Military Spending Is Already Bankrupting America

Discussion in 'Budget & Taxes' started by Striped Horse, Nov 10, 2018.

  1. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    11,340
    Likes Received:
    2,186
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Right ... and it is also no "I love the USA and no critics from outside are allowed forum"!
    And for surer I am not someone like these total Anti-American trolls who spread Russian Propaganda and say BS like Assad is no dictator but a democrtic and free elected President etc., eh?
     
  2. Striped Horse

    Striped Horse Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    2,780
    Likes Received:
    1,619
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Oh come on. No one said that the entire US debt to date was down to military spending, so stop barking at something you just fabricated out of thin air.

    The present US debt is approx. $21.7 trillion - which means each US taxpayer has been indebted to the tune of $178,000 each.

    Perhaps you'd like to offer a round of applause to the imprudent US political class for awarding that to Americans.

    The Wall Street bailout of 2007/8 saw the federal government commit $16.8 trillion (HERE).

    Over the same period it has spent $7.69 trillion on "military" spending (HERE).

    Thanks guys.

    And I'm not even going to include intelligence spending or counter-terrorism / Homeland security and all the other spins-off's of perpetual war, because the combined sum of the two foregoing is $24 + trillion over 10 years. Back in 2008 the US national debt was $10.8 trillion, so debt as a whole is increasing at an average of over $1 trillion a year.

    One could easily argue that a not inconsiderable portion of annual defence spending also ends up in the pockets of Wall Street bankers (and I speak as a former international banker who specialised in weapons financing) so we can all see bankers have a vested interest in continuing the push for war.

    What I see is the richest nation in the world squandering its wealth and future to enrich a very powerful business sector (banking / war) and otherwise ignoring the tens of millions of American who are increasingly facing impoverishment (as at 2017 40 millions Americans lived in poverty according to the US census bureau HERE). At the same time the top 0.1% of Americans owned the same volume of wealth as the bottom 90% (HERE).

    It's obscene.
     
  3. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,630
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You wont get any respect from me who you post on topics where you dont belong
     
  4. Striped Horse

    Striped Horse Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    2,780
    Likes Received:
    1,619
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I'd find your attitude more digestible IF the US didn't interfere in other nations all the time. But it does - so be off with you.
     
  5. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,630
    Trophy Points:
    113
    World powers do that

    Your little country used to be a world power and therefore an influence on the world

    Which is far better than what you are now
     
  6. goody

    goody Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2015
    Messages:
    4,469
    Likes Received:
    738
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    UK has sent ships for the very reason to challenge China's unilateral declaration of measures threatening FON. You don't seem having required analytical reasoning skills to grasp what really is causing a great power to invest more in what makes it great in times the international order -which you absurdly defined- is challenged.

    International order by the way is the socioeconomical and political structure that runs all continental regions by more or less the same principles. It differs by the day's circumstances driven mostly by factors like technology, geographical exploration, military power, and geopolitics. Thus it is completly different today than what it was in medieval times.
    So you once again managed to make no sense other than posing as proRussian by parroting the same cheesy Kremlin narratives.
    Dear Dimitar the Zebra, I like seeing your posts not only because they are hints of the madness rising from the east but also because I like giving them what they deserve...
    Regards,
    Letchkov...
     
  7. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    Messages:
    44,872
    Likes Received:
    7,823
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I am not sure what folks mean when they use the term "Globalist" as different folks have different definitions.

    I agree that we will no longer have the influence that we did over world affairs. This is already the case to some degree. Not sure if this is one of the platforms of these "Globalists" though.

    Regardless - this is just the nature of Empire. It is rare for one nation to stay at the top of the hill for very long. We lucked out by being the only first world nation to survive WW2 relatively unscathed.
     
  8. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,630
    Trophy Points:
    113
    America has never had an empire

    During WWII it was either us or world domination by bazi germany

    After WWII came the Cold War when Ameica and our allies resisted the march of global communisn led by the Soviet Union

    Now our former friends Feel they have nothing to fear and think they do no need us anymore

    Even many liberal Americans feel the same way so they hate America as a great power also

    But they are wrong

    There is a new menace growing and its not the cuddly beguine panda bear that it appears to be

    America should remain strong as the only power capable of resisting red china

    to do that we need a strong military

    And for that we need a strong economy
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2018
  9. Striped Horse

    Striped Horse Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    2,780
    Likes Received:
    1,619
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Blaming "World powers" for America starting wars across the world is just about the daftest thing I've ever seen you post. It's a complete and utter abnegation of American responsibility for American wars. Children know better than that.
     
  10. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2009
    Messages:
    18,051
    Likes Received:
    4,439
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    The United States has never started a war.
     
