If you refuse the vaccine, you don't matter. It's the people you infect that matter!

Discussion in 'Coronavirus Pandemic Discussions' started by Golem, Sep 16, 2021.

  1. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    They are far less likely to get infected, and far less likely to spread the virus even if they get infected. If you get less sick, that means you are fighting the virus and are less likely to spread it.

    Therefore, if you are vaccinated AND follow CDC guidelines, you are doing everything in your power to not infect others. And there is NO right to infect others with a deadly disease.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
  2. AKS

    AKS Well-Known Member

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    Really? I thought asymptomatic people were a primary vector in cv-19 spread. The bottom line is that you really have no idea what you are talking about.
     
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  3. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    I'm not that worried about them. The likelihood that they will contract the virus... or that if they do contract the virus, that they will spread it, is minimum. I'm more worried about anti-maskers and anti-vaxxers.

    I very much doubt it. But none of this has to do with "beliefs". Science will provide the best answer from the data available. The point is that you are less likely to be wrong if you follow the science. And you are pretty much guaranteed to be wrong if you don't. And the right has made this a matter of "beliefs".
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
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  4. pol meister

    pol meister Well-Known Member

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    All the spreaders are at fault. If the vaccinated carry the same viral load as the unvaccinated, then both would spread the disease at an equal amount, with the only difference being that the vaccinated who catch it would be less prone to severe illness or death than the unvaccinated who catch it.
     
  5. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Obesity is a transmissible disease. The obese are also disproportionate spreaders of most infectious diseases including Covid, influenza and certain skin infections.

    As always, I have voluminous evidence to support my posts while you are just pretty sure your unsubstantiated and un-researched opinions are valid.


    We have known for a long time gut microbes determine many aspects of health, from lifelong immune system health to gastrointestinal dysfunction including obesity.

    Around 2014-15 research started coming in showing how ratios of different gut bacteria affect obesity. Here is one such study.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4644874/

    Now more specific research is coming in on how these microbes are transmitted. It has been found spore forming bacteria and non spore forming bacteria influence to a large degree what kind of microbes you end up with in the gut. The specifics of what exact ratios are “best” and “worst” are yet to be determined and will take a while as there are millions of combinations of organisms to consider. But these microorganisms are most certainly passed from human to human from at birth through adulthood. In fact, fecal transplants are being studied as a way to reverse “bad” colonization of the gut.

    It should be noted that the ratios of good and bad gut microbes can be influenced to the good side by a healthy diet.

    On the viral side of the equation, adenoviruses are known to be linked to obesity in animals and humans. There are a few suggested physiological causes that have not been completely determined, but adenovirus infection is correlated strongly with obesity.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4517116/
    This is a cutting edge area of science, and of course our choices trump pathogenic components (as I said above our diet affects our micro biome). But the infectious component of obesity is a certainty.

    Now, moving on to the more important aspect of obesity. The psychological contagious component.

    https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2010/11/5/obesity-obese-people-social/

    If you note the date of the link, it is from 2010. Notice the projection in bold. Guess what the obesity rate is today in the US? About 42.5%!

    Here is another study.

    https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmsa066082

    So not only can obesity be spread by pathogens, it is socially contagious as well.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
  6. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yeah, but the thing is, we've had several other threads about that exact topic. Have you seen any of them?
     
  7. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    I tell you what....YOU come do it then, not hide behind the skirt of dictators and whine from safety.
     
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  8. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Sigh. We have over 40% of the US population obese and 70% overweight or obese. We have the CDC, NIH, and around 1,000,000 physicians and you have to ask a farmer that question?

    Here’s a 30,000ft view.

    We know from a plethora of studies on influenza obese individuals are more of a contagion threat than normal weight individuals.

    More on influenza.
    https://academic.oup.com/jid/article/218/9/1378/5051913

    Obesity makes an individual more likely to spread skin infections like staph.
    https://academic.oup.com/ofid/article/3/suppl_1/294/2636326

    Obesity increases the likelihood of causing a vehicle accident.
    https://www.researchgate.net/profil...s-It-Driving-Us.pdf?origin=publication_detail

    We could go on for pages on how obesity increases auto accidents.

    Obesity is responsible for increased rates of workplace injuries. This hurts employers by reducing productivity and harms us all economically through higher disability and insurance costs.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5259819/

    Just a sample for diabetes.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3217477/

    If you want to see the most harm done to society by the obese read post #30 in this thread about social contagion of obesity.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
  9. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    I have not read past post 30 yet (your post above) let me guess....when he 'replied' he deleted 90% of your post?

