German parliament declares Israel boycott campaign antisemitic

no, nothing anti-semitic about being critical of israeli govt. policies.

but it is very anti-semitic and hateful to refer to Israel as "parasites" an Israeli-Americans and American Zionists as an "infestation".

 

I know a fair bit about it. Possibly you should tell me what you are talking about and why you believe everyone who supports BDS including 40% of British Jews who believe in some form of sanctions against Israel are antisemetic and should according to you be punished for their political views, possibly imprisoned.

 

Are you talking about my saying that in research 2 years or so ago, 40% of British Jews under 35 believe in some form of sanctions against Israel. Of course that is relevant. They are some of the people, jews in general being a large section of the people who you are choosing to call antisemetic and choosing to punish in whatever way Germany will be punishing people who believe in BDS. What will that be, imprisoning them or making sure they cannot get a job in the future as Canary Mission is doing in the US - trying to frighten students who support BDS who Israel see as the future elite in the US from going by their conscience politically for fear of having their personality and future work possibilities destroyed. If you want to know just how bad this is you should look at Aljazeera The Lobby tapes. (American tapes)

and the rest was not bullshit but that is what people say when either they do not know what they are talking about or cannot answer. That argument I first paid no attention to when made by Max Blumenthal after your Government had called him, a Jew, an antisemite. Now with this response from your government and your position, I can see where he was coming from. I am sure the Adf support this position as well as like Richard Spencer they will love Israel for being an ethnic nationalist state, one which they will deport all Jews to if the Western extreme right gain power which now is a possibility and very much a possibility in Germany.

 

GnoiB If the other thing you are saying has no relevance was the EU following the US after Blair approached Germany and giving up its moral responsibilities towards fulfilling its obligations towards a two state solution, again you are totally wrong. All of this is about Israel Politics including the support of Israel colonising all of Palestine. The claims that BDS is antisemetic is simply a claim to stop people acting non violently to ensure the Palestinians get some rights. Only someone who did not believe the Palestinians are people who deserve the same rights as anyone else could 'choose' to call them antisemetic hoping by that to stop peaceful protest which might stop Israel getting all of the Palestinains land.

Does Germany complain about Israel shooting and killing or maiming for life Palestinians for doing what they have a lawful right to do, protest. Israel may kill children, medics, the disabled, the press and other civilians who are no danger to them, all International Crimes but Germany has no problem with that. Germany's only problem is with people who want to stop this in a proven non violent way. You may believe you are not fighting a political war to help Israel abuse the Palestinians by pretending BDS is antisemetic, but that is exactly what you have been propagandised/programmed to do through Israel's strongest weapon - calling antisemitism.

 

So then we get this

https://www.timesofisrael.com/germa...anti-israel-boycott-movement-as-anti-semitic/

It is impossible to know whether this statement is caused by extreme ignorance on the part of German Politicians or a deliberate intent to fool the public.

Again they are deliberately equating Israel with Jews which as I have said before is strongly considered antisemitism. They do not even begin to look into the situation but instead claim their right to deign who is antisemetic by being antsemetic themselves.

Again, what is motivating these politicians to act in this way. Is it fear or bribery.

The irony is that when Jews of the world were boycotting Germany, Zionists, those who were to become Israel broke that boycott.

 

https://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/German-Bundestag-rules-BDS-is-antisemitic-589999

It isn't that Germany is the only country doing this. It pretty much is being tried in most of Europe and the United States. May tried it even though people from the Israeli Embassy were talking about 'taking down' Members of Parliament who cared about Palestinian Rights including one of her own ministers (everyone has something to hide was his position). So May told English Councils they could not by law be involved in BDS. It was no longer legal for them to do so. Councils carried on doing this and were taken to court by Israel supporters...and that is where the English Courts put the right of free political thought and action to be sacrosanct in a democracy. Had they believed that this was motivated by antisemitism obviously the result would have been very different as we are heavy on hate crimes. The English courts are able to tell the difference between the Political and Prejudice. It will be interesting seeing if German courts do.

That JP article goes on to say this is a first step against 'the new antisemitism' which is being critical of Israel. Israel does not care about traditional antisemitism which is hatred of Jews for being Jews and is the province of the far right in Western Countries and growing. This does not bother her at all. All she is concerned about is criticism of Israel and actions to give support to the Palestinians. She even is best friends in Eastern European country's where genuine antisemitism is growing and where Jews living there have complained about Israel's support of these countries policies antisemitism. So, if you believe antisemitism is criticism of Israel then you will support what Germany has done. However if you support traditional antisemitism which is hatred of Jews for being Jews - and of course Jews being some hateful stereotype then you most certainly will not agree with Germany.