  11. Striped Horse

    Striped Horse Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    2,780
    Likes Received:
    1,619
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    We both know that the UK does what America wants ti to do or else the intelligence sharing agreement is threatened, so nothing new to see there. Spineless and corrupt politicians have run this country into the ground. Just like yours have done to the USA.

    As far as analysis goes you seem to be missing the point that America is now in a period of rapid empire decline and is no longer the power it once was. Which is good.

    I see you're back to the "international order" meme (meaning American world order) and again this is a rapidly crumbling artificial construct of the UKUSA that sought to impose its will and dominance over the world for Centuries past and is now facing the consequences.

    Btw, I note you didn't respond to my question about being employed in the US military intelligence sector and therefore having a personal rice bowl reason for defending US hegemony.

    So my advice to you Peter, is that you ought to be looking for a new career - something more in keeping with you true abilities - bookkeeper, barman or baker -- for the soon to be arriving days when the US crashes financially and the US military and intelligence sector is eviscerated.

    It's going to be like the 1990's post Soviet years. But a lot worse. Thanks to truly massive national indebtedness.

    Enjoy the bankruptcy when it arrives. If you let me know how to contact you I'll undertake to send you food parcels. You'll need them I think.
     
  12. Striped Horse

    Striped Horse Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    2,780
    Likes Received:
    1,619
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    [​IMG]

    I don't know what you're smoking these days but I want some...
     
  13. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,630
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I think the problem of poor leadership extends to all the democratic allied nations including yours and infortunately the USA also

    Collectively we are the moral light for the world and we are all fading
     
  14. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    Messages:
    44,872
    Likes Received:
    7,823
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You forgot to say what you mean by "Globalist".

    The US was - and arguably still is - an Economic Empire. At one point 50% of the value of all publicly traded companies was US.

    Our "former friends" are still our friends - but they will not be much longer if we keep treating them like dirt - second class citizens who are supposed to bow when we are in the room.

    This comment is strange: "only power capable of resisting red china". France and Britain are capable of resisting any military advance by China on their homeland - this is why nuclear deterrent is such historical game changer.

    It is this deterrent that makes it highly unlikely (nothing to fear) that China is going to attack these nations, or the US. If they do - there a "strong military" will not help defend nor help to prevent this. It is nukes that prevent this.

    The geopolitical map has changed. "Military" is no longer the strongest piece on the geopolitical chessboard - despite what the State Propaganda Machine wants you to believe.

    Economic is the strongest piece on the chessboard - and on this board we are making blunder after blunder (focusing too much on military being one of them).

    Engaging in Protectionism and starting Trade wars is not helping our long term economic security. 18 of 21 of Trumps own inner cabinet told him "don't do it".

    Sanctions on Iran - when they were fully compliant with their end of the deal - is not helping our long term economic security. Backing out of the deal we made - for no valid reason, and then usurping the sovereignty of our closest European allies - is not helping our long term economic security. (again Trump was told "don't do it").

    We have the President of France taking pok shots at our President on the global stage This is highly unusual - I can not recall (at least not since the end of WW2) the leader of any major European power doing this. Other European leaders have not done this directly but have had strong language "usurping our sovereignty" and so on.

    This does not help our long term economic security. One of the reasons we were able to maintain economic hegemony for so long was because of our strong relationship with Europe .. "Full STOP"

    As I stated (probably to you) ... prior to the comments by the EU and certainly prior to Macron's latest comments that doing these things would have blowback/ consequences. When was the last time you said anything so predictive ?

    This is not because I have some crystal ball in my knapsack. This because - like those telling Trump "don't do this" - I see the geopolitical chessboard for what it is - not through some rose colored fantasy lens of days long since past - not on the basis of the spoon fed propaganda and "necessary illusions" - such as:

    1) the idea that the MAD doctrine is not still valid.
    2) the idea that Major European Powers need our protection (one of Trump's idiotic inferences - a statement that would be idiotic to make even if it were true but triply so given that it is not ) such that they are going cow tow to the US on the basis of removal of that protection.

    No idiot Trump - what Macron suggested more European spending on Defense to "protect" Europe from the US. This was a direct jab at what Trump has been doing and saying. (France does not need more defense spending to protect it from the US - they have enough nukes to annihilate the US should it come to that). What Macron was really saying - the message underneath the faux message - was Go FK yourself.

    This is not helping long term US economic security.

    Last - and I have told you this numerous times - Trump using the "Nuclear Option" - using the "Sole" world reserve currency status (which is what really makes the US the economic empire that it is) as a cudgel against our allies was a huge blunder on the geopolitical chessboard.

    The history books will mark losing sole status as the defacto end of the US economic empire. FULL STOP.

    This was going to happen anyway. The world has been calling for an alternative method of international payments for a long time now. Such absolute power in the hands of one nation is destined to not last. It is just not in the historical cards.

