Question to pro-choicers: what traits does a fetus need to be considered a person?

The rights of the mother comes before the fetus. The fetus literally have no rights. You can say the fetus have moral rights, but that only apply from your perspective.

So you would rather the mother give birth and potentially create even more homeless children, instead of having an abortion and perhaps adopt one that's running around on the street?

 

Breathing..........

 

Only a person who mistakenly thinks a fetus is a born person with rights would think your way....

 

So you say life in the womb is human life and you want to end it for convenience. So I say then by that logic, why not end the lives of the already "homeless children" for convenience as well. That would ease the burden and guilt upon society. Remember, you are the one that initially said that "the fetus is human as soon as the sperm fertilizes the egg".. I will add it is living as well. You want to allow it's termination for "convenience". That is the hypocricy that all pro-choice positions take. All I would say is "Choose life".

 

Convenience? It's a matter of a basic human right for the woman to choose whether or not she wants to have a child, mate. It's not something that's withing your rights nor power to force upon her. She is perfectly within her rights to say "No, I do not want a child and I am going for an abortion".

The needs of the currently living outweigh the needs of the yet-born. You have 2.5 million homeless children. Again, what are you to do with them?

 

Of course abortions are for convenience ! What else would they be for?

A woman may find it inconvienient to have a kid she doesn't want and/or can't afford.

Do you find it honorable and right to do everything in your life as INconveniently as possible? That would be silly!

If the only "choice" is "life"( forced gestation) then DUH, there is no choice. Look up "choice" in the dictionary...

There is no hypocrisy in Pro-CHOICE, it means women have the right to choose what to do with their bodies.


Your "why not end the lives of the already homeless children" is an assinine and illogical conclusion. Children are BORN persons with rights.

Fetuses are NOT born persons with rights.

 

By the same token, men should be able to say "No, I do not want a child and I am going to opt out of any rights and responsibilities toward the fetus someone else is choosing to gestate." Her body, her choice, her responsibility.

 

People with conception issues don’t take drugs in the hope of having a fetus.

Only people that want to kill their babies call it a fetus to assuage their lack of morals.

Life is continuous so conception is the answer to the OP. Not arbitrary points can be morally acceptable.

 

Yes, that is my view on the topic. The right to choose.

Whether a man should however is a different topic entirely.

 

This sounds a lot like: "A man's house is his castle. You can consider children to be persons any time you wish. As long as your option is never allowed inside someone else's house."

 

She could just as well say "I'm not going to have unprotected sex". Perhaps that would even decrease the number of homeless children that you value so highly over the unborn children.....but that would entail "personal responsibility", something liberals wish would go away.

 

Correct "Her body, her choice, her responsibility"

However the law says BOTH parents are responsible for their CHILDREN.

When a child is born the female parent is responsible for it, the male parent also should be. They both created that child ....if the either parent, or both parents, can't or won't support it then taxpayers have to. So the law goes after parents who don't support their own children.



Maybe some day men (and women) will be able to sign legal contracts saying they don't have to support any of their children...but then if they EVER make contact with that child ever ( or they respond to the child trying to contact them) they are FINED and JAILED for breach of contract.

 

She could just as well say "I don't want drugs or foreign objects in my body and if I get pregnant I'll have a legal medical procedure called an abortion":


I think it's very responsible to not have a kid you don't want or can't afford..

 

In the cases of unintended pregnancy, I don't see how one can argue that a woman has the right to opt out of legal parenthood during the first trimester without giving the biological father the same right. This fits the very definition of social injustice, and also disproportionately puts men of color into involuntary servitude. In extreme cases, it also puts women's lives at risk (see Laci Peterson, Lori Hacking, etc.)

 

She is taking responsibility by having an abortion. Taking responsibility over her own situation which may not allow for the safe upbringing of a child.

You've still not answered my question: What do we do with the 2.5 million homeless children? Or perhaps a more appropriate question to ask would be "Do you value those who are already living?"

 

Not true. Fetus is a medical term that describes the stage of development, like egg, embryo, zygote, infant, toddler, etc.

 

And if abortion is banned ( putting women in INVOLUNTARY SERVITUDE) women should have the same right to "opt out " of parenting.


Maybe some day men (and women) will be able to sign legal contracts saying they don't have to support any of their children...but then if they EVER make contact with that child ever ( or they respond to the child trying to contact them) they are FINED and JAILED for breach of contract



….and taxpayers take up the slack...

 

I value all life....you pick and choose as if you were God. Responsibility comes before abortion. Do you deny that?....or is it just something that happens to us? duh!

 

YOU may but life only has the value others put on it.

I guess you oppose all wars and oppose Republicans cutting funding to Welfare, WIC, SNAP, entities that benefit CHILDREN ?

No, a woman chooses because, like you and everyone else, she has a right to her own body.

Yup, and women think before they have an abortion if they want or need one.

Uh, YOU don't get to dictate "responsibility"


I think it's responsible to respond to posts.....and you may ignore mine but any other poster can read them and see facts...

 

Responsibility over oneself comes before someone else. Your own well-being should have priority before someone else.

If a woman knows she is incapable of taking care of a child(be it because she has a low income, her household situation is unstable, noisy neighborhood, +++) it is her responsibility to take action and take on the consequences of that action. If she ends up having an abortion that is perfectly within her rights. Sometimes the responsible action is having an abortion.

If you value all life why are you so keen on the unborn and almost ignore the already living and possibly suffering children out there?

 

Killing in the womb...responsible? How 'bout requiring a condom, birth control, or perhaps abstaining, knowing she does not have enough responsibility to raise a family? Perhaps a tubal ligation would be in order, or sterilization for her partners.

 

GEE, does that ever sound like the Bigger Government Repubs want!!

Total control of women's reproduction as if they were cattle...how disgusting...despicable!

 

Not raising a family is responsibility in an of itself, when you know you can't take care of one. There is not just one form of responsibility, mate.

Want to help? Adopt a kid who is roaming your streets.

 

Ending life does not show responsibility. Want to help? take a kid off the streets and teach him values and responsibility. I do. Immoral people breed like rats. Nothing to do to change that.

 

Ending a life, a life that can't even fathom the very concept of being alive yet, a life that could quite easily make both lives unhappy is IMO a good responsibility to take. Sorry, but you do not have the moral high ground here, mate. I could call you immoral for wanting to force a woman to bear a child she doesn't want, but I won't. Different morals does not equate immorality.

So you'd be fine if I took a kid off the streets and taught him/her my values and ethics? Glad we see eye to eye then.