 

You're deliberately misquoting terms I have used on unrelated topics to describe America's parasitic Israeli lobbies & America's "Israel Firsters" like Jonathan Pollard & his Zionist fan club.

I have never referred to all Israelis as "parasites" nor have I ever slandered all Jews.

How would you describe Netanyahu's words if not "parasitic":

Netanyahu: “Once we squeeze all we can out of the United States, it can dry up and blow away”

http://web.archive.org/web/20060512...pecial_Reports/092105Madsen/092105madsen.html

 

you called the nation of Israel "parasitic"

 

What else would you call a government that has succeeded in extracting over $3 Trillion dollars(1) from America's coffers and repeatedly betrayed the US in return.

Meanwhile, over 80% of Americans opposed one of the more recent multi Billion dollar handouts to Israel(2) but AIPAC supported it.
Who do you think had the most influence in it being approved?

Are 81% of Americans "anti Semites" for preferring to spend that money in America?



(1) "The Real Cost of US Support for Israel: $3 Trillion"
http://www.ilaam.net/Intl/RealCostOfIsrael.html

EXCERPT "While it is commonly reported that Israel officially receives some $3 billion every year in the form of economic aid from the U.S. government, this figure is just the tip of the iceberg. There are many billions of dollars more in hidden costs and economic losses lurking beneath the surface. A recently published economic analysis has concluded that U.S. support for the state of Israel has cost American taxpayers nearly $3 trillion ($3 million millions) in 2002 dollars."CONTINUED


(2) “81% of Americans Oppose $38 Billion Pledge to Israel”
http://original.antiwar.com/smith-grant/2016/09/19/81-americans-oppose-38-billion-pledge-israel/

EXCERPT “A solid majority of Americans would redirect $38 billion the Obama Administration pledged to Israel toward other priorities.

An IRmep poll fielded by Google Consumer Surveys reveals 80.8 percent of the US adult Internet user population says they would redirect the proposed spending toward other priorities.

- Caring for veterans (20.7 percent) was their top priority, followed by

- education spending (20.1 percent) and

- paying down the national debt (19.3 percent).

- Rebuilding US infrastructure was favored by 14.9 percent, while

- funding a Middle East peace plan received 5.8 percent of support.

- Only 16.8 percent said the $38 billion of pledged foreign aid should be spent on Israel.”

CONTINUED

 

nothing but Fake News.

you have no evidence whatsoever that the USA has given $3 trillion to Israel, nor has anyone ever made such a claim.

I guess you don't read your own links.

 

You are going over board, the resolution of the Bundestag, not supporting BDS, has no legal consequences for anybody in Germany.They voted down far harsher resolutions by the AfD, your adf, you should at least get those terms right, and The Linke.
If you want to support BDS in Germany, you are fine, a resolution is not a law..
Yes the rest was BS, people in Germany might think different than people in the UK and the German parliament concerned its self with a matter in Germany, opinions, polls in the UK, or US or were ever have no value in something like that.
Aljazeera is a government news organization of a Arab country, I take their news with a serious grain of salt, like RTL
The AfD your Adf has stalled out, around 12%.
Deporting Jews, please give me a break. Try to get back into the real world and leave the CTs behind, it is healthy and relaxing, nobody is coming for you

 

BDS' founder does not support a 2 state solution.
Germany has never given up the 2 State solution, it wants it. But first Hamas and other Palestine groups, including the founder of BDS have to declare Israel's right to exist. Naturally that gets us back to the money trail which always leads to Iran.
The Palestine people deserve as much a State as the Jewish People deserve Israel.
Understand.
Israel has lost the moral high ground, I repeat it again, but the folks which represent the Palestinian have no moral high ground, too.
They can not even make up their mind if Israel has a right to exist.
Hamas which rules Gaza, denies Israel's right to exist. A terrorist organization financed by Iran.

 

There's nothing "fake" about the fact that Israel has cost America even more that the figure of $3 Trillion because that calculation was done in 2002 by economist Thomas R. Stauffer.

