How to ban guns without firing a single shot...

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Golem, May 25, 2022.

  1. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    To be clear, I don't think banning all guns is possible in this country in any of our lifetimes. So relax. But we might be able to reduce the number of mass shootings by banning some.

    Be sure to read at the end of this post some silly and irrelevant arguments that some have made in the past, so you don't repeat them. But if you do, I'll just refer you to the proper "Irrelevant argument" number.

    Remember: there is likely NO way to stop ALL mass shootings. But the idea here is to make them more difficult. So that there are less shootings. And when shootings are unavoidable, that less people get killed.

    The whole process will take years... maybe decades. But we need to start now!

    All we want to do is make mass shooting more difficult.

    I posted most of these several years ago, but I added some.

    1- Ban the sale to the public of "assault weapons". As well as parts and ammunition. Reinstate the Assault Weapon ban.
    2- No confiscation (except what is already in the law). But adopt a voluntary buy-back program with strong compensation, for guns and ammunition.
    3- Ban so-called "cop-killing" bullets
    4- Ban the sale of high-capacity magazines
    5- Ban ghost guns
    6- Require a license to buy any firearm and ammunition.
    7- Require a "graduation process" to obtain and maintain a gun license.
    8- Mandatory buy back program for weapons acquired with a license for anybody who fails to renew their license.
    9- Implement a federal mandatory background check for all gun sales. No loopholes. And hold private sellers accountable if the gun sold without a check or to an unlicensed buyer is used in a crime.
    10- Give courts the authority to confiscate guns from people who they consider a threat to themselves and others. (Red Flag Law)
    11- Raise the age limit for buying any kind of guns to 21 (at least)
    12- Implement strong nationwide cash-for-guns programs focusing primarily on assault weapons.
    13- Repeal the PLCAA and investigate gun manufacturers and gun lobbyists' role in passing it.
    14- Require manufacturers to alter design of guns sold to public to make them as difficult to be modified as possible.
    15- Declare gun violence a preventable public health problem. Give the CDC funding an resources to study the relation between certain mental illnesses and gun violence.
    16- Repeal DoC v Heller given that the decision is based on factual historical and linguistic inaccuracies.

    Please spare me the following absurd or irrelevant arguments

    Irrelevant argument 1: People can print their guns: Sure... but that would be more difficult than just running down to the store. And many crazy people won't know HOW to print a gun.

    Irrelevant argument 2: They can kill people with .... (cars, bombs, knives, forks...): Read the sentence in "bold" at the top. It's HARDER to kill a lot of people with any of those items, than it is with a gun. Learning how to pull a trigger is easier than learning how to make a bomb without blowing yourself up in the process.

    Irrelevant argument 3: You can't stop ALL shootings: Then we don't! That doesn't mean we can't stop ANY shootings.

    Irrelevant argument 4: Guns don't kill people... people kill people: Bullshit!!

    Irrelevant argument 5: But but but... the 2nd Amendment: Start here http://www.politicalforum.com/index.php?threads/history-101-why-the-2nd-amendment.586263/

    Irrelevant argument 6: This xxxx [bump stock, cop killer bullets, assault rifles, ...] don't exist: MORE Bullshit! They do!

    Irrelevant argument 7: What we need is more guns, not less (and variations like "arm teachers" and similar): There are more guns than there are people. So we have tried this. It hasn't worked! Countries have done the contrary (Australia, UK, Japan, ...etc) and it HAS worked.

    Irrelevant argument 8: This is just a mental issue: There are as many nuts in other countries as there are in this one. And NO country has anywhere near as many shootings as we do (119 school shootings in the U.S. since 2019. 27 so far this year. Second place: Mexico with 17 since 2004!)
     
  2. Condor060

    Condor060 Well-Known Member Donor

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    Your attack is on guns, not people who use them for harm.
    So I can tell you how to turn this around in a much shorter time with amazing results.

