It wasn't a hoax

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Patricio Da Silva, Dec 6, 2021.

  1. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So, we screw our allies to "curtail Russian power", or because we want to force them to buy US liquefied natural gas.

    Its none of our business, and if the EU wants to risk being dependent on Russian fuel, then that is their call, not ours.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
  2. gorfias

    gorfias Well-Known Member

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    From your link:

    "Clinton could have objected — as could the eight other voting members — but that objection alone wouldn’t have stopped the sale of the stake of Uranium One to Rosatom."

    She didn't. Trump is letting us know, he would have objected. Maybe.

    Either works for me, over Beijing Biden reversing Trump's Russian power limiting policy while Beijing Biden accuses Trump of being their boy. With the Left, you're always supposed to figure they're doing the bad things they accuse others of doing.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
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  3. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Sorry, not being from the left, I can't speak for them, but apparently you can. You from the left field?
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
  4. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh my, the desperate are pushing the debunked Steele dossier again.
     
  5. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    It's our business if it compromises the Euros' ability to fulfill their NATO obligations.
     
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  6. Lee Atwater

    Lee Atwater Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trump made the accusation of Hillary's involvement as though she had unilateral control over the outcome. She didn't. None of the accusations made about the sale have proven to be correct.
     
  7. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    what is this

    [​IMG]
     
  8. gorfias

    gorfias Well-Known Member

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    Not a material difference to me. She made no effort to stop the sale so as far as I'm concerned, that makes her a friend of Russia. You don't change whores when the one you got is getting you want you want and I don't think Russia preferred Trump in any way.

    Phones are not nuclear weapons. Still, Trump was/is not perfect. He's just better I think. How much better? I do not know.
     
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  9. Lee Atwater

    Lee Atwater Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Then, unsurprisingly, you don't understand the anything about the matter.
     
  10. Lee Atwater

    Lee Atwater Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Bolton alleges that Trump helped out China’s leader on ZTE. What’s ZTE?

    The New York Times reports new allegations about President Trump that are contained in a book by former national security adviser John Bolton. Bolton suggests he was worried enough about the personal favors Trump was doing for foreign leaders that he spoke to Attorney General William P. Barr, who was also worried “Mr. Trump had created the appearance that he had undue influence over what would typically be independent inquiries.” In particular, the Times reports: “Mr. Barr singled out Mr. Trump’s conversations with Mr. Xi about the Chinese telecommunications firm ZTE, which agreed in 2017 to plead guilty and pay heavy fines for violating American sanctions on doing business with North Korea, Iran and other countries. A year later, Mr. Trump lifted the sanctions over objections from his own advisers and Republican lawmakers.”
    A U.S. investigation found ZTE had broken U.S. law by exporting U.S. technical equipment to North Korea and Iran.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...trump-helped-out-chinas-leader-zte-whats-zte/

    WASHINGTON — John R. Bolton, the former national security adviser, privately told Attorney General William P. Barr last year that he had concerns that President Trump was effectively granting personal favors to the autocratic leaders of Turkey and China, according to an unpublished manuscript by Mr. Bolton.

    Mr. Barr responded by pointing to a pair of Justice Department investigations of companies in those countries and said he was worried that Mr. Trump had created the appearance that he had undue influence over what would typically be independent inquiries, according to the manuscript. Backing up his point, Mr. Barr mentioned conversations Mr. Trump had with the leaders, President Recep Tayyip Erdogan of Turkey and President Xi Jinping of China.

    Mr. Bolton’s account underscores the fact that the unease about Mr. Trump’s seeming embrace of authoritarian leaders, long expressed by experts and his opponents, also existed among some of the senior cabinet officers entrusted by the president to carry out his foreign policy and national security agendas.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/27/us/politics/john-bolton-trump-book-barr.html?action=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage

    Another credible story about the orange MAGA god for you to brush off with all the rest.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
  11. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Russia saw Clinton as a threat, that is how Trump won, they were trying to hurt Clinton, they never dreamed Trump would actually win
     
  12. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    The clear understanding is that the alphabet soup media, a few rogue operators in the administrative state, and Hillary Clinton operative conspired to destroy a presidency before it ever got off the ground. And nothing in the Steele report was anything more than a grotesque fabrication and most of the rest was no better.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
  13. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    Claims in the Steele Dossier about the Trump campaign's collusion with Russia have been verified both by the Mueller Investigation and by the Republican Senate Committee in charge of investigating collusion.

    The only response by Trump loyalists to this is to deny proven and well documented facts (see Mueller Report and see Republican led Senate Intelligence Committee Panel Report), and to repeat baseless claims they hear on Fox and which NO investigation has ever substantiated.

    That and, of course, their QAnon conspiracy theories about some... "Deep State" that took over the Republican Party... but only while they were investigating this.
     
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  14. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Not one single claim made by the Steele Dossier can be substantiated Lee.

    The DNC and FBI lied to the FISA Court multiple times.
     
