God demands nothing and life is not a fight

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Greenleft, Aug 28, 2021.

  1. Greenleft

    Greenleft Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2013
    Messages:
    1,418
    Likes Received:
    388
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Gender:
    Male
    This is my first thread where I will discuss part of my new spiritual views.

    I do not believe life is a struggle against our wretched base instincts. Unless you are born with a second Y chromosome which makes you prone to extreme violence, I have no urge to commit acts of violence. I do have thoughts of sexuality and committing violence, but I do not believe in a God who demands you struggle against your thoughts.

    To do acts of violence or what people perceive as sexual immorality requires correction, but it's not an outright war. Nobody else ought to be crusaders against evil. Instead, when we embrace love, evil will go away.

    I do not believe in a God who gets angry because to get angry suggests weakness of control. If you believe God is all powerful and all loving, you can take it for granted that good will prevail.

    I also do not believe in a God of sacrifice. I do not believe God demands you sacrifice physical pleasures, sacrifice feelings of self-worth, sacrifice relationships or sacrifice material possessions. That's not to say you embrace materialism and become narcissistic because in the case of the former, it makes life a struggle and a fight to obtain and keep things and in the case of the latter that is a sacrifice against loving others.

    I do not believe Satan is whispering things into your ear and you need to block his voice out. Which is why study of other religious persuasions is not evil nor is study of evolution. Life is not us versus them where we have to be in a bubble to separate the evil OTHERS.

    All human beings are children of God. There is no such thing as God's Elect. All you need to do is ask for love, and it shall be granted. No need for elaborate rituals and ceremonies of any of the world's religions to appease God.

    Now after everything I have said, you might be asking "Well what about all the evil done in the world and things like cancer?" Well for the latter I would say yes, life is a struggle against natural forces but for the former I would say that while evil needs correction, we need not fear it or struggle and fight in a desperate attempt to save our own souls and the souls of others. We can be confident that salvation is a given if we but ask and we can also be confident that good will prevail.

    If any atheists or theists disagree with anything said here, I'd be interested to read about it.

     
    pitbull and modernpaladin like this.
  2. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    116,316
    Likes Received:
    44,289
    Trophy Points:
    113
    God demands nothing, as he is fictional, but the writers of the Abrahamic religions did

    if there is a God, he is more like this - definitely not a jealous vengeful God

    http://www.tfd.com/deists

    deĀ·ism (dzm, d-)
    n.
    The belief, based solely on reason, in a God who created the universe and then abandoned it, assuming no control over life, exerting no influence on natural phenomena, and giving no supernatural revelation.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2021
  3. MJ Davies

    MJ Davies Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    13,167
    Likes Received:
    12,624
    Trophy Points:
    113
    God, as the identity you describe, doesn't exist. God(s) are borne of man's need to explain the inexplicable.

    Human are pack animals so we seek out the packs that align most with our beliefs. That's basic human instinct.
     
    crank and The Wyrd of Gawd like this.
  4. Greenleft

    Greenleft Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2013
    Messages:
    1,418
    Likes Received:
    388
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Gender:
    Male
    You may very well be right. However I don't see how much you really have to add to the discussion. If God does not exist, that's basically the final word on the conversation.

    I prefer to compare my beliefs to other theists and make the claim that my way of thinking is friendlier and healthier than many other theists.

    Atheists could try to tell me why my ideas are bad for the collective well being of society on an equal level to Christians and Muslims.
     
  5. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 15, 2017
    Messages:
    22,479
    Likes Received:
    6,919
    Trophy Points:
    113
    If you love someone, you will get angry when another harms them.

    I believe love and anger are inherently connected, in a way.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2021
  6. JET3534

    JET3534 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2014
    Messages:
    9,198
    Likes Received:
    7,207
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You say what you believe, but not why. Saying things like "all human beings are children of God" is an extraordinary claim. Do you have any evidence to support this claim?
     
  7. JET3534

    JET3534 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2014
    Messages:
    9,198
    Likes Received:
    7,207
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yes. Humans have a very low tolerance for ambiguity, uncertainty and not being in complete control of their future. Thus, the need to petition a supernatural being with sacrifice (either a virgin thrown in a well or Jesus) and prayer.
     
  8. MJ Davies

    MJ Davies Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    13,167
    Likes Received:
    12,624
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Maybe should consider contacting the mods and ask to have the last sentence of your OP deleted.
     
  9. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2018
    Messages:
    25,379
    Likes Received:
    24,429
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Well if you make any thread remotely demonizing the Christian religion you can be sure that he will show up.

    I certainly do believe in a creator, in fact it's far more irrational to think that all of this just came about just randomly.
     
    Injeun likes this.
  10. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2018
    Messages:
    25,379
    Likes Received:
    24,429
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I do believe that which we call evil, feeds off of two things primarily fear and anger. The more you feed it the more it manifest ultimately into hate.
     