    *edit, he will...watch.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
  10. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    The odds are definitely in your favor. :)
     
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  11. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Do you think those that had family members die of the vaccine should be put in gulags too? After all they might say something not approved by the tyrants.
     
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  12. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What if we treat this the same way cigarette smoking use to be treated?

    Create separate smoking and non-smoking areas.


    If we don't have the right to "put anyone else in jeopardy", if you really believed so strongly in those words, why not keep up the mask mandates and not allow any entertainment events? Why only the push for vaccination now, when apparently people don't have to be forced to deal with those other restrictions?

    You see, nothing about this is logical. It has been turned into politics. A solution has been decided for everyone and now they are trying to push that solution.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
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  13. GrayMan

    GrayMan Well-Known Member

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    Dumb statements from vaccinated people -
    "I have a sniffle and maybe getting sick but It cannot be covid because I am vaccinated."
    "Don't worry, I can hug you, I've been vaccinated!"

    Not to mention many can be low or asymptomatic carriers due to the reduced symptoms of the vaccine.
     
  14. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

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    You didn't just drink the Kool Aid, you bathed in it. The novel coronavirus of Wuhan, China has a 99.8% survival rate around the world, and probably higher due to the recent admissions of global health agencies underreported case counts early in the days of the pandemic as to not panic the public. Then add the numbers of people who died with novel coronavirus of Wuhan, China being recorded as died from novel coronavirus of Wuhan, China and your personal panic party looks more like a young girl's backyard tea party.

    People: Ignore this fraud. Go live your life. If you want to wear a mask, wear a mask. If you want the vaccine, get the vaccine. If a private business asks you to wear a mask, put it on or turn around and walk out. You are responsible for your own health -- not the CDC, not St. Fauci, not the WHO, and sure as **** not President Sniffy McFingers, Gov. Dimslee of WA, Gov. Brownshirt of Oregon, Gov. Newscum of CA, nor the rapist who used to run New York.
     
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  15. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

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    Fixed it for you. :rock_slayer:
     
  16. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

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    Fallacy. Argumentum ad hominem. A factual rebuttal would better support your argument.
     
  17. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

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    If the vaccine and mask mandates keep people safe, then go get yourself vaccinated and wear a mask 24/7. You'll be fine.
     
  18. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

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    Show me the comorbidities. Oh you can't? Because nobody is tracking that? Hmh.

    Drug addicts, drunk drivers, fat fat fat ****ers, Tide Pod eaters, Type-2 diabetics, smokers, people who get frozen vegetables stuck in their rectums overload the medical system every day. We've tolerated that collection of unhealthy behaviors since the invention of hospitals...
     
  19. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Don't forget illegal aliens.
     
  20. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

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    Of course. We never worried so much about hospitals being so overwhelmed in the past, did we? Especially small local hospitals in border towns, some of whom have closed due to being overrun.

    Worth noting too that there is no mask or vax mandate for the thousands illegally pouring over Biden's porous border... Yet a $14,000 fine for a company with 101 employees and one unvaxxed... hey I wonder if they count illegals working illegally in that employee count???? :banana:
     
  21. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    So if you folks find out the vaccines have detrimental long term effects, do we get to say you no longer matter? No, I wont...I'm not better than @Golem but I'm better than that.

    You lefties just exude love...
    @MJ Davies Thought you might want to see this thread.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
  22. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Why are they pushing this vaccine much more than they are pushing people to wear masks now?

    Does this prove it's not actually just about trying to prevent the spread?

    What it's really about, those who got vaccinated just don't want to wear masks anymore, and are trying to shift the blame onto the unvaccinated.

    One size fits all solution imposed on all of society.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
  23. Heartburn

    Heartburn Well-Known Member

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    If all the people you worry about are as smart as you are, aren't they vaccinated now and safe?
     
  24. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Which one are you more worried about, and why?


    In other words you seem to be saying that you're very much more concerned about people who are willing to wear a mask but are unvaccinated than you are people who are vaccinated but refuse to wear a mask?

    Do you really believe the vaccine helps prevent the spread much more than a mask? Any evidence for that?

    Why is Biden trying to force federal workers to get the vaccine but not wear a mask?
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
  25. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member Donor

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    So Xoe and the Khamal Two should be in camps? Nancy, Chucky? the MSNBC cabal et al? Wow, what a conspiracy you spin.....
     

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