    Most people like yourself have no clue you brought this on yourselves.
    Your following eliminated all corporal punishment in schools allowing kids to not only abusive the teaching staff, but to attack teachers with no fear of any retribution.
    Your following decided spanking children is a bad thing thus also emboldened them without fear to do what they want.
    Your following decided that no child can lose as everyone gets a trophy thus eliminating their ability to deal with the reality of the real world.
    Your following has coddled these children to the point they have no idea what the real world is like and unable to deal with real world situations

    Before your following decided to coddle these children, we used to bring guns to school right in the windows of our trucks for hunting
    We didn't have school shootings anywhere near what we have now and as a matter of fact, I can't think of a single one from 1966 through 1978.

    Now they have created entire generations of entitled children who think they are all owed something unable to deal with reality and are personally destroyed at most turns in their real life.

    These children have no respect for teachers, law enforcement, their own parents or even themselves. Hence why the latest shooter murdered his own grandmother before going on his shooting spree and he isn't the first by far.

    There is no gun legislation that will slow these down in the slightest. You know it and so does everyone else. If you really want to address the real problem, its the people losing their sanity to attack and murder children and people of a certain race without provocation and without any remorse what so ever. As the history of this country goes, this was all unheard of until the last 20 years.

    Allow teachers to employ corporal punishment getting these children back in line which is only used on the violent offenders as was the case in my school career.
    Stop coddling these kids and exposing them to political issues they have no business being involved in, in the first place.
    Mandatory arrest of anyone caught with drugs at schools
    Only punish the aggressors of fights instead of anyone involved. That idiocy was only invented to keep the schools from making decisions. Cowardly.

    If you don't want your precious child to account for their behavior in class, then you can home school.

    Teaching these coddled children respect and fear for their violent reactions against students will stop this pattern of kids killing kids by the largest percentage.
     
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  3. Lee Atwater

    Lee Atwater Well-Known Member Donor

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    The Repub plan for handling gun violence........say emotions are running too high to do anything right away.........say it's a mental illness problem.........say guns don't kill pe...........stoke fear that "they're coming for your guns".........essentially employ all the old delaying tactics and hope it will result in nothing being done.

    When the next atrocity comes, rinse and repeat.
     
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  4. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    Read point 15 and Irrelevant Argument 4 in OP.
     
  5. Condor060

    Condor060 Well-Known Member Donor

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    Oh, did you think because you made up a list of what doesn't fly for you that magically, what you posted was the only solution?
    Thats funny
     
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  6. Tipper101

    Tipper101 Well-Known Member

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    School shootings are predominantly performed by kids younger than 25, and I would agree that a higher age restriction is needed to allow for more time for red flags and the stupidity and impulsiveness of younger ages to weed themselves out, as there often is no criminal history to otherwise prevent them from legally obtaining guns.

    couple a higher age restriction with coming down really hard on owners like parents who allow unsupervised access to their guns in the event a crime is committed with them, and I think we would see results in the school shooting category.

    However micromanaging guns themselves like magazine size is virtually worthless.
     
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  7. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    would you want someone else spanking and issuing corporal punishment to your child?

    that was banned as teachers abused it, for pushing religion, sexual or other reasons

    my great grandma had issues with her knuckles all her life from being hit with a ruler by nuns

    what about a "woke" teacher cracking a childs knuckles for not supporting the teachers diversity views, ect.....
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022
  8. submarinepainter

    submarinepainter Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ban is in your proposal way too much how about effing parents start doing it!
    Start getting guns out of the gangs AND I will turn mine in.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022
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  9. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    end the war on drugs, stop funding gangs

    back when alcohol was illegal it was dangerous for kids to go into the woods as might run across a still
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022
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  10. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You want to ban weapons because they look like weapons of war.
    Requiring a license will not prevent anything. We require a license to drive a car. That does not prevent some nut from taking the car and driving through a crowd.
    Agree.
    I have seen nothing that shows that young people are more likely to kill other people with guns.
     
  11. submarinepainter

    submarinepainter Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I can't disagree
     
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  12. ShadowX

    ShadowX Well-Known Member

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    Okay I tell you what. I’ll agree to your complete list of “common sense gun regulations”.

