Roe Vs. Wade should be overturned

Discussion in 'Abortion' started by Joe knows, Sep 1, 2021.

  1. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    53,106
    Likes Received:
    19,672
    Trophy Points:
    113
    .

    And you think "defense from an aggressor is the only reason countries go to war ??? Laughable...

    But you haven't called the cops yet...hmmmmm...


    And you don't believe in the right to self defense either...but I bet you would defend yourself from harm...
     
  2. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    Messages:
    52,407
    Likes Received:
    10,346
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It is no secret that the religious right is the political force behind the anti abort movement.
    Republicanism died in the GOP - and it is the religious right that is responsible for this death -as they have controled the Party platform for many years - and are the downfall of the right.

    It is no different on the Blue side however, these uber left wing finatics have led to the death of any remnents of classical liberalism on the Blue side.. Full on collectivist authoritarianism = Authoritarianism based on "Utilitarianism" - justification for law on the basis of "What will increase happiness/reduce harm for the collective"

    While this justification often sounds good on the surface "If it saves one life" - the flaws are numerous

    1) completely ignores essential liberty of the individual - and thus an anathama to the founding principle - and the definition of a constitutional republic.
    2) Gives near unlimited power to Gov't - by removing the main safeguard
    3) often the utilitarian justification given is fallacious .. not even valid utilitarian justification .. and who gets to decide ? one mans poison is another mans pleasure .. but you have a small group deciding

    For example - "If it saves one life" / "harm reduction" sounds nice - which is what makes it so insidious - but, is horrible justification for law.

    If the above is good justification - should we not ban skiing ? would we not save one life ? .. what about boating .. that is really dangerous - one could drown .. driving a car? forget it .. in fact one should probably not rise from bed in the morning as the risk of harm from walking is 400 times greater than the risk of harm from a terrorist attack

    Yet - on the basis of this scary risk of harm "terrorist attack" - it has become our "Patriotic Duty" to trade liberty for security.
     
  3. cristiansoldier

    cristiansoldier Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2014
    Messages:
    2,707
    Likes Received:
    1,896
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Is the heartbeat standard only for fetuses or does it apply to all human life? Fox example what if someone is brain dead would it be murder for the doctor or family to let them die or should the body be kept alive?
     
  4. Cougarbear

    Cougarbear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    2,422
    Likes Received:
    1,130
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    In order to terminate a pregnancy, you have to murder the fetus which is infanticide. You should get a dictionary, mate.
    Ever hear that the unborn baby has those same rights. If not so, it would not be illegal to kill a child that the mother wants. But, if one does something to the mother and the baby dies, the attacker can be charged with homicide and even murder. So, the baby has those same Constitutional and Declaration of Independence rights as well. By the way, there is no phrase in the Constitution "Separation of Church and State." There is a 1st amendment that says the "STATE" shall not infringe upon the rights of individual to exercise their religion. Exercise means speaking up, worshipping, speaking out publicly (freedom of speech) and being political about one's beliefs. The Bill of Rights are to restrict the Government, not the individual. So, we don't have to keep our bible's or any other books of our perceived religious beliefs to ourselves. Any more than your right to use your godless atheist evolutionary books. Thus, you are 100% wrong in believing these Marxist lies.
     
    mswan likes this.
  5. Cougarbear

    Cougarbear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    2,422
    Likes Received:
    1,130
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    In order to terminate a pregnancy, you have to murder the fetus which is infanticide. You should get a dictionary, mate.
    Ever hear that the unborn baby has those same rights. If not so, it would not be illegal to kill a child that the mother wants. But, if one does something to the mother and the baby dies, the attacker can be charged with homicide and even murder. So, the baby has those same Constitutional and Declaration of Independence rights as well. By the way, there is no phrase in the Constitution "Separation of Church and State." There is a 1st amendment that says the "STATE" shall not infringe upon the rights of individual to exercise their religion. Exercise means speaking up, worshipping, speaking out publicly (freedom of speech) and being political about one's beliefs. The Bill of Rights are to restrict the Government, not the individual. So, we don't have to keep our bible's or any other books of our perceived religious beliefs to ourselves. Any more than your right to use your godless atheist evolutionary books. Thus, you are 100% wrong in believing these Marxist lies.
     
  6. Cougarbear

    Cougarbear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    2,422
    Likes Received:
    1,130
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    In order to terminate a pregnancy, you have to murder the fetus which is infanticide. You should get a dictionary, mate.
    Ever hear that the unborn baby has those same rights. If not so, it would not be illegal to kill a child that the mother wants. But, if one does something to the mother and the baby dies, the attacker can be charged with homicide and even murder. So, the baby has those same Constitutional and Declaration of Independence rights as well. By the way, there is no phrase in the Constitution "Separation of Church and State." There is a 1st amendment that says the "STATE" shall not infringe upon the rights of individual to exercise their religion. Exercise means speaking up, worshipping, speaking out publicly (freedom of speech) and being political about one's beliefs. The Bill of Rights are to restrict the Government, not the individual. So, we don't have to keep our bible's or any other books of our perceived religious beliefs to ourselves. Any more than your right to use your godless atheist evolutionary books. Thus, you are 100% wrong in believing these Marxist lies.
     
