Medical Costs in the United States

Discussion in 'Health Care' started by Kari Sims, Apr 3, 2019.

  1. Kari Sims

    Kari Sims Member

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    Why is the price of medicine and health care so high when the people who need it are out of work from having the medical issues or dying?
     
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  2. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    The pharmaceutical industry is one of the last major industries left in the U.S. that is protected from foreign competition.

    No reason to waste my time and energy repeating myself here.

    related thread: Is the high cost of doctors in the U.S. a supply side issue?
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2019
  3. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    Liability lawsuits and a dysfunctional court system also drive up insurance premiums. It's not uncommon for doctors in certain specialties to have to pay $100,000 a year for liability insurance. That cost obviously gets passed on to the patient.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2019
  4. Qohelet

    Qohelet Active Member

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  5. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    And you would not have so many lawsuits if people were not threatened with bankruptcy

    Everyone is winning BUT the patient
     
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  6. hudson1955

    hudson1955 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Really? Lawsuits have nothing to do with people being unable to pay. Duh!

    OBamacare made it easier for Insurance companies to raise premiums, deductibles and to refuse payment for drugs and treatment on a whim. Because instead of regulating these companies, it gave them subsidies if they provided ACA coverage/insurance. Requiring them to charge insureds for coverage they don't need and preventative tests.

    Funny how insurance was less costly and medical fees lower before hmo's and ppo's became the norm.

    No other Insurance , auto, homeowners; pay for maintenxce on your car or repairs and upgrades to your home and requiring them to pay for preventative care, birth control, elective abortions: does nothing but raise the cost of insurance.
    More individuals may be able to get coverage, but it is too often worthless because of high deductibles and too many restriction on the use of the coverage. No transparency, upfront on what treatment is excluded, what drugs bare excluded and what I physicians hospitals are excluded. I know because my husband is an physician/surgeon and I oversee processing of claims and prep authorizations.
     
  7. Distraff

    Distraff Well-Known Member

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    Our healthcare prices are so high because the healthcare market can't control prices and our nation doesn't have common sense cost controlling regulations or policies and universal affordable healthcare.
     
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  8. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    I have often asked the question as to the justification for making obscene profits that drive a family into bankruptcy because they cannot afford to pay for the healthcare for their sick child?

    Needless to say no one can answer the question because there is no justification for those obscene profits.

    The worst are the big Pharma corporations that are charging exorbitant amounts for drugs that cost next to nothing to manufacture and distribute. That people need these drugs to survive because without them they will die makes it no different than extortion IMO.

    Next comes the PROFITS and OVERHEADS of the boated PRIVATE health insurance scam corporations. They are scams because they promise to provide health insurance and then take it away again in the fine print. Their overheads are ridiculous when compared to NON PROFITS like Medicare. The WORST scam of all is the DENIAL of PAYMENTS to medical service providers because that DRIVES UP COSTS.

    Then there is the cost of training to become a doctor. That scam puts doctors into massive debt and therefore makes it essential that they charge high fees in order to cover their education bills. On top of this is the bizarre concept that becoming a doctor is the way to become wealthy. If that is your motivation then it is assbackwards.

    There are more reasons but those are the major ones.
     
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  9. Qohelet

    Qohelet Active Member

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    My guess is that after several hundred years people are so fed up and change is unavoidable (end of the current way). Meanwhile other western world is living with higher taxes and different system. We don't have any perfect system yet when it comes to healthcare, no matter where you go, you'll find always flaws and odd things. Many locals complain about our system too (in Finland) and here is also times when some "right wing" people is trying to change it to worse. Now it's like this.

    Capitalism has some limits too, we can't increase our consumption much (food, stuff, services) and some other things too will set limit how long we can continue to grow our GDP. On limited planet we have limited resources too. That limit is also limit to everything else. All we need to do is figure out what kind of way of life is sustainable - so we don't make built-in suicidal societies around globe. Being poor isn't always sign of stupidity or being lazy - and I think that even poor should have healthcare too (good one).
     
  10. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Because here in the US, government and public policy is more concerned with corporate profits than with public health.
     
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  11. Jimmy79

    Jimmy79 Well-Known Member

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    Because everything gets cheaper when the govt takes it over. Like student loans for example.
     