    But in return I want a guarantee that there will be ZERO gun regulations after these going into the future. No matter how many atrocities going forward are committed with a firearm, there will be NO MORE gun regulations after we enact your list. We want a constitutional amendment guaranteeing those protections.

    Deal?
     
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  13. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    So you admit that the problem is that we don't have enough votes, and not that it's not the right thing to do.

    I'll take it!

    Thanks for playing.
     
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  14. HurricaneDitka

    HurricaneDitka Well-Known Member

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    Oh, I don't think I ever even remotely approached conceding that it's "the right thing to do". In fact, I happen to believe it's pretty much the exactly wrong thing to, on multiple levels.

    You not having the votes is just the first problem. There are many more after that.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022
  15. Oldyoungin

    Oldyoungin Well-Known Member

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    Well that was an entertaining fantasy fiction read. Its like reading a dissertation about cell elasticity written by a undergrad studying sociology
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022
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  16. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    One thing I forgot...

    17- Smart Guns: Incentivize research and development. Subsidize the purchase. And eventually make them the ONLY guns that people can buy.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022
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  17. Esperance

    Esperance Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The DEMOCRATS have total control of the House, Senate and White House.

    What are they doing to solve what they say is the problem ???

    In the mean time this shooter did express why he did what he did.

    If he were a MAGA supporter he would have been labeled a domestic terrorist in seconds.
    But since he doesn't fit the profile his political rhetoric has intentionally gone unreported.
     
  18. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    Why would I do that? This would reduce the number of gun deaths. But anything that we learn is doable and can save lives we SHOULD do.
     
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  19. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    Republicans have control of the Supreme Court. And that's where the legislation (YES! legislation) that allows this has come from.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022
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  20. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    First, lets point out that your goal is to ban guns, not reduce murder. If both sides worked together to reduce murder, we may be able to get something done. Instead, you attack the rights of good people, they have to fight you to protect their rights and very little effort goes toward fighting insane killers.

    Meanwhile people are supporting arbitrary laws that have no chance of benefiting innocent people. These people make it obvious that they know very little about firearms.

    On my way to the office, I pass 2 schools that have armed guards escorting students from the car to the building. There is only one entrance. If a killer is looking for a target, how likely is it they would chose one of these schools? Why should money and politicians get armed protection, but not our kids?
     
  21. Esperance

    Esperance Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Roberts is a Globalist, so your perspective has little validity.

    Meanwhile, the majority of drug shipments crossing the border have guards carrying weapons who then end up ditching their weapons once the drugs are delivered.
    You can buy previously used Mexican military firearms at many flea markets across the country.
    More murders are caused by these illicit weapons than by legally purchased firearms because they are preferred by turf gangs.


    But I currently see absolutely NO effort to stop the flow of both weapons and drugs across the border that are killing thousands of people all across the country.
     
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  22. ShadowX

    ShadowX Well-Known Member

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    Then no. We will agree to ZERO of your positions if that’s the case. Because we do not believe your intention is ANYTHING OTHER than an attempt to undermine the second amendment to the point where it’s completely ineffective.

    Since you refuse to agree to an agreement which would mitigate that fear, you will get nothing from us.
     
  23. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    You understand that the flow of weapons goes from here to Mexico, and not the other way around, right?

    No?
     
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  24. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    Hah! That's hilarious! You think too highly of yourself. I don't expect anything from YOU. I expect something from rational Republicans... not from Trump loyalists. I do hope there are a few in power who care more about saving human lives... especially the life of children... than about sucking up to the NRA for campaign funds.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022
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  25. Esperance

    Esperance Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Historically, Democrats first initiated gun confiscation from primarily the Black population during Re-Construction.

    So once the Blacks were defenseless, the Klan took a look at who previously wore a blue uniform during the war and who was currently voting for Republicans.

    The number of lynchings then escalated in astronomical proportions.

    Democrats being Democrats, both then and now.
     
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