How to deal with NK artillery?

Someone here posted a few months ago that there was a way to know where NK artillery is, after it "flashes," and to destroy it. I take it that this means the cannon or rockets will get off at least a few rounds, and there are reportedly thousands of them.

Trump doesn't seem too worried about it, though he wouldn't let NK see him sweat even if he were.

Can anyone here with actual military knowledge speak to this? I like South Korea and would not want it reduced to ash in the event Trump decides to attack NK.

 

There is this new radar, but I don't know exactly what it does to destroy NK's artillery...

South Korea appears to have found a new defensive tool to protect its cities from North Korean artillery.
The South’s new radar system can detect North Korean artillery units over 40 miles away. The South Korean military presently has a number of ARTHUR (Artillery Hunting Radar) units with ranges around 25 miles, South Korea’s Defense Acquisition Program Administration revealed in a statement, according to Yonhap News Agency. The radar can also run for eight hours straight, about two hours longer than its Swedish predecessor.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/04/24/south-koreas-got-a-new-weapon-against-north-korean-artillery/

 

Trump is not worried. His planes will fly over them way out of reach.
South Korea is worried. They can bombard Seoul to bits with that,
and finish it off with WMD missiles.

 

Yes, but there are over 25,000 U.S. troops in South Korea.

 

I've read that NK can fire 500,000 rounds in the first hour of hostilities. I don't think we've seen an artillery barrage like that in military history. I don't know about the "flashes" because I'm unclear how that you can track that many optical bursts, but a counter battery radar would allow you to track the artillery shell back to it's point of origin. But how many would you need? Tens of thousands? As far as I know we have nothing like that to mitigate an artillery attack that large.

 

Only way to deal with the NK artillery is a massive first strike. It won't kill all of them but it's possible that the strike can do enough damage that the SK civilian casualties are reasonable.

 

In world war one, two boxes would be placed on the ground.
The boom of the artillery would vibrate them.

From difference in timing between each box vibrating, trigonometry was used to detect the location of the artillery and the locations given to allied artillery to return fire.

Today we also have radar. So we can plot their points of origin.
The problem however is hardened fortifications.
Think bunker systems or trench systems.

So an artillery unit fires, and then retreats the gun back under a mountain, into the side of a hill or into a reinforced bunker system.

Essentially I agree. He's got so many it will take ages to put them all out of action.
The best solution to North Korean artillery is to avoid the border. The DMZ between North and South. Invade from the sea a long way away from it.

(The 25,000 troops in SK should be moved to safety).



At this point he can only use his arty if he moves it, and then it's the highway of death time.

Gotcha.

 

The US Military has the ability to track a single round back to its source immediately. If properly trained, S Korean and American counter fire could eliminate a lot of N. Korea's firepower pretty fast especially with the help of air power.

So how effective is N. Korea's artillery?

It is reported that North Korean artillery and its ammunition are very old. Whether they could stay serviceable for months under combat conditions is debatable. That does not mean they couldn't inflict carnage in the short run; but in the long run, they would not have the ability to wipe out S. Korean forces and drive to Pusan.

As for the Chinese, if the N. Koreans crossed the demilitarized zone, the Chinese would be unlikely to assist them to conquer S. Korea. If negotiated in advance, they could be persuaded to let Kim fail and be replaced with a neutral government acceptable to all parties,

The major problem would be the casualties inflicted on South Koreans in the opening hours of an attack. If invaded, the S. Koreans will resist. They are very tough.

 

Well...no one is going to attack anyone - outside of maybe some U.S. military strikes on NK nuclear facilities. China has stated it will defend NK if America/SK invade to attempt a regime change...so that is out. And China has also said they will not help NK if they invade SK...so that is out.
Clearly, NK is bluffing about the Guam attacks...no one is going to tell an enemy where, when and how they will attack them. Especially if the enemy is far more powerful.
So NK will not be using their artillery.

