Real World: Nature And Civilization

Discussion in 'Women's Rights' started by ibshambat, Mar 20, 2018.

  1. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    I once was with an extraordinarily beautiful artist named Julia Howard. Julia loved beautiful things in nature and made magnificent paintings and photographs. Many people were saying that she did not live in reality.

    These people have an inadequate understanding of what reality is. Nature is just as real as they are, and there is amazing richness and variety in nature – richness and variety beyond anything that they have created themselves. And from observing life in all its richness and variety these people stand not only to enrich their lives but also arrive at greater and fuller understanding of reality.

    Now I am not saying that socio-economic reality is not real. I am saying that there is much more to reality than many people recognize. The business world can take people over and lead them into completely wrongful directions. I have seen even the kindest people acting in mean and abusive ways when they were lost in that world. They thought that what they were a part of was reality proper. No, it is a part of reality. There is much more to reality than they believe. And after they retired, some recaptured the beauty that they had known previously and made it, through their art or their writings, part of the human reality of the world.

    As it impacts upon people, reality consists of both nature and civilization. Both worlds need to be in the best shape that they can be, and people must have the benefits of both worlds. The worst approach we see in the Berbers and the Anasazi, who turned huge stretches of greenery into desert without contributing much of anything to the civilization. There are two complementary semi-solutions: The purely natural lifestyle of Native Americans and the purely technological lifestyle of American Midwest. The full solution is found in place such as California, where people are enjoying the comforts of technological lifestyle while also valuing and taking care of nature.

    Both worlds are completely real. And both need to be in the best shape that they can be. The first reflects reality as not created by people. The second reflects reality as created by people. Once again, both must be in the best shape that they can be.

    Is the economic infrastructure real? Of course it is. But, once again, so is nature. And while people have come up with many impressive and useful things, they also stand a lot to learn from nature. A reality that they have not created and that they cannot at this time re-create.

    I have the influence of both Ayn Rand and Ward Churchill, both of whom I read at approximately the same time. Both of them were part-right. Ayn Rand was right to champion the civilization, wrong to have no respect for nature. Ward Churchill was right to defend indigenous lifestyles, wrong to demonize the Western Civilization. Both worlds contain amazing richness, and both worlds can, and should, get along.

    When I was young, I was both a yuppie and a hippie. I made good money in the computer industry, and I was having various adventures and contact with nature. Once again, both sides have a half of the picture. Once focuses on civilization, the other focuses on nature. The two should work together. So that when an Anglican minister tells me that we have an obligation to take care of both nature and one another, he is speaking a home truth.

    For a long time many people saw nature as something to be conquered; and indeed the people who went to the frontier and made it habitable for people while suffering vicious hardships deserve respect. However there is nothing at all respectable about Brazilian farmers burning rich and beautiful environments in order to make room for ranches that last two years then turn into a mud plain. There is nothing respectable about denying global warming or clinging to destructive technologies when there are many technologies that stand to fulfil humanit's needs at present and greater levels with fewer destructive effects. And there is nothing respectable about seeing a part of reality as the whole of reality while blindly plundering natural treasures that one has not created and cannot re-create.

    Many people have stated that the happiest lifestyle is to cultivate a garden. The Amish, though they lack our amenities, appear to be quite happy. Once again, I do not advocate anything such as doing away with the civilization. The ultra-liberal Dr. Elizabeth Hubbard, who used to go on the Internet as Doctress Neutopia, stated that a large-scale move to the land would only create Appalachia on a large scale. I advocate for the full solution, where we have both nature and civilization and have the benefit of both worlds.

    So that while people in business are dealing with the real world, so was Julia Howard. And her contributions of beauty and wisdom found in nature have been rightfully acclaimed by many highly competent and completely rational people and imparted a very important perspective that many people would have missed.
     
  2. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    Strange how all your rants about the Women you had boinky with always starts with how beautiful they were.
     
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  3. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    Oh please. There is no incompatibility whatsoever between physical beauty and other good traits. It is wrong to value only beauty; it is also wrong to see beauty as being incompatible with intelligence or strength or anything of the sort. Russian women for one tend to have all of the above. And the more Russian women come to America, the more such wrongful beliefs will be rightfully challenged.
     
  4. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    You speak out of turn.

    Since my youth, I have known many Russian Women, and so I know of what I speak.

    Frankly, I do not go looking at whether a person is homely, or beautiful or young or old, I see other things as important.

    I merely commented on a trend I noticed in your descriptions of women, and they all start in the same manner, as opening each meal with an identical chocolate covered cherry.
    Boring after a while.
     
  5. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    I am from Russia, so I probably know more about Russian women than do you. Once again, they are strong, smart and beautiful. And the more Americans come in contact with such women, the more they will have to do away with the attitude that physical beauty is incompatible with other good traits.
     
  6. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    I am sure that is true.

    I am not ignorant of Russian Women or Russians in general, having had many Russian freinds in my younger years.

    My absolute best freind of 20 years since age 10, was Russian, though I do not expect you to understand that in any substantial way.

    "And the more Americans come in contact with such women, the more they will have to do away with the attitude that physical beauty is incompatible with other good traits."


    As always, you sure post strange ramblings proving you know very little about Americans apart from ancient Television shows such as Baywatch.
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2018
  7. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    Oh yeah, I know nothing about Americans at all. That's why I lived in America from age 12 to age 30 and experienced many places and many subcultures. As for Baywatch and related things, they mean to me absolutely nothing. I've been all around the country and in various lifestyles. I don't even watch TV, I get my news from the Internet. It is good that you've had a Russian friend; these people tend to set you straight on any number of matters.
     
  8. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    Shows how little you know.
    You do not comprehend very well.
     
  9. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    thats very rude, stop bullying people
     
  10. delade

    delade Well-Known Member

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    I agree that nature is real. Our very lives are first nature-al, natural. We learn how to become beasts only after. But even beasts are natural. And beasts were not created to be chained just as humans were not created to be beasts. But I need to remember in today's time, nature is bought with a payment. There are NO free if you don't want to live in the completely isolated wild. After a visit to the local national park or take a hike on mountain or hill paths, we return back to where rent needs to be in on the 1st.

    So there is nature, there are those that plant the flowers and trees in the nature and then there's the true free nature where man rarely sets foot in.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2018
  11. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    That is your job, stop trolling.
     
  12. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Im not being rude at all, just exposing bullying behavior
     
  13. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    No, you are projecting.
    Disagreeing or dissenting with a point of view is not bullying.
     
  14. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    you didn't disagree at all.

    you didn't dissent at all.

    you simply attacked someone, and that is bullying.
     
  15. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    No, you are trolling me throughout, and that is wrong, cease doing it.
     
  16. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    It's interesting how sometimes people start out flaming each other but become friends, and how sometimes people start out liking each other but become enemies. A friend of mine said that sometimes the nice people are worse than mean ones. In any case I would rather hear someone's honest opinion even if it offends me than have someone pretend to be good to me while waiting to screw me over.
     
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  17. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    Very true.
     

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