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  15. Joe knows

    Joe knows Well-Known Member

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    A news link that is not far left nor far right is a form of obfuscation? Better write their editor
     
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  16. Lee Atwater

    Lee Atwater Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You are welcome to try to prove that outlandish assertion. But first; 1. if your assertion is true why would she wait until literally a few days before the election before the dossier's existence was reported Why not go public with much earlier? Mother Jones' reporting on it was published on Oct. 31. 2. It's a fact that she didn't solicit the help of foreign agents (as Trump did) She was only vaguely aware of Steele's work. 3. If FBI agents like Strzok and Page were trying to put their thumbs on the scale of the election why keep Crossfire Hurricane a secret from the media? 4. Do you ever fact check the material you post?
     
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  17. Lee Atwater

    Lee Atwater Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Errors in the application of FISA warrants is yet another smokescreen employed by Trump defenders to try to obscure the damning findings of both Mueller's report and the Senate Intel Committee report.

    The body of the report, however, is significantly less alarming than the executive summary would lead one to expect. Unlike similar the review conducted for the handling of the Carter Page case, this report does not show errors of a type that could plausibly mislead the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court. Indeed, the errors the inspector general reveals are almost all of a technical nature—not of a sort that either reveals political bias or implies that civil liberties violations or improper surveillance are taking place.

    The inspector general’s latest report is important because, well, technical compliance in a process like FISA is always important. Tolerating sloppiness today leads to tolerating cutting corners tomorrow—and that leads to corners being cut for all kinds of reasons. Worse, it threatens to undermine the civil liberties protections the process is meant to enforce. So it is right and proper for the inspector general to zero in on the imperfections in the Woods process and for the FBI to endeavor to fix the problems he has identified.

    But it’s important not to confuse the sort of technical errors that this report identifies with mistakes that actually would, intentionally or not, cause the court to approve surveillance in the absence of probable cause. The inspector general here has identified flaws in a system of prophylactic measures that prevents bad information from going to the court. What he has documented is certainly of concern, but it is of concern because it could lead to the FBI’s misinforming the court on material matters, not because it did.

    https://www.lawfareblog.com/fbis-fisa-mess
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
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  18. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    It's patently obvious what she did you just do not want to accept it because it would expose your blatant hypocrisy concerning Trump.

    And a huge LOL at mother Jones....lololol.

    The absolute facts of the matter are the dossier was compiled by foreign agents and it was used to try to sway the outcome of an election.

    You going to deny that you're going to deny that too?
     
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  19. Lee Atwater

    Lee Atwater Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    By not releasing it? Was Steele employed to find dirt on Don? Of course. Just as Donnie J attended the Tower meeting under the guise of getting dirt on Hillary from the Russian government.

    The thing is, I just disproved the things you claim are "obvious" and all you did was repeat them. I realize how deeply these false beliefs are entrenched in your mind and how difficult admitting they are incorrect is but they are incorrect.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
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  20. ButterBalls

    ButterBalls Well-Known Member

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    Weird, it always reads as if you have a great deal to say that aligns perfectly with the DNC narrative..
     
  21. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    Incompetent rebuttal; vacuous (unsubstantiated) allegations, ad hominems, cheap shot language. Noting that conspiracy theories do not belong in this forum.
     
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  22. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    How about the conspiracy theory that the Steele Dossier is not a fake?
     
  23. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    You are wrong

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steel..._corroboration_status_of_specific_allegations

    The dossier's "broad assertion that Russia waged a campaign to interfere in the election is now accepted as fact by the US intelligence community."[328] With the passage of time and further revelations from various investigations and sources, it is becoming clearer that the overall thrust of the dossier was accurate:[117]

    Some of the dossier's broad threads have now been independently corroborated. U.S. intelligence agencies and the special counsel's investigation into Russian election interference did eventually find that Kremlin-linked operatives ran an elaborate operation to promote Trump and hurt Democratic opponent Hillary Clinton, as the dossier says in its main narrative.

    — Jeff Donn, "Some Questions in Trump–Russia Dossier Now Finding Answers", Associated Press (June 29, 2018)[117]
    Shepard Smith said: "Some of the assertions in the dossier have been confirmed. Other parts are unconfirmed. None of the dossier, to Fox News's knowledge, has been disproven."[174] In some cases, public verification is hindered because information is classified.[329][330]

    According to Ranking Member of the House Intelligence Committee Adam Schiff, a major portion of the dossier's content is about Russian efforts to help Trump, and those allegations "turned out to be true".[331]

    After the Mueller Report was released, Joshua Levy, counsel for Fusion GPS, issued this statement:

    The Mueller Report substantiates the core reporting and many of the specifics in Christopher Steele's 2016 memoranda, including that Trump campaign figures were secretly meeting Kremlin figures, that Russia was conducting a covert operation to elect Donald Trump, and that the aim of the Russian operation was to sow discord and disunity in the US and within the Transatlantic Alliance. To our knowledge, nothing in the Steele memoranda has been disproven.[35]



    However, You missed the point of the OP, entirely.
     
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  24. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    You missed the point about the OP,.
     
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  25. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    "it was not a hoax" doesn't refer to the Dossier, it refers to the Russian investigation.
     

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