BUT...if they did, counter-battery fire would suppress it. And those that survived because they are dug in a hillside would be overrun as SK alone has a FAR superior military to the North conventionally - even without America. Plus, much of SK's artillery is self-propelled (almost none of NK's is)...so they can shoot and scoot before NK guns could zero in on them. And this does not even take into account the inevitable total, air superiority SK would undoubtedly attain within the first few days/week.
And I am quite sure Seoul and all cities in artillery range of NK guns would be evacuated if a war was imminent.
I think the NK artillery has been overstated by the media...probably because the media is usually completely useless when it comes to military knowledge.

 

What difference does age make?
I have a 100 year old gun and a 5 year old gun and they both kill stuff just the same.
Can it fire? Yes.
Does it have ammo. yes. NK is one of the worlds leading arms manufacturers and they have just spent the last 70 years on a war footing.

How fast is your artillery, can they target, load, train their guns, fire them and the round get to it's target 30 miles away, before I can reverse my arty back into a tunnel. No they can't.

the SK are nancies. Every fight they have with NK they get creamed.
Fights with the SK go like this. NK comes along and kills a few hundred of them at a time and the rest of the SK forces, don't dare shoot back. They just sit there and wait to die too.
Pathetic military. Never seen worse.

Bunker systems aren't famous for getting over run. They are famous for taking immense amount of attackers lives for not many casualties at all.
Hesbollah used a bunker system to stop the IDF dead in their tracks.
Vietcong used them.
On Normandy beach, 2,000 men in bunkers got 20,000 yank marines.
Marines supported by tanks artillery battleships and aircraft.
Yeah they got over run. But at what cost?

They outnumber you to start with. How many soldiers have you actually got to lose?

I don't think SK in a very big place. Where can you evacuate them to that isn't in artillery range? I do think that is a good idea however. Worth doing.
But if you are willing to sacrifice their capital city, you will find that your alliance with them will end before this.

Sacrifice your own city.

When you say hey Seoul, evacuate we are going to declare war on NK, they will say. Leave our country immediately. Alliance is over.
Surrendering to Mr Kim is better for them than being your ally. They get to keep their homes and their jobs and their lives and their families lives.
What are you offering? Death and destruction on a legendary scale.

Please don't help me. Don't ever help me. I don't want your help. Stay away from me and all that I love.








I'm sure you can blow up all this artillery, but it's going to take some time in my estimation.

 

These are propaganda photos designed to impress people. It is not what you can park in front of a camera that counts. It is what you have in reserve.

Dictatorships are all bluster as these photos demonstrate.You need massive support to maintain an army. Without it, it is just so much rusting iron. Do the N. Koreans manufacturer their own ammunition, or spare parts?

If they depend on the Chinese for support, they may as well depend on the wind. The Chinese will follow their own self-interests, not North Korea's. If they see the cost of continued support for Kim too high, they will cut him off.

Will people die before that happens? That depends on Kim's madness

(BTW: Where are photos of the N. Korean air force and navy?)

 

I was an artillery survey and sensor supportman for 4 years. In the event of conflict starting with NK there is nothing we can do to prevent them from leveling Seoul.

I have no idea what your friend or whatever was talking about with "flashes". That makes no sense.

 

Lmfao. It's funny you think people actually take you seriously.

 

South Korea has advanced AWACS aircraft (as well as 4 Global Hawk advanced drones on order) that can circle inside South Korean air space and watch and plot all of those NK artillery pieces.
The SK army can keep their weapons trained on those spots and as soon as NK 'rolls' out those guns...the AWACS/drones will spot it and their artillery/rockets will take it out before they get a shot off. Certainly, before they can 'roll' it back to safety.
And with the kind of shells SK has, they only need to land close to the target and the shell will dispense multiple mini-bomblets that will shower the target with explosives.
Sure, the North could get a few rounds off...but only a few before they would start getting intense counter-battery fire.

