Is there now justifiable hope of enacting sensible gun law?

The united states does not have a problem with firearm-related violence, but rather violence in general.

No other nation shares the same violent culture as the united states does in the name of political correctness. No other nation tolerates the subculture where violence is seen as an acceptable course of action for a mere disagreement, or where murder is considerable a rational decision when one shows disrespect to another. No other nation in the world would tolerate the formation of a society where the youth community feels murdering someone is an acceptable solution for being bored, and having nothing better to do. That is the nature of the problem that is being faced, where human life holds no value to others.

 

Permanently incarcerate, or otherwise execute those who have been proven as responsible for the majority of violence in the united states. It is easy to recognize them, as they have long and established criminal records. End their lives to save the lives of others who actually have a value to society.

 

Wow...we're gonna need ovens for all those bodies.

 

And you wonder why we refuse to give you an inch.

 

The question was asked, a proposal was presented. That proposal amounts to acknowledging that not every life holds value, not all live is precious, and not every life can be saved. Decisions must be made for how to go about achieving the best outcome. Certain lives must be sacrificed in order to save others. It is no different than a physician amputating a limb to save the patient.

 

You begin by doing what the NRA has been saying for decades, you ENFORCE ALREADY EXISTING GUN LAWS. When a banger with a criminal past is caught carrying a stolen gun, you don't plea-bargain it down to 100 hours of community service, you slap him in prison for the maximum term specified.

More and more gun laws that criminals will not obey anyway, that will only restrict the citizens that are not the problem, and will not be fully enforced anyway, are the usual reaction to ineffective laws that are already on the books but are not enforced. It amounts to a self-defeating cycle.

I, also, think you should start looking closely at the violence rates in other countries. I read a post on this forum the other day from someone over there that said that the gun violence rate in England was up around 23%. This is in a country that is scraping the edge of a total ban. You should also take notice of countries whose "gun violence" may have gone down, but their general "crimes of violence" has gone up. A world where the risk of being shot has gone down, but the risk of being clubbed to death has gone up is no bargain. When you fixate on one thing, you fail to see the whole picture.

 

Oh man, Indiana, Mississippi, and Wisconsin must be shooting galleries then. They must be far more violent than Chicago, right?

 

None of those states have a city even close to as populous and dense as Chicago. Nice try.

 

The quantity of people or households that own guns is unknown. Polls are inaccurate, PEW, Gallup and others have discussed the inaccuracy of polling on firearm ownership. Ever since Clinton was elected, the households admitting to owning a firearm has declined - because Clinton and Hilary were and are very anti-gun, and the Clinton "assault weapons ban" told the nation that so-called common sense gun control was really all about gun bans.

As the Pew and Gallup people discuss, in an environment of total distrust, gun owners will not admit it to a stranger on the phone or on a random survey.

The anecdotal data says that the number of gun owners has skyrocketed particularly over the past 5 years. Carry permits, gun and ammo sales, club membership, range memberships, participation in shooting sports, are all way up.

"Safe storage" is a de facto gun ban. Its generally sold to the pubic as requiring firearms to be stored in a govt approved locked safe, ammo to be stored separately. At its extreme, it means you store your guns at the police station and go check them out when you want to use them.

And how is safe storage to be implemented? The first time a crime is committed with a gun which was not "safely stored", the program will be expanded to involve govt inspections of the guns on your home. And it will be expanded to require a gun registry - how does the govt know you don't have a gun under your pillow unless it has a list of all the guns you have and can see those are stored in the safe?

Sure, because all the gun crimes are committed in rural areas. NOT. The FBI UCR data clearly shows that violent crime rate is highly correlated to city size - rural areas are safe, at the other extreme are the very violent huge cities.

 

To answer the question posed by the title, the answer is no in my opinion. The reason is because there is too much dishonesty and ignorance in the gun control debate.

 

If only there was some way of normalizing the number of murders for population....

 

Which anecdotal data is that? lol

"gun owners will not admit it to a stranger on the phone or on a random survey."? Yea, 'cause that makes so much sense to tell a potential burglar that your home is not defended - these gun owners must be one of the fools that other gun owners have referred to

 

Clearly, there are those who are not only eager to surrender to the astronomical level of firearm fatalities in the US, but are hellbent upon defeating any and all initiatives to reduce the carnage whist refusing to offer any promising proposals of their own.

 

When you ignore the density and the urban environment as factors that's not a fair comparison.

 

Very Disingenuous

 

I already posted it, reread the previous post which you clearly did not read.

Gun owners hang up on poll takers, or do not return surveys, which skews the results. Do some reading and research before posting.

 

What legislative measures, if any, do you believe Americans can take to reduce the level of forearm fatalities in American?

Do you believe nothing can be done to begin to lower the incidence to that of all other advanced nations?

 

Yea, a friend you met in the bar said that he bought a gun must mean that the number of gun owners has rocketed.

Of course they do . Did you carry out a poll asking random gun owners if they hang up when someone phones them up to ask if they had a gun?

 

Nothing without focusing on the individuals who misuse firearms, rather than the firearms themselves.

Such is correct. The incident rate for the untied states will never be on par with other nations, such as that of Japan.

 

Nothing.

That's the ammosexual response.

They see no problem and require no solution

 

That is, population density and the factors found in an urban environment have a greater impact on gun-related crime than gun control.

 

-Better enforcement of current law.
-Severely punish those who break them.
-Turn national gun debate to the Constitution and the causes of the large percentages of violent crime.
-Stop pretending that gun crime is about guns and not about mental health.
-Enforce all citizens right to protect themselves with a personal firearm nationally.

After we do this then if you want to talk about gun control, I would be willing to listen.

 

I'd amend to "Stop pretending that firearm fatalities are not about the permissiveness that allows homicidal maniacs easy access to guns in America." Presumably, the US does not have a monopoly on crazy people among advanced nations. We must confront that reality.

 

Such was not stated on the part of myself. There has been no denial that a problem exists and is in need of being addressed.

The problem is the obsessive, bordering on fetishistic, fixation on the implement that it used, rather than on the ones that are actually utilizing them. Those that absolutely refuse to admit that the individual holding the firearm is the problem, rather than the availability of firearms themselves.

Tell everyone present the legitimate reason for why the individual responsible for the church shooting in the state of Texas was not in prison for his crimes. Explain how firearms availability is a problem when it was the air force, and by extension the federal government itself, that failed to do its long established duty when it came to managing pertinent information. Detail why anyone who has committed numerous severe felonies is allowed to walk free in society, or is even permitted bail at a hearing.

 

Exactly what permissiveness is being referred to, that allows firearms to be acquired through theft, and other illegal acts.