The cost of ensuring Israel's regional hegemony since 2002 has actually been much higher since Trump finally admitted that the only reason the US is in the Mid East is "...for Israel" (1)

Meanwhile, the majority of Americans oppose the relentless & unconditional flow of US resources to Israel whose leader has this to say about the one sided US - Israeli "alliance":

Netanyahu: “Once we squeeze all we can out of the United States, it can dry up and blow away”

http://web.archive.org/web/20060512...pecial_Reports/092105Madsen/092105madsen.html

Finally, According to the Symington - Glenn Amendment,(2) all aid to Israel is illegal because Israel refuses to sign the NPT but America's near omnipotent Zionist Lobbies still manage to extract $ Trillions for Israel against the will of loyal Americans who prefer to spend America's resources at home fixing America's numerous problems.



(1) "TRUMP: U.S. TROOPS WILL REMAIN IN THE MIDDLE EAST FOR ISRAEL"
https://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Trump-US-troops-will-remain-in-the-Middle-East-for-Israel-572997

EXCERPT "We have reached a point where we don't have to stay in the Middle East. One reason to stay is Israel," U.S. President Donald Trump said on Tuesday evening with an exclusive interview with the Washington Post."CONTINUED


(2) "Lawsuit Claims Aid to Nuclear Israel Illegal Under Symington Glenn Amendments"
https://www.corporatecrimereporter....ael-illegal-under-symington-glenn-amendments/

EXCERPT "A lawsuit filed in federal court in Washington, D.C. claims that United States aid to Israel is illegal under a law passed in the 1970s that prohibits aid to nuclear powers that don’t sign the Nuclear Non Proliferation Treaty (NPT).

Such aid violates longstanding bans on foreign aid to non-signatories to the Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty (NPT) with nuclear weapons programs, the lawsuit alleges."CONTINUED

 

Do they understand why its done? Is there a coherent narrative that explains the reasoning behind the strategy?

 

Thanks for asking.

No, most Americans are clueless of the degree to which they are so extensively exploited because America's pro Israel MSM (1) refuses to cover or "provide a coherent narrative that explains the reasoning behind the strategy" as you stated so well.

In the rare instances in which a US politician raises the issue of such extravagant "aid" to one of the wealthiest countries in the world, they are widely and loudly scolded as being "anti Semites" by our AIPAC controlled politicians & complicit MSM.

Do people in Scotland wonder why the US Government is virtually controlled by the 100+ Zionist lobbies or are the under the illusion that American people don't mind sacrificing blood & endless resources for such a thankless entity?



(1) “U.S. media coverage reveals a pro-Israel bias”
http://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2014/09/01/commentary/world-commentary/u-s-media-coverage-reveals-a-pro-israel-bias/#.WMLm5mafK_U


EXCERPT “Why does TV news look like a Netanyahu ad?” asked Chris McGreal of The Guardian on July 31, in his article on the “notoriously pro-Israel mainstream media in the U.S.”

Meanwhile, the Wall Street Journal dispelled any doubt about which side it was on. On Aug. 2-3, its Review section gave a two-page spread — “In Defense of Zionism” — against an oversize photo of a flag-raising ceremony in Israel, in 1948.”CONTINUED

 

so you're saying the Jews control the USA?

 

is this not a function of the lobby groups being activated in order to maintain momentum for support of Israeli interests from the senate/congress and indeed other interested parties?
Although I would not question at this stage the dynamics of the US political lobby structure it does seem that by creating this Israeli surrogate/ally (whatever you want call it) the precedent has been set ergo you create the need to maintain the commitment to it via an active lobby group. Creating political and diplomatic relationships comes with strings attached and weather vanning or prevaricating over that relationship has consequences with your other allies. Just a thought.
There are posts above that suggest that Netanyahu was a having a pop at the US but then again so what. Ministers and Governments in Israel are ten a penny and generally based on very tenuous coalitions of conflicting views so one would suggest that if indeed he did say what is suggested then it was aimed at a certain sector of his audience. I think that Israel knows fine well it would be buggered 5 ways from Sunday if they lost that US support.
I personally think that the US/Israel accord is ultimately to the benefit of the US, certainly in terms of the intelligence trade off it gets from for the "fight against terrorism". I am pretty sure that without the assistance of MOSSAD there would certainly be a lot of navel gazing going on within the various intelligence organs in the US when confronted with Presidents demanding information and solutions to problems.

 

Sorry that I am late to take word here!

I have no sympathy for the decision of the German Parliament here!
It always annoys me excessively when our political idiots ... but also many other idiots in the world ... connect anti-Israel with anti-Semitic and present it as one and the same!

