Negotiate Peace With Russia to Prevent War Over Ukraine

Stalin sold valuable natural resources to Hitler, while Hitler was invading western Europe, bombing London, and rounding up hundreds of thousands of Jews. And also building the concentration camps in western Poland.

and Stalin was handing over German Communists who fled to the USSR

u cool with that?

 

They celebrate Stalin for saving them from annihilation. Is that so hard to understand? Or is it because they hate him for not allowing it? Well let them try it again if they dare?

 

if Stalin had joined forces with the British, Canadians, French, and FOUGHT Hitler, rather than helping him, WW2 would have ended in 1940 and tens of millions of lives would have been saved.

But instead, Stalin helped Hitler, and stole Poland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania.

 

Nonsense, I said the Germans were building the camps while Stalin was supporting them with resources and aid.

 

It's now looking like Russia is positioning troops to strike at Kiev directly. Perhaps they mean to conquer all of Ukraine.

It's Russia demonizing their victims.

I assume Ukrainian nationalists merely want to keep people from invading their country.

I do not believe there are short term plans to admit Ukraine into NATO.

But... attacking a NATO country = the end of Russia immediately.

 

Do you suppose that if Ford Motor Company and Prescott Bush and a few others had not helped Hitler it would have changed how successful Hitler was in the early days?

 

I don't think so. Hitler was terribly successful as long as he stuck to politics but he wasn't nearly as good at military. He had a lot of success at first with military because he was exploiting politically weak counties AND he had two of the best military geniuses that ever lived; Guderian and Rommel. Once he stopped listening to his generals he started to fail badly

 

Maybe we should clear the air a little bit about all this "Nazi" stuff, because LOTS of countries in Europe were jumping on the Third Reich 'bandwagon' in the late 1930's for a variety of reasons -- mostly because while the rest of the civilized world was stumbling around in an endless series of economic troubles, Germany was enjoying increased prosperity, along with greater influence and prestige.

In Ukraine, the Germans were welcomed as liberators after what they had suffered under Stalin (as we all know). The Ukrainians had a very effective, distinguished unit during World War II called "14th Waffen Grenadier Division of the SS (1st Galician)". Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/14th_Waffen_Grenadier_Division_of_the_SS_(1st_Galician)

I'm not sure why all the big focus on "Nazis" at this point in history. There were lots of Nazi SYMPATHIZERS, in France, in Holland, in Denmark, in Norway, on and on and on, back in those days. There were even quite a few people in England and the United States who were quite appreciative of what the Nazis were doing to fight Communism back in those times. Why would it be surprising that people who had suffered under Stalin would welcome a chance to ally themselves with anyone who was fighting the Soviet Union...?

Anyway, all that came to an end over SEVENTY-SIX YEARS AGO, which was quite a bit before even an 'old guy' like me was even born!

Here is a very hard-to-get image of one of the Ukrainian flags in use back during World War II, for anyone who collects these kinds of pictures.

 

The Western Ukraine's hatred had nothing to do with communism. It was solely towards the Russians as it is today and it started when they were under Poland and especially the Austrian/Hungarian Empire. Their intent was to establish their own nation and the Nazis gave them the opportunity to kill off the Poles living there - which they did.

The problem though is not what a nation did in the past. The problem is when the mind set continues - as it's doing today with the Western Ukrainians. When Poland which had underwent the greatest atrocities imaginable complained about them celebrating Stephen Bandera with torchlight parades, instead of being apologetic for the crimes committed under his name, the Western nationalist Ukrainians were furious that the Poles would insult the father of their country.

But what father of the country was he, since the one who gave them the former Polish lands is Stalin - it wasn't Bandera. So when they celebrate Bandera, they're doing it for no other reason than his leadership in cleansing the lands from the Poles - which they did in the most inhumane manner imaginable. According to reports, it shocked even the hardened Germans.

https://www.thefirstnews.com/articl...years-ago-today-and-lasted-for-two-years-6714
​

Yet even this would be excusable if there was a true repentance, after all I am a Christian and I know people can change, yet their actions towards the Russians in Ukraine have been no different then what it was towards the Poles. Zalensky even said he wants to rid Ukraine of Russians even though it is and has always been their lands.

