Illegal Aliens have 2nd Amendment Rights

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by Ronstar, Oct 23, 2017.

  1. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The 2nd Amendment is clear, according to Heller.

    All persons in the USA have the Right to Keep & Bear Arms.

    NO distinction is made in the 2nd Amendment as far as citizens, Permanent Residents, folks with a travel Visa, folks with a work Visa, folks with a diplomatic Visa, folks with an education Visa, or illegal aliens.

    Courts have made it clear most Constitutional Protections also protect Illegal Aliens.

    Right against Self-Incrimination, Right to an Attorney, Right to a Speedy trial, etc.

    That means illegal aliens have the Constitutional Right to possess a firearm.
     
  2. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    really? find me a case that supports it. Illegal immigrants cannot serve on juries, run for office or vote
     
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  3. papabear

    papabear Active Member

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    Going by the constitution I am surprised you blokes dont let felons have guns or guns whilst being in a pub.

    It is kind of like you bring out the 2nd amendment when it suits your position but any other suggestion is a clear violation of the 2nd.
     
  4. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    no but the Supreme Court has made it clear they possess 1st, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 14th Amendment protections.

    and the 7th Circuit Court of Appeals declared Illegal Aliens are protected by the 2nd Amendment

    http://reason.com/blog/2015/08/24/ilegal-aliens-have-second-amendment-righ
     
  5. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't distinguish between persons and incarcerated criminals either, genius.
     
  6. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The 13th Amendment does make exceptions for people convicted of a crime.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2017
  7. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    the seventh circuit got bitch slapped by the USSC in McDonald IIRC. brilliant but often mentally erratic Judge Posner got schooled in that one
     
  8. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Last edited: Oct 23, 2017
  9. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    Umm, yeah. Say g'night, Gracie.
     
  10. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Instead of reading some liberal blog where the author can't understand the difference between "yes" and "no", you can read the ruling here.

    http://media.ca7.uscourts.gov/cgi-b...-20/C:14-3271:J:Wood:aut:T:fnOp:N:1608386:S:0

    The appeals court denied his case, he lost, and he was not granted 2A rights.

    In fact the court found that illegal aliens as a class, even if for some reason the 2A extended to non-citizens, could be denied ownership of firearms.

    Regardless, they still can't legally purchase one.

    Being in the country illegally is a question on the 4473, which immediately disqualifies you.

    Oh and he was also a convicted felon, so the point is moot.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2017
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  11. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

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    The actual court ruling itself stated that Meza Rodriguez has his motion denied, meaning he could not invoke the second amendment as a legal defense against unlawful possession of a firearm.
     
  12. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    so u never read the Constitution
     
  13. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    Ronstar, u no understan' da Constitution.

    One, you misread the Constitution, deliberately.

    Two, you either misunderstand or troll with Heller.
     
  14. Bear513

    Bear513 Banned

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    It's funny how the left wants more gun laws, they can't even enforce the laws we have already on the books

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_Control_Act_of_1968

    It shall be unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person— (1) is under indictment for, or has been convicted in any court of, a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year; (2) is a fugitive from justice; (3) is an unlawful user of or addicted to any controlled substance (as defined in section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 802)); (4) has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution; (5) who, being an alien— (A) is illegally or unlawfully in the United States; or (B) except as provided in subsection (y)(2), has been admitted to the United States under a nonimmigrant visa (as that term is defined in section 101(a)(26) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1101 (a)(26))); (6) who [2] has been discharged from the Armed Forces under dishonorable conditions; (7) who, having been a citizen of the United States, has renounced his citizenship; (8) is subject to a court order that restrains such person from harassing, stalking, or threatening an intimate partner of such person or child of such intimate partner or person, or engaging in other conduct that would place an intimate partner in reasonable fear of bodily injury to the partner or child, except that this paragraph shall only apply to a court order that— (A) was issued after a hearing of which such person received actual notice, and at which such person had the opportunity to participate; and (B) (i) includes a finding that such person represents a credible threat to the physical safety of such intimate partner or child; or (ii) by its terms explicitly prohibits the use, attempted use, or threatened use of physical force against such intimate partner or child that would reasonably be expected to cause bodily injury; or (9) has been convicted in any court of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence.
     
  15. 6Gunner

    6Gunner Banned

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    Being in this country illegally is, by definition, an ongoing commission of a criminal act. No person - be they citizen, legal resident, et. al. - can legally be in possession of a firearm when engaged in criminal activity.
     
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  16. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We can have guns in a pub here. Why punish the law abiding?
     
  17. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    no court has ever affirmed this.
     
  18. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The core argument behind 2nd Amendment purists is that it recognizes a natural right for mankind, that all human beings have a natural right to self defense, to protect their family and property.

    Are Undocumented Immigrants not human beings? Do they not possess natural rights? Do they not possess the right to self-defense?
     
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  19. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    the SCOTUS has affirmed that Illegal Immigrants possess 1st, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 14th Amendment protections.
     
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  20. Bear513

    Bear513 Banned

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    Yes, they can have their guns in Mexico..
     
  21. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    So the gun gets to stay, but the illegal has to go back.

    Makes sense.
     
  22. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    18 U.S.C. § 922(g)(5)

    (g) It shall be unlawful for any person—

    (5) who, being an alien—
    (A)
    is illegally or unlawfully in the United States; or
    (B)
    except as provided in subsection (y)(2), has been admitted to the United States under a nonimmigrant visa (as that term is defined in section 101(a)(26) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1101(a)(26)));

    Now, counter to the law the Seventh Circuit noted that three other federal appeals courts have said that illegal aliens do not have Second Amendment rights, but concluded that those courts were wrong, creating what lawyers call a “circuit split” by holding that § 922(g)(5) is unconstitutional.

    So now will the court also find that having to be an adult to purchase a firearm or not a felon is 'unconstitutional' too?
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2017
  23. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The US Code is simply laws passed by Congress. This law was never deemed Constitutional by the Supreme Court.

    But the Supreme Court HAS many times declared that Illegal Immigrants are protected by the 1st, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 14th Amendments.
     
  24. OrlandoChuck

    OrlandoChuck Well-Known Member

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    If an illegal alien is caught with a gun so the cops let him keep it?
     
  25. Seth Bullock

    Seth Bullock Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I've never researched it, but the Founders wrote "the right of the people to keep and bear ..."

    So who did they mean by "the people"? I could be persuaded that they meant the citizens of the U.S.
     

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