This is pure censorship for me, because it is the secret attempt to defame any legitimate criticism of Israel and its actions as "anti-Semitism"!
Israeli "settlers" once again occupy the land of a Palestinian in the West Bank and build an illegal settlement there and the Israeli state not only allows them to grant, but also supports and legitimizes that ... and protects these settler terrorists!
Criticism is then automatically "hatred of Jews" = anti-Semitic ... I could puke!

 

BDS seeks the political destruction of the Jewish State.

surely very few Israelis want such a thing

 

Unfortunately, I only have time to address 2 points you raised in your thoughtful Post.

Re:

Israel's right wing regimes have betrayed America so frequently & Israel is the 19th richest country in the world. Israel's multiple, ongoing betrayals, alone, abrogate any commitment the US may have engendered and the 19th richest country in the world certainly doesn't need US "aid"

Re:

Any intelligence that the Israelis pass on to the US is grossly unreliable & restricted to getting the US to do Israel's bidding.
For example, Victor Ostrovsky's book "By Way of Deception" reveals that the Israelis had foreknowledge of the Marine barracks bombing in Lebanon but refused to pass on the Intelligence that would have saved hundreds of American lives.(1)

Actually, Israel is a far greater threat to America than asset in that they steal America's secrets like no other country in the world(2) and sell them to China(3).

At least Netanyahu accurately described the true nature of the US - Israeli alliance:

Netanyahu: “Once we squeeze all we can out of the United States, it can dry up and blow away”

http://web.archive.org/web/20060512234448/http://www.onlinejournal.org/Special_Reports/



(1) "More Real History Revealed: Did Israel Deliberately Allow 241 American Marines To Die? (1983 Marine Barracks Bombing)"
http://northerntruthseeker.blogspot.com/2010/10/more-real-history-revealed-did-israel.html

EXCERPT "Yes, says Victor Ostrovsky, a former Israeli secret agent. In a new book, By Way of Deception: A Devastating Insider's Portrait of the Mossad, Mr. Ostrovsky says the Israelis had advance notice of the suicide attack that killed 241 Marines in Beirut in October 1983 but withheld the information from the United States in the hope that the attack would poison American Arab relations.

The Israeli government is desperately trying to block publication of the book, which also says the Israelis are "actively spying, recruiting, organizing and carrying out covert activities mainly in New York and Washington, which they refer to as their playground."CONTINUED


(2) "ISRAEL WON'T STOP SPYING ON THE US"
http://www.newsweek.com/2014/05/16/israel-wont-stop-spying-us-249757.html

EXCERPT "The Jewish state’s primary target: America’s industrial and technical secrets.
“No other country close to the United States continues to cross the line on espionage like the Israelis do,” said a former congressional staffer who attended another classified briefing in late 2013, one of several in recent months given by officials from the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), the State Department, the FBI and the National Counterintelligence Directorate. "CONTINUED


(3) "Report: Israel Passes U.S. Military Technology to China"
https://www.military.com/defensetec...srael-passes-u-s-military-technology-to-china

EXCERPT "Israel has a long record of getting U.S. military technology to China.
In the early 1990s then-CIA Director James Woolsey told a Senate Government Affairs Committee that Israel had been selling U.S. secrets to China for about a decade."CONTINUED

 

quite possibly but what of the other "wings" are they as duplicitous? Somewhat generalising I know but from what one gathers about the relationship with the US and Israel it seems to be of mutual benefit. I know the US has financial interests in Israel (which to some in the US seems to be a waste of money) but one assumes that these are to the benefit of both the larger strategic and quite possibly diplomatic dynamics of the US; a bit like the situation with China holding the leash of its attack dog North Korea. By holding a balance of influence with Israel it gives the US a muzzled proxy for US purposes in the Middle East and until the strategic importance of the region wanes then one assumes that the US will maintain that relationship.

I'm sure Mr. Ostrovsky has many tales to tell and am sure that there are instances where certain actions if taken could have saved lives but to what cost? Who knows what the ramifications of sharing or disseminating or acting upon such intelligence would have been. One doesn't have to look too hard to see intelligence failures, for example, the UK and dodgy dossiers that got us into a bit of a pickle in Iraq. And on of course there are certain lines of narrative that suggest the FBI and CIA missed the 9/11 attacks and I'm sure there are many others as well. If we assume that all lines of inter-government communication are perfect and all analysis is perfect and all government organs are perfect with their perfect functionaries then I think perhaps we fool ourselves into a false sense of security; and in any case 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing and is sure to sell books but to be honest its a real waste of time when looking into complex situations.

yes I've seen that posted above and to be frank....so what? He's playing to a gallery that absorb such comments and am sure they liked what they heard and voted for him...mischief managed and no harm done.