  7. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    53,106
    Likes Received:
    19,672
    Trophy Points:
    113

    WRONG as usual....the UVVA gives the fetus PROTECTION NOT RIGHTS....it did give harsher penalties for killing pregnant women based on the age of the fetus....
     
  8. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2018
    Messages:
    1,449
    Likes Received:
    879
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yep it's completely outdated at this point is science and biology has caught up to reality.

    Abortion is murder we just have to come to terms with that
     
    mswan likes this.
  9. Joe knows

    Joe knows Newly Registered

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2021
    Messages:
    2,102
    Likes Received:
    1,306
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    This also is different. If the heart can not live without a machine it would sue if natural causes. Not equivalent in my mind.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2021
  10. cristiansoldier

    cristiansoldier Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2014
    Messages:
    2,707
    Likes Received:
    1,896
    Trophy Points:
    113
    But the fetus cannot live on its own without the mother either. Even if the fetus was removed. Isn't the mother the machine that is keeping it alive.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2021
  11. Cougarbear

    Cougarbear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    2,422
    Likes Received:
    1,130
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Splitting hairs. rights, protections. Same thing.
     
  12. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    53,106
    Likes Received:
    19,672
    Trophy Points:
    113
    FoxHastings said:
    WRONG as usual....the UVVA gives the fetus PROTECTION NOT RIGHTS....it did give harsher penalties for killing pregnant women based on the age of the fetus....


    UGGADUH, NO, they are NOT the same thing that's DUH why there are two DIFFERENT words for them.

    An eagle has protection, that doesn't give it RIGHTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  13. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2013
    Messages:
    18,331
    Likes Received:
    6,691
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Then tell the God of Abraham to stop killing fetuses and adults.
     
    FoxHastings likes this.
  14. Joe knows

    Joe knows Newly Registered

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2021
    Messages:
    2,102
    Likes Received:
    1,306
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Maybe you should tell that to a religious guy
     
  15. Joe knows

    Joe knows Newly Registered

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2021
    Messages:
    2,102
    Likes Received:
    1,306
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    The baby never got a chance, the guy on the machine did.
     
  16. cristiansoldier

    cristiansoldier Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2014
    Messages:
    2,707
    Likes Received:
    1,896
    Trophy Points:
    113
    But now you are changing the heart beat criteria you originally used to having a chance at life. The process gets more and more complicated. How many years of life before heart beat does not matter? If you have a brain dead child from a car accident? A premature baby only hours old that requires an incubator to survive? You are balancing having a heart beat and being able to survive on your own unaided.
     
  17. Joe knows

    Joe knows Newly Registered

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2021
    Messages:
    2,102
    Likes Received:
    1,306
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    No I’m not changing a thing. Circumstances obviously change in every scenario. Even the courts recognize that.
     
  18. Joe knows

    Joe knows Newly Registered

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2021
    Messages:
    2,102
    Likes Received:
    1,306
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    They all matter but our youth deserves an adults care. They deserve a chance at life. Yes I’m referring to them as people because in my mind they are. They are the most vulnerable of people. They’re not just a sack of mush
     
  19. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    53,106
    Likes Received:
    19,672
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The FETUS never had rights, the guy on the machine does.
     
  20. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    53,106
    Likes Received:
    19,672
    Trophy Points:
    113


    LOL...the "baby" is now a "youth" ????....pretty soon you'll be calling a fetus "Granny" LOLOLOL
     
  21. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2013
    Messages:
    18,331
    Likes Received:
    6,691
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Once life become fair I will support no more abortions.
     
    FoxHastings likes this.
  22. Cougarbear

    Cougarbear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    2,422
    Likes Received:
    1,130
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Sure it does! An eagle has the right to fly without being shot. The eagle is protected by law from being shot. Same thing.
     
  23. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    42,018
    Likes Received:
    11,141
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Terminating a fetus is feticide. You can't legitimately claim a fetus is an infant.

    There are no rights specified for an embryo or fetus. Rights apply to persons.

    Your comments on the first amendment overlook that government can not establish YOUR religious ideas. If you want to write a law that limits my behavior, you have to have a justification that goes beyond your religious ideas.
     
    FoxHastings likes this.
  24. Cougarbear

    Cougarbear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    2,422
    Likes Received:
    1,130
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    That's your opinion. I know that a fetus is a person. Therefore, a fetus has rights as well. I also believe a fetus is an infant. The only difference is the location of its body. If people have to justify their murderous act to eliminate cramping their lifestyle, then there will be people to help them along.
     
    Joe knows likes this.
  25. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    42,018
    Likes Received:
    11,141
    Trophy Points:
    113
    No, none of that was opinion. What's in the constitution isn't my opinion. What's in the dictionary isn't my opinion.

    And, your claim of fetal rights is pure nonsense. A fetus can't take action against the pregnant woman.

    BTW, your characterization of women who need abortions is just plain disgusting.

    And, NO. There is NO evidence that there will be "people to help them along". You need to stick to the truth, Christian.
     
    FoxHastings likes this.

Share This Page