Moderna says an omicron variant vaccine could be ready in early 2022

Discussion in 'Coronavirus (COVID-19) News' started by Thedimon, Nov 28, 2021.

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  1. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/11/28...ant-vaccine-could-be-ready-in-early-2022.html

    Well, we are back to square 1. All vaxed are now unvaxed. How are local vaccine mandates going to handle it? Force all into initial 2 and then keep pumping them with mRNA? Has anyone wondered, why our bodies remove antibodies within a few months and did someone conduct studies about the effects of injecting these mRNA vaccines continuously over the period of several years? I think vulnerable people will just die off from thrombosis or myocarditis in the next couple of years because additional antibodies thicken the blood and these vulnerable people are going to have to run for a long time on blood that is thicker than normal.
     
  2. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    that is good to hear that they could do it if needed, let's hope not needed
     
  3. Louisiana75

    Louisiana75 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Dr's in south Africa are saying it's very mild. People need to stop the fear mongering. Do we really need a vaccine for something milder than a cold?
     
  4. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    still waiting for more confirmations

    is it as contagious, is it as deadly, ect.....
     
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  5. joesnagg

    joesnagg Banned

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    Well of course we do, aren't you tired of having to drive around all the dead bodies piled up in the streets... I know I am. :rolleyes:
     
  6. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    Well, personally, I’m tired of all those violent protests demanding vaccines. Pilots are the worst - breaking and looting stores while claiming they are peacefully demanding mRNA shots!
     
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  7. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

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    They can shove that vaccine up their asses. I'm not getting it
     
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  8. joesnagg

    joesnagg Banned

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    Yeah, like get back to me in 4-5 years, what plays well in animal studies don't necessarily play well in humans. Simply dismissing the growing evidence these mRNA vaccines may have long term effects puts the lie to oft repeated "follow the science". I make no apologies for feeling that in a couple of years we're going to wake up to a worldwide "WHOOPS" that can't be covered up, and I also pray I'm dead wrong, I have family I care for that took the crap.
     
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  9. mswan

    mswan Newly Registered

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    Last edited: Nov 28, 2021
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  10. Heartburn

    Heartburn Well-Known Member

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    Don't go around, it's no worse than speed bumps.
     
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  11. CenterField

    CenterField Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What "growing evidence these mRNA vaccines may have long term effects"? There's been ZERO evidence that they may have LONG TERM effects. Nobody doubts that in rare case they can have detrimental short term side effects, including even more rarely, fatal ones, but long term? A round zero. If you heard otherwise, it's by anti-vaxxer sites. By the way, no vaccine known to men has ever presented long term side effects beyond two months of vaccination. Much less, this one that degrades and leaves the body in a matter of days.

    You don't need to pray a lot, because yes, you're dead wrong. There will be no side effects that will manifest 2 years after vaccine administration. That is preposterous and far-fetched. Of course, it's what conspiracy theorists and anti-vaxxers say (and even some quacks say it, who knows why - I'd suspect they have some other vested interest when they mislead the public with this kind of misinformation - obviously you fell for it).

    There is one and only one late side effect that is possible, if you consider it a "side effect" (I wouldn't; it's not what people usually talk about when they mention side effects): the possibility of lower vaccine efficacy with repeated boosters. By the way, that's a possibility, by analogy with the flu shot, but so far there's been no evidence that this will happen to the Covid-19 vaccine. That's however the ONLY late issue I'll concede as a possibility. No other. You can't really have a long term effect of something that has completely left your body already, two years prior.

    When you call these vaccines crap, it betrays how wrong you are about this whole thing. These are fabulous, advanced, safe, and efficacious vaccines. There's nothing crappy about them.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2021
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  12. George Bailey

    George Bailey Well-Known Member

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    Is this a joke? They are fabulous???

    Talk about drinking the kool aid... Good Lord.
     
  13. CenterField

    CenterField Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Drinking the Kool Aid? I'm a medical scientist, MD PhD with 41 years of experience, and expertise in Virology and Immunology. Yes, these vaccines are fabulous. The mRNA technology is a revolution in vaccine-making technology. You are not qualified to understand it, unlike me. And by the way, I don't even know why I'm giving you any attention. Let me correct this oversight. Over and out, as far as your posts are concerned.
     
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  14. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    I was hoping to ask someone who knows some day.
    How does the presence of spike protein in the blood stream can result in heart inflammation?
    Also, why does it cause some women to go off cycle with their periods?
    If mRNA vaccines are as simple as they are being described and only result in your body generating just the spike protein, which is then removed by the antibodies, then where does the heart inflammation or women’s period fit in in this seemingly straight forward process.
     