  11. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2017
    Messages:
    19,553
    Likes Received:
    14,520
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I think 'good will prevail' but that needs a qualifier. I think God 'rapturing' us all up to His heaven is merely the backup plan if we fail to conquer evil. We have it within us to build a flourishing society that is prosperous, enjoyable and enlightening for all. We also have it within us to not do that... I believe most people are generally good, but I believe the few that are truly evil seek to essentially 'force God's hand' in ending this great experiment(floabt) of creation by ruining humanity's capacity to direct its will toward the developement of our own 'heaven' and instead stagnate us in perpetual servitude and misery. As more and more resource continues to consolidate into the hands of fewer and fewer people, as more and more 'destabilizing' technologies are suppressed and prevented from helping us progress, as rates of mental illness continue to climb and as the peoples of the world lose more and more of their freedom- aka their ability to exercise their will, it would seem that evil is winning. And I think we have quite the epic struggle ahead of us yet if we're to prevent it from doing so. I do agree that if we fail to conquer evil, then God will still do it for us by saving us via the methods allegorized in Revelations. But would that really be a win? I don't want God to save us from evil. I want us to beat it ourselves. Even if it takes a million million years.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2021
    Injeun likes this.
  12. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2020
    Messages:
    3,964
    Likes Received:
    1,798
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I'm not sure of my classification, though I guess I am a theist, albeit one whose non-standard image of God has been subject to change, and is not as distinct in my mind's eye, as it has been in the past. But what occasioned my reply, was your attitude, with which my own is in near diametrical opposition. From the sound of it, you view being "friendlier and healthier," as boast-worthy, or at least desirable, attributes of one's religious beliefs. To my own perspective, the highest ideal has always been Truth. That is, I would embrace what seemed true, even if it was antagonistic and pernicious, ahead of what seemed would be the most beneficial thing to believe as truth, even if it was not.

    Since I have long understood that there is no way I could ever be sure how much truth, if any, was contained in my conceptions, I guess there is more logic, in the way you have chosen to view things. I just couldn't get myself to believe something, unless it resonated for me, as True.
     
  13. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2018
    Messages:
    25,379
    Likes Received:
    24,429
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    "Drawing down Heaven" if you will. Create the heaven you seek in THIS life and not have to die to see it/be it...
    Is there even a "death" at all? I don't think so. My belief is we are eternal beings, death being birth, birth being death....the only "substance" to it is this veil we enter as we exit one door to enter into another.

    I did not just come to be the moment of my conception. Before I am, I was....where? I can't say for certain or prove it but I'm certain of it. World without end Amen

    We cant see over the horizon and each day of our life brings a new horizon with each sunrise. Life, a series of new horizons each day.

    Thusly, do I see death, just one more in a never ending series of new horizons and sunrises and sunsets.
     
    Injeun likes this.
  14. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2018
    Messages:
    2,431
    Likes Received:
    696
    Trophy Points:
    113
    In other words, a god is whatever you "think" it is?
     
    Injeun likes this.
  15. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2017
    Messages:
    19,553
    Likes Received:
    14,520
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Its either that, or its whatever somebody else thinks it is... I dunno about you, but I'm definitely more qualified than anyone else to interpret my own spirituality.
     
    Injeun likes this.
  16. MJ Davies

    MJ Davies Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    13,167
    Likes Received:
    12,624
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Why do I stay on your mind constantly?
     
  17. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2018
    Messages:
    25,379
    Likes Received:
    24,429
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I remember your extremely bigoted post attacking Christians in another thread. Are you ashamed of it?
     
  18. MJ Davies

    MJ Davies Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    13,167
    Likes Received:
    12,624
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Nope. I think Christians should be ashamed of being self-righteous, judgmental, evil, hypocritical and annoying. When any of that scum goes first, I will. In other words, NOT happening.
     
  19. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2018
    Messages:
    25,379
    Likes Received:
    24,429
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Wow, you mean Christians are human beings much like other humans? Let the hate flow thru you. How do you feel about Muslims?

    You know your beloved Biden and many top Dems are said to be Christians, right?
     
  20. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2018
    Messages:
    2,431
    Likes Received:
    696
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Spirituality is a sense of connection to something much larger than yourself and as I noted a god seems to be whatever you imagine it to be and you agree. So it is more a personal philosophical concept than an actual entity if it can be defined anyway you like.
     
  21. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2017
    Messages:
    19,553
    Likes Received:
    14,520
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Sure, if thats what you truly believe... Not me though.
     
  22. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2018
    Messages:
    25,379
    Likes Received:
    24,429
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    How I see birth and death and being eternal beings.

    [​IMG]
     
  23. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2012
    Messages:
    9,371
    Likes Received:
    4,060
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I take it that these are your personal beliefs which represent neither Christianity nor any other organized religion. I won't take issue with the particulars of your beliefs. But I will say that I believe in Jesus Christ and the Gospel he taught. Of late, to me the most astonishing doctrine he taught is that man must be born again of water and spirit to see/enter the kingdom of heaven.
     
  24. Cougarbear

    Cougarbear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    2,407
    Likes Received:
    1,113
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    And that is why God's anger is kindled in the scriptures.
     
  25. Cougarbear

    Cougarbear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    2,407
    Likes Received:
    1,113
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I often wonder about a person's belief in God when they spend countless hours deciding who God is, what he is, what are his thoughts, how should we approach God and so on. Do we have the right to put limits, expectations and human conditions on God? What if God gets angry at sinners who will not repent and destroy the faith of those who believe in God? What if God requires some sacrifice of time, talents, money and pleasures? What if Satan's purpose is to continually tempt God's human children to pull them away from God eternally? What if we are required to help others in their spiritual quest? What if God requires works to show faith by being baptized and receiving the Holy Ghost by way of Priesthood ordinances?
     

Share This Page