Part 38 of Post Your Tough Questions Regarding Christianity

Matters not if you're a Christian, Jesus didn't show up for at least another 1500 yrs after the Godly flood that drowned all on earth but for ark creatures.

 

What are you saying?
a - I don't believe in the biblical God because of the Noah story
b - I don't love the biblical God because He drowned everyone.

 

Not sure what you are trying to say.
I can tell you who Jesus 'killed' but it's not written in the New Testament.
In the record Jesus laid his hand on no-one.

 

And as for his Father and those He commanded?

 

I am saying your use of Godly includes killing everything on earth. But ark creatures.
It was pretty obvious.

 

So... it's (a) then, "I don't believe in the biblical God because..."
Now here's something interesting - the God that killed in the bible
also killed in history. The curse of the Jew was that they 'did not know
the day of their visitation' said Jesus. The Jew would lose his temple,
his nation and his eternal city of Jerusalem 'will be trampled under the
feet of the Gentiles, until the Gentile time is fulfilled.' And so for 2,000
years the Jews suffered pogroms, genocides, final solutions and being
driven out of 110 countries. But the Jew would remain when most of the
ethnic groups of the bible are long gone.
You might find the flood story silly - but just read any historic account
of the Jewish people and you see a parallel.

 

No, it's you use of Godly. Killing all on earth but ark creatures.

 

I have all of the answers.

Did you redeem the firstborn of your donkey with a lamb or did you have to break his neck?

According to the New Testament, where will you go when you die?

Why didn't either James or John call fire down from heaven to save Jesus from being crucified? They said that they could do such a thing. Elijah did it.

 

Godly is what God does, I suggest.
God killed off many Jews, as the bible said would happen.
But that doesn't mean YOU can go kill who you like.

 

You are absolutely right, so you know from common sense that it is obviously immoral to kill, therefore, it follows by logic alone that morality is not subjective but objective. Many people oppose wars, oppose executions, oppose any kind of killings...why? because it's just common sense to them that killing is immoral. So morality is objective.

But any how if you still can't see it, let me put up the Christian view of morals once again. I believe I gave this to you before but maybe if you read it again carefully you will see and understand the Christian perspective.

There can only be objective moral values with God.

When we state that objective moral values exist, what we mean is that there are moral values that govern all humans, regardless of whether or not those humans want those values to govern them, like those values, or accept those values.

If moral values were the result of popular vote, then they would only govern humans because humans had decided to allow them to govern them. Then moral values would not be objective, but rather, subjective.

However, moral values are not subjective in this sense, in the sense that they are the complete invention of the minds of those they govern. If they were subjective in this sense, Hitler's Germany would be no less moral than any other society, and this is not the case.

Thus, moral values are not subjective in this sense. Instead, they are objective in the sense that they govern all humans, at all times, regardless of those individuals' approvals.

If God did not exist, there would not only be no concept of "ought", there would also be no one around to conceptualize it.

Since there is a God, there is a Higher Moral Authority, and therefore there are things we "ought" to do. One of the first and foremost of these things is that we ought to obey our God.

Thus, moral values that govern humans stem from the existence of, and perfect qualities of, our Creator, who is an eternally objective reality. They do not come from the whimsical fancies of a transient consciousness.

So moral values are certainly not subjective but they are definitely objective. But if you are still not convinced click on the link below, maybe after reading the blog you will finally be convinced that morality is objective.

https://blogs.calbaptist.edu/scm/2020/02/04/is-morality-subjective-or-objective/

It's true that the Scriptures of the Bible did not specifically condemn the practice of slavery. In Ephesians 6:9, Colossians 4:1, Exodus 21:1-11 and Deut. 15:12-15 are instructions on how slaves should be treated.

Many critics of the Bible mistakenly see this as the Bible condoning all forms of slavery but that is inherently false. What these critics fail to understand is that the slavery during biblical times was very different from the slavery that was practiced in the past few centuries in many parts of the world. In Biblical times slavery was based on economics, it was a matter of social status. People sold themselves as slaves when they could not pay their debts. The slavery during biblical times were not based exclusively on race, whereas the slavery of the past few centuries was often based exclusively on skin color/race.