    Trumps actions have expedited that process. If you would have asked me a few years ago when I thought a valid competitor to the USD for international payments would arrive I would have said - it will come but, highly unlikely we will see something in less than 2 decades. That gave us a fairly big cushion - a chance to get our economic ship in order and prepare.

    I am shocked at geopolitical moves being made in relation to creating competition and the rate at which this is happening.

    The "ONLY" thing - that is preventing this from happening even faster is EUROPE. That is why EUROPE/EU is important. That is why "what Europe thinks" is important. That is why (contrary to another posters claim - they need us far more than we need them) we need Europe. "NEED" being the operative word.

    Our way of life is currently dependent on sole world currency status. This is not a happy place to be. As a nation we are living far beyond our means .. the only reason this is possible (to the extent that we are doing it) is because of our sole RC status.

    If tomorrow the music stopped - and we had to live within our means - you would think the world had ended. Chaos is an understatement.

    Perhaps this is the wake up call that we need as a Nation.

    Either way - it is important to see the board as it is and not through rose colored glasses.
     
  15. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,630
    Trophy Points:
    113
    China prefers to take over the world without firing a shot using merchantilism

    Trump is trying to wake the euros and other democratic nations to the need to resist but leadership is so shallow it cannot respond
     
  16. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 25, 2012
    Messages:
    36,971
    Likes Received:
    9,900
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Take over the world? Sounds a little melodramatic to me.
     
  17. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,630
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Thats what Chamberlain said to Churchill in 1939
     
  18. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2013
    Messages:
    38,029
    Likes Received:
    16,040
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male

    That's what President Obama did.

    [​IMG]
    Obama/Democrat Mk 16 General Purpose Money Bomb
    Official Department of Defense photo


    [​IMG]
    Obama bomb being loaded aboard USAF aircraft
    Official USAF photo
     
  19. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2009
    Messages:
    5,805
    Likes Received:
    1,672
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Well, that certainly ducked the question.
     
  20. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2009
    Messages:
    5,805
    Likes Received:
    1,672
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Well, why pointless wars? Statism bred by pragmatism and altruism.

    The solution to pointless wars? Start being more selfish, start defending capitalism, and start fighting for individual rights.

    Ayn Rand: “Statism needs war; a free country does not. Statism survives by looting; a free country survives by production”

    As for being a dreamer, aren’t we all?
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2018
  21. therooster

    therooster Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2014
    Messages:
    13,005
    Likes Received:
    5,492
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Of course he did , helps his buds in the Muslim Brotherhood.
     
  22. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2009
    Messages:
    18,051
    Likes Received:
    4,439
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Before you even think of mentioning Iraq in 2003 I can point out multiple acts of war committed by the Hussein regime against the U.S. prior to that.
     
  23. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    11,340
    Likes Received:
    2,186
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Like at me, when you post the other way around to issues that do not belong to you! So I won't read any BS comment about refugee handling in Europe from you for example!
     
  24. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    11,340
    Likes Received:
    2,186
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It's not possible to write more nonsense ...

    Trump and the US right-wingers are awake and annoyed that the US is no longer the almighty state on the planet ... which by the way is the own guilt of the US with thanks to Bush Jr. ... and the more and more does the world care only a crap about the will of Washington and certainly does the world and the Euros not subordinate their own interests to the interests of the US and certainly not let the interests of the US being done to be suddenly their interest because Washington wants it!

    Sure, China is well on the way to replace the US and Donald Trump does not like that. But that's his problem, or the problem of the US as and how they react to it.
    We in Europe also have our "problems" with China, but these are our own problems that we take care of ourselves.

    Before Trump we might have been able to talk to each other and agree on a common reaction of equal partners against China! But as long as the outrageously and disgusting dumbass plays the president in the US, you only get the stinky finger!

    One example are the great punitive tariffs and the trade war between the USA and China.
    First of all, Trump also levies punitive tariffs on European steel and aluminum and not just against China ... and then you're wondering seriously that we're pissed off in Europe on you? Really now?
    Then Trump starts a trade war with China without talking to us and is surprised that we and keep out there and watch? Really now?
    And if you then take the Iran deal that we Europeans can live well with, but the idiot in the White House does not and then thinks he can end one-sidedly, then you wonder why we do not get involved? Really now?

    Anyone who is seriously wondering about the allegedly so bad and stupid Europeans or even annoyed at the Europeans, which can actually be just stupid or have lived so far in an absolute bubble of a dream world!
     
  25. Striped Horse

    Striped Horse Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Messages:
    2,780
    Likes Received:
    1,619
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Agree with your first para. Your second para was coffee splutter time - "moral light for the world". Do you get this stuff off the back of a cereal packet?
     

Share This Page