here's one reason women should have to go through a pregnancy

Some have argued "Why should women have to deal with a pregnancy? It's their bodies."

Well here's something to think about. Their mother gave life to them.
The woman wouldn't even be alive today or have any rights if it wasn't for her mother who chose to go through a pregnancy.

So the woman owes it to her child to give life, to pass the favor on to the next generation.

 

Not a rationale unless you apply it equally to both sexs

 

I believe the father has to pay child support.

Anyway, men generally don't get pregnant, so I'm not sure what you'd be asking the father to do. And I never said people are obligated to conceive a child.

 

But they could

That has been established for decades on experiments with mice


Best place to place the embryo so it will continue development. In the scrotal sac

 

It wouldn't really be natural though.

I believe asking a man to be pumped full of gender-changing hormones and having a sac surgically inserted into his lower abdomen is very different from asking a woman to go through with a pregnancy that already exists inside her body. And where is that baby going to come out??
More likely than not it's going to be an automatic C-section. I'm not saying women never have to go through C-sections, but I believe the procedure is drastically overused today and in the vast majority of cases where it is used it was not truly necessary.

 

Still possible

And if you are insisting that women have to continue a pregnancy they do not want then why can we not insist that men do thier fair share

Imagine 9 months of being kicked in the...........

 

The argument would be a lot weaker if the seed had been started without their permission.

Well the uterus is designed like a punching bag, it's very elastic.
So it can take it.

Anyway, abortion can commonly leave scarring on the inside of a woman's uterus, with all that scraping, so we're not really talking about a better option here.

 

The question's answer is simple. Did the child rape the mother? Nope. This is the hardest question of all is should a woman be forced to carry an rapist seed. I know how most feel about that, but it is like your brother robbing a 7-11 and they throw you in jail, even though you live a 1000 miles away. The baby, once created, is as good of a clump of cells as you are today. It goes to reason then, that if they can kill you in the first trimester, or they can kill you in the 100th trimester, you are both just a clump of cells.

 

But pro-choicers believe a woman should be able to change her mind and abort even if she went to a fertility clinic or sperm bank to get pregnant, so that's completely besides the point.

 

Yes, the rape thing is a difficult choice to say legal or illegal. I pondered that for the longest time. But again, it comes down to no one but the rapist's fault, but can you kill the child for what his father did? Do the sins of the father go through to the child???

 

The ERA never passed.

 

Pregnancy, childbirth, sex, and abortion are extremely personal situations for individuals....and need to be respected as such. It is none of my or your business what a stranger does in ANY of these things as long as consenting adults are involved and laws not broken. In my opinion those who decide to disrespect this personal space for whatever reason are egotistical busybodies or religious nut jobs.

 

There seems to be so much wrong with that logic. For a start, the implication is that everyone (male and female) has an unconditional responsibility to have children because we all had mothers.

I'm not clear what the responsibility you're asserting actually is though. The implication would be that it is to have children at some point, which wouldn't exclude abortion entirely, especially if the woman already has children.

Also, I know someone whose mother died giving birth to her. Does that give her a responsibility to do the same for her own children?

 

So if a robber shoots and kills the teller at the bank in a robbery, it is an extremely personal situation between two individuals and should be respected as such. An abortion is NOT between two consenting adults, it is simply the murder of a child. None of our business??? If they can kill that clump of cells, then they can kill the clump of cells you or I are. That is how genocides are done, you devalue the people and call them some form of "undesirables", and then exterminate them.
Now maybe you can understand these mass killers. Other people are just a clump of cells, and are expendable for the murders "personal goals".

 

It would seem you selectively read my commentary without understanding the "Consenting Adult" and "Laws not broken" parts.

 

Since a very large proportion of women seeking abortions were using contraception I would say the seed DID start without thier permission

And now come on about the punching bag. I mean does any part of the anatomy look MORE like a punching bag than the scrotum?

 

God/Mother Nature/ human physiology is the greatest abortionist since most of those clumps of cells end up on a sanitary product

 

Oh, for pete's sake!


What illogical misogynistic horse puckey crap!!!

Stick to your "Panda Bears as A Reason to Ban abortions" ..even that made more sense......and it made NO sense...



Is this going to be another thread you start but run from when it's pointed out how wrong you are again???

 

Yup, there's a lot of that """egotistical busybodies or religious nut jobs"" going on in this thread ...


I just will never understand how anyone thinks they should be the Ruler of Women and control them like cattle....but then I'm not terrified of women as they are

 

Should the CRIME of the rapist be used as an excuse to PUNISH the raped woman for the rest of her life? Do you EVER think of the woman, you know, the one who has to be pregnant??/Ever???


Should you punish the woman for what the rapist did?????

 

"""" If they can kill that clump of cells, then they can kill the clump of cells you or I are."""

If they can force pregnant women to use their body to sustain the life of another they can force anyone to do the same....someday YOU could be FORCED to give your heart or kidneys or blood or any body part to someone else who has more money and power...Do you want to do that?

 

Especially than one being aborted.

Ok, I acknowledge the slippery slope. But we're not asking the woman to permanently give up any bodily organs, just some nutrients... and provide motel accommodation to someone else in one of her organs for 9 months.

A fetus is the very opposite of someone with money and power.

