.69

Socioeconomic status: (avg. 18 percent upper class, 55 percent age of middle class, and 27 percent lower class (Sageman 2004)

"A poll conducted by the Palestinian Center for Policy and Survey Research
(PCPSR) in 2001 among 1,357 adults in the West Bank and Gaza tested the hypothesis
that poverty or low levels of education influence attitudes regarding political violence
and found that support for terrorism against Israeli civilians was even more common
among professionals than among laborers (43.3 vs. 34.6 percent) and more common
among those with secondary education than among illiterate respondents (39.4 vs.
32.3 percent)

More important, Krueger and Maleckova (2002) also tested
how economic status and education compared with actual participation in political
violence: comparing 129 Hezbollah fighters ages fifteen to thirty-eight who died in
action between 1982 and 1994 with members of the general Lebanese population of
the same age range, the poverty rate was similar (28 percent among fighters vs. 33 percent
in the population), but fighters were significantly more likely to have attended
secondary school (33 vs. 23 percent)" (Krueger and Maleckova 2002).


http://www.surrey.ac.uk/politics/re...mmeracademy/instructors /The Terrost mind.pdf

 

That's funny, goomba. I don't know if you're being delusional, naive or completely oblivious to history thinking that reverting to our pre-war isolationist stance was an option in the aftermath of the WWII, particularly in the face of rising Soviet aggression. As for the Twin Towers, they might be standing today if it weren't for a number of many reasons, most notably our support of the Muslims in Afghanistan fighting the USSR.

There are also a lot of reasons for the decline of nationalism and rise of Islamism and Islamist terrorism in the years and decades following the Six Day War, and as you know, the groundwork for many of them was laid long before that war. I also believe that there are larger and more profound reasons that explain the rise of Islamism and Islamist terrorism that are still playing themselves out around the world and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future.

The Tripolitanians were a mix of Arabs and Berbers, and many of the "pirates" who operated out of this area were far more than mere "pirates" (as were their famous predecessors who terrorized Europe when the Med was an Ottoman lake).

As for America's policy towards the Arab world, it was little different than the policies of Arab states - it was based on our own national interest and prior to the fall of the Berlin Wall, Cold War considerations. Certainly, our policies and interests conflicted with those of many Arab states over the years, but often our policies and interests coincided with the policies and interests of Arab states and even conflicted with those of of our Western and Israeli allies (ex. the 1956 Suez Crisis).

 

Wrong; see post #198.

Yet they will continue to attack you.

Refer to post # 220.

 

No, I'm being hypothetical.

We'll have to agree to disagree.

Can you provide us with these reasons?

Ok, but how do you see this as being relevant?

It was in your own perceived national interest; as it is now. With regards to your point about interests and policies being in conflict with those of your allies, well, they were/are insignificant.

 

Propaganda aimed at a western audience versus what was said in private to fellow Muslims.

Akin to poking a bear with a stick, ineffective and stupid.

No quote from Milestones was provided in said post.

 

eating ham...those muzzies took a big chance. what if they had gotten pork on them while slugging him?

 

Because whatever Dr. Face says must be the case.

Having you been reading the headlines lately?

Lol, why does it have to be from Milestones?

 

Nope it's what Bin Laden said.

The most they've been able to accomplish is killing a couple of innocent civilians nothing of any real strategic or economic consequence, our foreign policy has not changed one iota in response to their ineffective strategy save for us targeting them anywhere we want anytime we want while they have neither the means to defend themselves from our drones or offer effective counter attacks.

Any quote from Qutb will do.

 

Bin Laden said in private that what he says in public is really propaganda aimed at gullible Westerners? Interesting.