North Korea's military is old, ridiculously out-of-date and poorly trained since they have such little money for oil that any training that requires fuel (like air combat or mechanized army training) is almost totally out of the question.

That is why they developed nuclear weapons, because they realized their conventional military was no match for the ROK's.

 

What makes some people think they know what Trump is or is not worried about? So far his remarks have been in response to NK actions or threats. As long as fat boy stops making threats, things will settle down. I'm sure we know where most if not all of the artillery batteries are, but if they are in the thousands, I don't think we have the ability to take them all out before Seoul gets blasted.

 

They are online mate. Waiting for you to post them, I expect.

Yes the North Koreans manufacturer their own ammunition and spare parts, not mention their own original parts. They are arms exporters.
One of the hardest thing to know about NK is the disposition of it's forces. We often use arms sales as a method of quantifying a countries military assets. They bought X many planes, Y many tanks etc.
The problem with NK, is they didn't buy them all. They make a lot themselves. And so we don't have a record of how many they have made.
We don't know how many artillery pieces he has. What you se in that photo could be all of them. Or it might be the tip of the iceberg. And there is only one way to find out.

And this intelligence blindness make NK a tricky target. Harder to plan against.

 

I don't expect to be taken seriously. I'm just having fun on the internet in my spare time.

I wonder if you think people do you. I think you might.

I agree with your assessment. Seoul is indefensible from artillery attack.
If Mr Kim wishes to destroy it, he will.

 

I'm not convinced anything can circle inside NK airspace.
We don't send aerial reconassiance planes there.

NK made nukes to counter the threat of American invasion.
They show absolutely no fear of the SK military at all. They attack SK without fear of reprisal as far as I can see.

SK attack with this,.



NK responds with this.



How many state of the art SK ships have been sunk by backwards North Korea subs.

This


Gets you this.




And it also gets you this.



It is an entirely once sided fight from what I can see.
SK = no score. No balls and no victory.
They cannot defend their own people or even themselves and by the looks of it they don't actually even try to.

 

Just a poster. He may not know anything.

I presume he meant that an artillery piece we didn't already have located, or didn't know to exist, is easy to see and locate when it fires, because there is a flash (his term, but I think I know what he meant) at the muzzle as the projectile exits the barrel.

Isn't muzzle flash a real thing?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muzzle_flash

 

Well yeah it is but the problem is artillery is usually very far away from its targets. If you are using artillery close enough to where your enemy can actually see the flash, you are doing artillery wrong and who ever your commander is should be fired immediately.

But we do have plenty of systems that can quickly and accurately detect and locate enemy guns such as the AFATDS and GCFS systems. The problem is they kinda need the guns to fire first before we can locate them. Hence the real issue. There's really no way to prevent a full scale barrage against Seoul. Sure we can immediately target and destroy those weapons once it begins so in the long run they aren't much of a threat it's what happens in the short run that's the issue. The first hour of a war with NK will probably be the bloodiest the world has ever seen.

 

No flash!

 

i wonder if it absorbs the sound of the blast to ^^

 

You know what, also? The N. Koreans are smart enough to fire their artillery in waves. So just when we knock out the first thousand that have fired, a thousand more fire, and on and on. They could hold a thousand more in reserve an fire them 2 week after the shooting starts.

As for the distance to the target,, I assumed we'd have fighters in the air near the DMZ to shoot missiles at the artillery the second it fires. Of course, that's an awful lot of fighters to have in the air at the same time.

This is depressing. I'm hoping that the Chinese, the Americans, and the NK are huddling right now to stop this lunacy from escalating.

 

Looks like a short, fat rod and two swollen testicles. I can see it notwithstanding the camo!

 

trump dont care about lives in SK, he only care about him self and his business. if it was that easy, we would attack NK long time ago. its because NK is so close to SK and Japan, that we are worried, consider there are hundreds thousands US citizen in both countries.