  12. Jimmy79

    Jimmy79 Well-Known Member

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    I see so many lazy and inaccurate talking points it's obvious why it's so expensive.

    The short and simple reasons are 2 fold.

    1. The insurance model we use today covers everything: routine care, emergency care and elective care. This drives up everyones costs dramarically because all that routine care is expensive in terms of administration.

    2. Govt intervention drives up costs with increased administration for reporting. There is also a lot of cost shifting because payouts for Medicare and Medicaid are lower than cost, so those costs have to be shifted to private insurers.


    There are hundreds of other issues and both issues I laid out can be parsed 1000 different ways.
     
  13. Distraff

    Distraff Well-Known Member

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    Most developed nations don't have a government takeover of healthcare. Instead they have a smart blend of public and private insurance and public and private hospitals.

    What is interesting is that the UK has a fully government-run system and is extremely cheap compared to other universal healthcare systems. The most private universal healthcare system is Switzerland and is second to the US in terms of cost.

    So why are more government-run system cheaper? Because the healthcare market has inelastic demand to price changes and is very bad at controlling prices. Even though the government isn't the best manager, its better than out of control free market price hikes. This is the very reason why the government runs utilities like electricity and water.
     
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  14. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Zero credible substantiation for that load of bovine excrement duly noted for the record.

    1. The 20% OVERHEAD of PRIVATE healthcare comes from the BLOATED ADMINISTRATION of DENIAL of health care and reimbursement which is why it is the PRIMARY CAUSE of the increase in the cost of healthcare.

    2. The government overhead of Medicare is LESS THAN 3% thereby NEGATING your bogus allegation.
     
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  15. Jimmy79

    Jimmy79 Well-Known Member

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    Zero substantiation for this load of bovine excrement is noted.
     
  16. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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  17. Distraff

    Distraff Well-Known Member

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    In France medical school is virtually free while in the US, doctors graduate with $154,000 of debt on average. As a result France has 3.1 doctors per 1,000 people while the US has 2.6. In the US specialists earn about $230,000 per year while in France they get $160,000. General practitioners in the US get $160,000 while in France they get $90,000.
     
  18. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    That claim is a little disingenuous, and you should know that. There are obviously additional reasons why countries in Western Europe, such as France have higher ratios of doctors to the population.

    (And I'll tell you what that main reason is in a nutshell: in many respects the US is actually more like a Third World country combined with a First World country)

    That may be true, but in France getting into medical school is still very competitive, and they still have to go through 4 years of university before they can get admitted to medical school.
    So it is a little easier, but not really all that much.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019 at 2:02 PM
  19. Distraff

    Distraff Well-Known Member

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    The cost of medical school is a big reason most people don't become doctors. We can reform other things like the amount of time and the requirements to get more doctors, but we have to address the cost like other developed countries have.
     
  20. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Donor

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    I agree, this might be one (rare) area where relying on the free market is not the best for the population.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019 at 2:03 PM
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  21. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    Why do you imagine the price of a commodity should be commensurate with the financial capabilities of people who can barely afford to eat?
     
  22. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    :roflol:

    Too bad you never bothered to do your own research before making that asinine allegation.

    https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-...ing-administrative-costs-private-insurance-a/

    Next time try researching before posting!
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019 at 2:56 AM
  23. Jimmy79

    Jimmy79 Well-Known Member

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    Their fraud and abuse alone accounts for more than they claim as total admin costs. You also fail to account for so much of their admin costs buried in the budgets of other agencies.

    https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjG8qLqxeniAhXxwVkKHR5ZBLUQzPwBegQIARAB&url=https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2011/06/30/the-myth-of-medicares-low-administrative-costs/&psig=AOvVaw0-aRlhjx6Z8UJYG81u_rqY&ust=1560621382388477

    An article from 2011 that remains relevant to this day to debunk this myth that Medicare admin costs are lower than private insurance.

    I wonder how much more of those costs are offset if you factor in the capital gains taxes of shareholders.

    Next time, find sources that havent already been debunked.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019 at 2:03 PM
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  24. james M

    james M Well-Known Member

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    Why compare apples and oranges?
     
  25. james M

    james M Well-Known Member

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    Cost is not a problem since doctors earn so much.
     

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