I assume its easier to make it look like "spying" rather than the US giving Israel technology which would presumably incur diplomatic repercussions from the various State Actors in the region. Its a clever narrative if you ask me.

 

More repression of free political thought in Germany - calling those with a different view to the German Government's accepted one 'antisemetic' and threatening them with prison for their political views.

https://electronicintifada.net/blog...ns-journalist-prison-speaking-about-palestine

All Western Countries by fair means and foul and being encouraged to end freedom of speech on the actions of the State of Israel. Germany though does seem to be one of the worse in this and it should be noted that without question this is political and an attack on Jews who criticise Israel which is ever growing in Number. Some years ago Germany stopped Jews Max Blumenthall and I think it was DaN Cohen from speaking in Israel on the 2014 Israel attack on Gaza, something which they had put massive research into. Just like with Barakat Germany called these two Jews antisemites.

 

As I've already said, I have absolutely no understanding of the behavior of my government and politics toward Israel!

However, there is unfortunately ... and I emphasize the word "unfortunately" ... always the mass murder of 6,000,000 Jews by the Nazis, which basically plays a role and kills every fairness in any matter regarding Israel.
Damn it ... aside fact that my ancestors were in the concentration camp and were partly killed by the Nazis too there, or they actively fought against Hitler etc. ... the whole thing is 70 years ago and if the Nazis cromes create a Woldcard for Israel in my country, that any well justified criticism of Israel twill be suppressed with ... then I can just puke!

 

Well on this Germany is not alone. Remember prior to 9/11 Germany and the EU were actively working for a 2 state solution and understanding of the position of the Palestinians was strong. Hence in order to sort out the problem of Hamas the EU put in experts in conflict resolution. They did not just say bad Hamas, Israel can take all of the Palestinians land now. This changed when Blair managed to get Germany and from there the EU to change their attitude towards Hamas and in effect no longer work for the two state solution.

Then there is the intent to see all Jews as Israeli. Without question this is pushed by the Israeli Government and I have read is strongly felt in Germany. Seeing all Jews as being Israeli is the foundation on which a charge of antisemitism can be given to those who criticise Israel though even if that were true, it would still not necessarily be correct that the reason people were criticising Israel was due to antisemitism. Obviously there is also a double edge to this as should the situation prove desirable Jews, even ones who have lived all their lives in Europe or the US could be deported 'home'.

Incidentally seeing all Jews as responsible for the actions of Israel, that is identifying all Jews with Israel is also considered highly antisemetic - and correctly so. There are two diametrically opposed conceptions of antisemitism here.

In the UK they are strongly pushing that criticism of Israel is antisemetic at the moment due to the fear of Corbyn being PM. It is even claimed to be antisemetic to say this is a deliberate smearing campaign.

I can see that Germany could be more emotionally vulnerable to this but they are not alone in this and it is getting to a point now where it is threatening the values of democracy.

I suspect there is also a question of what our Governments are getting from taking this undemocratic position.

 

Without question ...
The basic problem is that anti-Israel is unfortunately NOT being separated from anti-Semitic as it should!

Anyone who criticizes the too often shameful behavior of the state of Israel towards the Palestinians, this person is not an anti-Semite ... So Jew-hater! No, the one who criticizes the state of Israel and its actions and makes not hate speech against the religion of the Jews!

As long as this is not considered separated and this without exception, we have a problem!
And unfortunately. .. I have to say that ... the state of Israel is very active in acting that this separation should not exist. because Israel wants to prevent any criticism against them with the manslaughter argument of "it is anti-Semitic"!

I can still remember of an issue many years ago when Israel bombed the Hezbollah in Lebanon very heavy and hig rank politician in Gemrnay made the critic against Israel that hey used cluster bombs ... you know this stuff of hiundred of minibombs which do not all explode when being dropped and which are then like a mine field and kill many civilians.
Isreal was so impudent to deny to have used cluster bombs ... even photos of French and Chinese UN troops in Lebanon show that they are found and removed by them. So the German poilitician made the comment "Well ... so you Israelis deny to have used cluster bombs ... means that Hezbollah has dropped on their onw with their non existing Hezbollah Air Force cluster bombs?".

Wooops ... she was accused to be evil antisemitic! But ... what was here antisemitic again?