The Western area of Ukraine has always been poor and was carried by the Donbass since that's where the mines and industries are. The nationalists with their innate hatred towards the Russians were driven by promises that if they drove the 'Mongol' Russians out like they did the Poles, they could grab their wealth and homes.

This would explain why during the recent wars they were bombing only the poorer homes and leaving the wealthier ones intact. Same people, same mind set.

 

Thank you for your much better-informed perspective. Admittedly, I have completely overlooked the intense enmity between Poland and Ukraine, and, the hatred that existed between western and eastern Ukraine.

I know quite a lot about Germany, yes. But my understanding concerning much of anything relating to Eastern Europe is shallow.

From seeing that map you provided, there wasn't even a very large "Ukraine" at all until Russia gave them large tracts of territory after 1654....

 

US embassy families to evacuate Ukraine as Russia tensions rise

https://nypost.com/2022/01/22/us-embassy-families-face-ukraine-evacuation-orders-report/

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What the map @Jeannette posted represents the 'area' referred to as 'Ukraine'...Ukraine wasn't a thing until Lenin made it an administrative district of the Soviet Union with the stroke of a pen....random lines on a map.

For clarification, here is 1914 Russia before the Lenin Bolshevik revolution-Russian civil war/WW1:

 

Well, yes, in a very real sense there was no such thing as "Ukraine" in modern times until 1917. The Soviet Union really put Ukraine 'on the map', in the 20th-century, and there it remained, as a part of the Soviet Union, until that whole thing completely imploded in 1991.

 

Britain accuses Russia of plot to install pro-Kremlin leader in Ukraine

The claim comes as Russia amasses troops and materiel near the Ukrainian border ahead of what Western officials fear will be an assault on Ukraine.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...e7e8a6816e7945f/9/57/61ed35589d2fda14d703d627

 

It's all propaganda since the Russian troops are 178 kilometers away from the border, and Lavrov has said many times that Russia has no intention of invading.

Accusing Russia of wanting to invade gives them an excuse to arm Ukraine. From what I read Germany has stopped Estonia from sending troops to Ukraine and only Britain is doing so. But they're not flying over France or Germany for fear they'll be forced to land.

Why Germany and France? Well they were the ones who guaranteed together with Russia the Minsk II peace agreement. According to the agreement which was suggested by Merkel, the government was to be decentralized and Donbas was to be given autonomy. As for the rest of Ukraine, it was to be federalized.

Zalensky has been doing everything to meet with Putin and discuss the Treaty, but Putin said that Moscow was not a signatory to the treaty, it was between Kiev and the 2 Republics. When Kiev complies with the treaty, then he'll talk with him.

As to why Germany didn't pressure Kiev to carry through with the agreement all these years - something which infuriated Putin, is because of Washington.

 

Biden considers deploying thousands of US troops to Ukraine

https://nypost.com/2022/01/23/us-draws-down-ukraine-embassy-presence-as-war-fears-mount/

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This is what I suspect. Since Russia cannot be defeated militarily, the neo con plan now is to create an insurgency the way they did in Syria to get rid of Assad. It's been 10 years, and yet the neo cons are still at it in Syria, even stealing their oil and trying to starve them - yet the people to their credit refuse to bow to tyranny.

This might be why Britain is sending agents into Ukraine; with the hope that if things go bad for the Russian troops the people will get rid of Vladimir Putin. Well, they destroyed the Middle East so I guess now its Ukraine and maybe even Europe's turn. I assume the agents will commit some kind of major attack, chemical or otherwise, and then accuse Russia of killing its own people to invade Ukraine.

Up until now Russia has managed to fend off their provocations and manipulations - whether it's in Russia, Crimea, or Kazakhstan. Let's hope they can so this time before innocent people die, and Ukraine is destroyed completely.

Hee, hee, hee!
​

You'll know it's me when there's no peace
from the attacks that never cease.
For malice; it's my special work.
A job which I shall never shirk.

And should the truth for once be told.
it works through those in my control.
For that's my will and what I deem,
where greed and hatred reign supreme.

- Jeannette​

 

It's just more disinformation. What's not mentioned is that Poroshenko, who has been charged with treason by Zalensky and had his companies confiscated, has returned to Ukraine - so that the break out of violence is just another turf war between the one mafia king Poroshenko, and the other mafia king Kolomoisky who controls Zalensky.

It has nothing to do with Russia.