The slippery slope I see, if a woman can kill her own child what's to say she can't kill you or me? Once we start making exceptions, we legitimize murder.
And if a fetus doesn't have any rights to life, who's to say the woman does?
We already live in a society that doesn't always place a lot of value on personal choice (outside the abortion arena). Who's to say in some dystopian future women won't be required to abort? We're already seeing this in China. The latest scheme, I just read the other day, they're going to be taking away social points from women if they don't meet family planning restrictions (among other things like too many parking tickets or sharing "unverified" news stories on the internet), and if those points add up that could theoretically lead to a woman being barred from going on the train, not being able to send her other children to a good school, being barred from getting a government job, etc. Well if they don't value unborn life, it's hardly surprising they'd be requiring women to abort it. I'm just saying, we can already see that dystopian future arriving, in the most populated country on earth.

 

The fetus is NOT an individual (person with rights) The thinking person is the one with the rights that need to be respected, the fetus has NO rights.

You show NO respect for born persons (pregnant women), TSK, TSK!)

No, you're trying to FORCE her to suffer temporary and permanent pain and lifelong damage to her body...how barbaric!!

And to say that all she gives up is 'some nutrients" shows a total lack of knowledge of what pregnancy and child birth entail.....

...and YOU would volunteer for that?

Irrelevant gibberish.

Abortion is not killing a "child".....so you're wrong right there as usual

.... and abortion has been around for thousands of years and most murders are NOT legitimized.


She can't kill "you and me" because we are persons with rights.....a fetus has no rights....it is not a person and you have been shown that a hundred times,,,,too bad you can't catch on..



Here is yet another question you can't address:


If they can force pregnant women to use their body to sustain the life of another they can force anyone to do the same....someday YOU could be FORCED to give your heart or kidneys or blood or any body part to someone else who has more money and power...Do you want to do that?

 

If I had a uterus and there was already a baby growing inside of me.

Don't you think that's a little melodramatic?

I realize pregnancy is not just a cakewalk. But it's not some lifelong debilitating thing either. Pregnancy is perfectly natural. Some women have been pregnant 12 times and don't show any ill effects because of it.

 

Ya, easy to say because you know it will never happen........and even if you actually would why do you think you should force other to do that?


BTW, your total lack of knowledge of what constitutes pregnancy is showing again...iy involves more than a uterus..

I doubt you would volunteer for:

Normal, frequent or expectable temporary side effects of pregnancy:

• exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
• altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
• nausea and vomiting (50% of women, first trimester)
• heartburn and indigestion
• constipation
• weight gain
• dizziness and light-headedness
• bloating, swelling, fluid retention
• hemmorhoids
• abdominal cramps
• yeast infections
• congested, bloody nose
• acne and mild skin disorders
• skin discoloration (chloasma, face and abdomen)
• mild to severe backache and strain
• increased headaches
• difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
• increased urination and incontinence
• bleeding gums
• pica
• breast pain and discharge
• swelling of joints, leg cramps, joint paininfection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
  (pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant women, and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases)
• extreme pain on delivery
• hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum depression
• continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period (exacerbated if a c-section -- major surgery -- is required, sometimes taking up to a full year to fully recover)

Normal, expectable, or frequent PERMANENT side effects of pregnancy:

• stretch marks (worse in younger women)
• loose skin
• permanent weight gain or redistribution
• abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
• pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers, associated with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and reduced quality of life -- aka prolapsed utuerus, the malady sometimes badly fixed by the transvaginal mesh)
• changes to breasts
• increased foot size
• varicose veins
• scarring from episiotomy or c-section
• other permanent aesthetic changes to the body (all of these are downplayed by women, because the culture values youth and beauty)
• increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
• loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)
• higher lifetime risk of developing Altzheimer's
• newer research indicates microchimeric cells, other bi-directional exchanges of DNA, chromosomes, and other bodily material between fetus and mother (including with "unrelated" gestational surrogates)

Occasional complications and side effects:

• complications of episiotomy
• spousal/partner abuse
• hyperemesis gravidarum
• temporary and permanent injury to back
• severe scarring requiring later surgery
  (especially after additional pregnancies)
• dropped (prolapsed) uterus (especially after additional pregnancies, and other pelvic floor weaknesses -- 11% of women, including cystocele, rectocele, and enterocele)
• pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication of pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of pregnancies)
• eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of death)
• gestational diabetes
• placenta previa
• anemia (which can be life-threatening)
• thrombocytopenic purpura
• severe cramping
• embolism (blood clots)
• medical disability requiring full bed rest (frequently ordered during part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of either mother or baby)
• diastasis recti, also torn abdominal muscles
• mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
• serious infection and disease (e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis)
• hormonal imbalance
• ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
• broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
• hemorrhage and
• numerous other complications of delivery
• refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
• aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions (e.g. epilepsy is present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the number and frequency of seizures)
• severe post-partum depression and psychosis
• research now indicates a possible link between ovarian cancer and female fertility treatments, including "egg harvesting" from infertile women and donors
• research also now indicates correlations between lower breast cancer survival rates and proximity in time to onset of cancer of last pregnancy
• research also indicates a correlation between having six or more pregnancies and a risk of coronary and cardiovascular disease

Less common (but serious) complications:

• peripartum cardiomyopathy
• cardiopulmonary arrest
• magnesium toxicity
• severe hypoxemia/acidosis
• massive embolism
• increased intracranial pressure, brainstem infarction
• molar pregnancy, gestational trophoblastic disease
  (like a pregnancy-induced cancer)
• malignant arrhythmia
• circulatory collapse
• placental abruption
• obstetric fistula

More permanent side effects:

• future infertility
• permanent disability
• death.