The blacks who were enslaved here in this country the USA were believed to be inferior human beings by their slave owners, which was ignorant thinking, in fact the Bible condemns race based slavery. Scripture tells us all men are created by God and made in His image. At the same time, the Old Testament did allow for economic-based slavery and regulated it. The key issue is that the slavery the Bible allowed for in no way resembled the racial slavery that plagued our world in the past few centuries.

No, you are mistaken. The act of raping has always been a sinful act, it is depicted as a gross violation of God's design for the treatment of the human body.

The passage of Deuteronomy 22:13-29 spoke directly against forcing a woman into a sexual encounter against her will, or what we know today as rape. This command was meant to protect women and to protect the nation of Israel from committing sinful actions.

Any man who raped a woman was to be killed by stoning under the punishment of the Mosaic Law.

We Read in Scripture:

"But if the man meets the engaged woman out in the country, and he rapes her, then only the man must die. Do nothing to the young woman, she has committed no crime worthy of death. She is as innocent as a murder victim." Deuteronomy 22:25-26 NLT

Though the Mosaic Law was for the nation of Israel during the time of Moses, the principle is clear that rape is sinful in the eyes of God and led to the most extreme punishment possible which was death for the rapist.

Yes, there is no direct mention of pedophilia in the Bible. However there are numerous biblical principles that apply to this sin. Pedophilia definitely is sexual immorality, an abnormal sexual desire in an adult for children. And anything immoral is a transgression against God.

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ gave us a stern warning about abusing the little ones to fall into sin and a pedophile is an abuser of children, having them fall into sexual immoral sinful acts.

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

5 "And anyone who welcomes a little child like this on my behalf is welcoming me. 6 But if you cause one of these little ones who trusts in me to fall into sin, it would be better for you to have a large millstone tied around your neck and be drowned in the depths of the sea." Matthew 18:5-6 NLT

 

Yes, and god killed all things on earth but ark creatures. I've said that several times now.

Never said anything about what anyone else can or can't do. Just pointing out godly in your terms.

 

I admire your skill and knowledge Mitt, your skills are something I know I lack in communication skills. My problem is I know a lot of things, but am not of a disposition to express them effectively, I get impatient having to explain things that should already be known.

 

how marvelous to have a personal philosophy protected by and insulated from any doubt - based on your first principle. A facile one size fits all explanation to all contradiction, justify any human action, slice thru any conundrum.

God made it, did it, punished it, killed it, gave it, took it, commanded it, because he owns the joint and everything in it, he can do what he wants and besides nobody can know the mind of god, so buck up buttercup and take it like the good little creation you are. God has a plan for you that you don't know. (which is just another way of saying - life is what happens to you while your busy making other plans).

OTOH, if your belief gives you relief and eases the journey, you should consider yourself fortunate and ignore old agnostic atheists such as myself since we are a wholly lost cause in embracing your version of the deep meaning of it all.

 

Hey my name got mentioned here so I need to make a response. What appears to be true does not necessarily mean it is true. I don't play any games here, certainly not that guilt by association game.

Where have I associated Jeff being an atheist is the primary reason why he committed those heinous, despicable crimes? Did I say something like, "because Jeff was an atheist, he committed those atrocious down right awful crimes"?...the answer is no!

But still though that doesn't change the fact that Jeff was known to be an atheist. Of course that doesn't mean only atheist commit heinous crimes, it's just that in this particular case the maniac happened to be an atheist. People shouldn't get offended by facts/truths.

If I say something like, "Former President Trump was slightly over-weight". That shouldn't offend over-weight people but somehow the fact/truth offends some of them...that's ridiculous! You need to grow some kahunas Jonsa...lol j/k my friend!

 

Thanks Todd for your kind words! I felt just like you initially when I began to post here at the forum but through time and experience I got more comfortable. So have you started any threads? If not go ahead and start one, I will come by to visit now and then. Take care and God Bless!

 

Are you asking where I (Mitt Ryan) will go? Please be specific... who is "you" referring to? Do you mean to ask where will "people" go?