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  15. Joe knows

    Joe knows Newly Registered

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    With all that money as a medical scientist, why don’t you hire someone to pat your back for you so you don’t have to constantly do it yourself? That’s got to be a strain on your shoulder.


    Before you go all doctor bombshell on me realize I’m just joking. You know how smug and arrogant this makes you look right? You’re a smart guy and you’re actually a great person to have on this forum, we get that. Being rude doesn’t get your point out any better.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2021
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  16. Chrizton

    Chrizton Well-Known Member

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    Move away from Chicago.....
     
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  17. George Bailey

    George Bailey Well-Known Member

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    I find it hard to believe a medical scientist would have the time or inclination to come here and make 9,000 posts in less than a year and a half.
     
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  18. CenterField

    CenterField Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There are two possible mechanisms to explain it. One, is that the spike protein is toxic in itself. It can cause endothelial lesions. Two, and more likely to be the culprit for the myocarditis, is a more complex issue. I'll try to explain it. Exogenous RNA (exogenous means, coming from outside your body, in this case, the one you get from the vaccine) can itself generate an immune response against it, thus preventing the vaccine from working. To avoid that, we do what we call nucleoside modifications when we are making the mRNA for the vaccines in a lab.

    Although nucleoside modifications of mRNA have been shown to reduce their innate immunogenicity (that is, capacity to generate an immune response against it, rather than a response against the spike protein), in certain individuals with genetic predisposition, the immune response to mRNA may not be turned down and may drive the activation of an aberrant innate and acquired immune response. The dendritic cells of the host individual who got the vaccine may still have the capacity to express cytokines and activation markers that will trigger the immune cascade. The immune system may therefore detect the mRNA in the vaccine as an antigen, resulting in activation of proinflammatory cascades and immunologic pathways that may play a role in the development of myocarditis as part of a systemic inflammatory reaction.

    This is more common in individuals who have a strong immune system, which is why we see more myocarditis in young adults and adolescents.

    Do realize that the virus itself tends to cause more severe and more frequent myocarditis than the vaccine. The rate of myocarditis is 12.6 cases per million second doses of mRNA vaccines, in individuals aged 12 through 39. The rate of myocarditis caused by the virus itself has been found to be as high as 45.8% or almost 1 case in 2. If you compare 12.6 in 1,000,000 to 1 in 2, you'll see that the benefits of the vaccine still far outweigh the risks, even for the young population.

    Still, it does happen although so rarely. It tends to happen more with Moderna (because it is given in higher dose - this is the same rationale for giving a half dose of Pfizer to youngsters, or pediatric dose), so younger individuals might want to pick Pfizer for their vaccines. Also, you need to understand that almost all patients that had myocarditis from the vaccines, had resolution of symptoms and signs and improvement in diagnostic markers and imaging with or without treatment in a matter of days. So, it's mild and transient.

    As for the changes in menstrual cycle, they are still being studied. I don't have an answer for you on that one. It probably has to do with physiological stress. These 5 groups have received grants to study the issue, recently (in October 2021) so they haven't had the time to run the studies and get to the answers, yet:
    • Boston University; Principal investigator: Lauren A. Wise, Sc.D.
    • Harvard Medical School, Belmont, Massachusetts; Principal investigator: Laura Allen Payne, Ph.D.
    • Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore; Principal investigator: Mostafa Borahay, Ph.D.
    • Michigan State University, East Lansing; Principal investigator: Stacey Ann Missmer, Sc.D.
    • Oregon Health and Science University, Portland; Principal investigator: Alison B. Edelman, M.D.
    We'll know more when these studies conclude.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2021
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  19. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Very succinct.
     
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  20. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    It’s injected, not administered rectally.
     
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  21. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Bumps don't yell so.
     
  22. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

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    Well I guess that would be awkward for them then of they were to shove the vaccine up their asses like I requested.
     
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  23. Heartburn

    Heartburn Well-Known Member

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    They change their minds about everything, you're not supposed to remember and it's certainly unethical to record them out of both sides of their mouths.
     
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  24. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We've had coronaviruses and other transmissible diseases our entire lives (and before).

    This is the first time where millions of people are behaving as if everybody is potentially infected, including themselves, even with no reason to believe so.

    Large scale mental illness. ~ Zuby
     
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  25. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Yes.
     

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