 

The United States is discussing the deployment of American military assets to eastern Europe with its NATO allies, a senior administration official said Monday, as President Joe Biden weighs U.S. options for responding to Russian threats against Ukraine.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/na...sEna+SGeZc7tyUhvD596k7Lze5mWCXf8Bt0yyDioBAAA=

 

U.S. threatens use of novel export control against Russia

If Moscow invades Ukraine, the United States may impose export restrictions on any product containing semiconductors made with American tools or designed with American software, Biden administration officials say.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...e7e8a6816e7945f/9/71/61ee86b99d2fda14d705c318

 

And Russia will put Boeing out of business when they stop supplying titanium. See how this works?

Bidumb doesn't have the legal authority to deploy thousands of troops to Ukraine without congressional approval. The War Powers Resolution and Joint Resolution of 9/14/2001 (9/11 resolution concerning terrorism) don't cover an incursion into Ukraine. And since Ukraine is not a NATO member, that doesn't apply either. Seems as though nobody even mentions this anymore since the US is occupying so many parts of the world they just assume it's normal to deploy thousands of troops to random countries....that we've got no business in.

 

I wonder if any of you have heard of the Budapest Memorandum.
I hadn't until someone mentioned it on the radio this afternoon..

Ukraine's forgotten security guarantee: The Budapest Memorandum
Twenty years ago, Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees from Russia and the West. Today Kyiv feels betrayed - and not merely by Moscow.

https://www.dw.com/en/ukraines-forgotten-security-guarantee-the-budapest-memorandum/a-18111097

The document was signed on 5 December, 1994 at the summit of the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE). In it, Ukraine, a nuclear power at that time, voluntarily gave up its nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees.

The US, Great Britain and Russia welcomed the decision of the Kyiv regime to accede to the non-proliferation agreement and pledged, among other things, to respect the independence and "existing borders" of Ukraine.

The Soviet Union, Belarus and Kazakhstan signed similar memoranda on the same day.

 

Seems Germany, which has no intention of destroying its economy to please the Washington neo liberal/cons, refused to give Ukraine access to its weapon technology. Something that infuriated Kiev. Germany also stopped Estonia from sending their weapons to Kiev.

I know Merkel was the one who came up with the Minsk II agreement to decentralize the Kiev government, and give the Donbas area autonomy as well as have the rest of Ukraine federalized.

The plan now if there's a war - and it seems there might be since Ukraine is massing its troops again along the demarcation line of the Republics, is to give the Eastern part of Ukraine over to Russian control, and Germany will take Galicia and the Western part - something that should please the nationalists.

I don't doubt that Germany has been supporting Ukraine financially since the people have been suffering economic hardships. This might be why Porky's back in Kiev, while Washington no doubt would be supporting its Ukrainian mafia cohorts and themselves in return with kickbacks.

Anyway, it seems Britain has taken the leadership in the propaganda towards war, as it did in WWI and WWII - after all deception is their forte', as we saw in Syria. What I find worrisome, is that the Russian Defense Minister Shoigu has accepted the invitation to go to London for talks.

When Putin had to go Australia, the whole Russian navy sat outside as a warning for them not to try anything. Also when Putin went to London many years ago, he brought along his own bottle water for fear of poisoning - something Britain is known for.

Right now Kiev is massing all its troops along the demarcation line of the 2 Republics. I believe Kiev is going to commit a false flag attack as soon as Putin goes to the games in China, maybe a chemical one since British agents were involved in the ones in Syria. Hmmm! I wonder if it will be about the same time that Shoigu will be in Britain?



I'm singing now a wondrous song,

to tell the world that right is wrong​

and what you thought was naught before,

was just a lie that you had bought ​

from us. - Jeannette

 

Are you for real?
and while you are carving Ukraine up, maybe you should ask them what they want.

 

Did anyone ask the Eastern part of Ukraine what they wanted when their legitimately elected president was overthrown by Nuland and the Western Ukrainian nationalists in a coup?

Why do you think Crimea, Donetsk and Lugansk seceded?



Hi ya guys!

Sam's my name
and regime change my game,
that I blatantly call democracy.

And as you all know
it's only a show,
to gain me another kleptocracy.

So if you object
to what I have done
in taking your rights away?

I couldn't care less
on what you might say;
for with my money and lies

I WON. - Jeannette