 

You and I are people. People include you and me.

Therefore, when people die, which includes both of us, where do you think you (or your "soul") will go?

 

Oh so when you ask me a question I will just tell you...you already know the answer so why should I bother telling you.

 

Gee whiz, what's the fun in that? How will you ever be able to pass your Judgment Day interview when your work record shows that you never answered difficult questions?

Was ancient Solomon smarter than modern you?
1 Kings 10:3 (CEB) = Solomon answered all her questions; nothing was too difficult for him to answer.

Remember what the Lord said to Job in Job 38:3 & Job 40:7 = Get ready to face me and answer the questions I ask.

 

Sorry but you are asking an incoherent question.

Elijah didn't call fire down from heaven, it was God who sent down a chariot of fire, drawn by horses of fire and Elijah was carried by a whirlwind into heaven.
Did you know that only Elijah and Enoch didn't die natural deaths? They were the only ones taken to heaven without first dying natural deaths in the history of mankind...fascinating isn't it?

We Read in Scripture:

11 As they were walking along and talking, suddenly a chariot of fire appeared, drawn by horses of fire. It drove between the two men, separating them, and Elijah was carried by a whirlwind into heaven. 2 Kings 2:11 NLT

5 It was by faith that Enoch was taken up to heaven without dying—“he disappeared, because God took him.” For before he was taken up, he was known as a person who pleased God. 6 And it is impossible to please God without faith. Anyone who wants to come to him must believe that God exists and that he rewards those who sincerely seek him. Hebrews 11:5-6 NLT

 

John2 :15

 

Well yeah humans are sociable alright but I wouldn't go as far as to say we are "social animals"...lol How bout saying we are "social beings of the humankind"?...that's a better way to describe us...don't you think?

It's pretty ironic that you say you don't need God to tell you what is moral or not and go on to say that you adhere to the principle of the golden rule. Well that principle, "The Golden Rule" originated in the Bible. Were you ever a former Christian?

We Read in Scripture:

Our Lord Savior Jesus Christ said,

The Golden Rule
12 "Do to others whatever you would like them to do to you. This is the essence of all that is taught in the law and the prophets." Matthew 7:12 NLT

 

Mitt, please read your favorite ancient ethnocentric Middle Eastern Jewish religious fairy tale if you want to continue discussing it.

Luke 9:54 = https://classic.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Luke 9:54

2 Kings 1:10 = https://classic.biblegateway.com/verse/en/2 Kings 1:10

2 Kings 1:12 =https://classic.biblegateway.com/verse/en/2 Kings 1:12

Elijah did it twice and was ready for more. James and John were just all talk and no action.

 

According to the biblical fairy tale, why do people need God to tell them what is moral? While you may have read a little of it, you don't seem to have ever thought about what you have read.

To refresh your memory, please read Genesis 3:22 again = https://classic.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Genesis 3:22.

The verse plainly says that man is as intelligent as God and plainly knows the difference between good and evil. If that is true, then what can the God character add since man already knows what God knows?

BTW, if the Jesus character was actually who he claimed to have been, he never did follow the Golden Rule himself when it came to interacting with Gentiles. He was a bigoted racist who spoke in parables so that outsiders couldn't understand his message and therefore gain the eternal life that he claimed to have been able to deliver.
http://thebricktestament.com/the_parables_of_jesus/use_of_parables_explained/mk04_33-34.html 5 pictures

 

WE are social animals. Products of the natural world that is this planet. ANIMALS with the same fundamental drives as many of our fellow animals. From flight or fight to sexual attraction and the behaviors it invokes in humans and literally dozens of biological and behavioral similarities.

No, the golden rule did not originate in the bible. this ancient wisdom preceded the bible by some 1500 years at least.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Rule

Here's my entire moral code in three simple rules.

Rule #1 Do unto others as you would have done unto you.
Rule #2 Live and Let Live.
Rule #3 Do unto others as they do unto others if they break either rule 1 or 2.

EVERYTHING humans do can be encompassed in these three simple moral principles. No god required. No fear of eternal damnation. Just a simple method of living a good "moral" life.