The Not so Subtle Moral Decay of the US Military

Discussion in 'Warfare / Military' started by Jazz, Aug 29, 2019.

  1. Jazz

    Jazz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2008
    Messages:
    6,171
    Likes Received:
    739
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    With the biggest military budget in the world, the US has failed to win a single war in the 21th century. (I'm glad for that!)

    It is obvious that the US military itself is undergoing a period of moral decay, where young men who enlisted to defend their country with honor and dignity are gradually turning into crooks.

    Enough facts can be found to illustrate this notion, as there’s no shortage of war crimes that US servicemen have committed in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria and a number of other states.

    For instance, it has recently been revealed that the chief prosecutor of the ICC from Gambia, Fatou Bensouda, stated that members of the US armed forces inflicted “torture, cruel treatment, and offenses against the dignity of persons, in Afghan territory,” acts that qualify as war crimes.

    Not a single day goes by without revelations surrounding American soldiers engaged in drunk fights, drug smuggling, human trafficking and sexual violence.


    The number of drug addicts and those contemplating suicide has been increasing steadily over the years. It’s been revealed by the commander of the US Special Operations Command, Raymond A. Thomas III during a senate hearing that special forces operatives are unable to maintain the scale and frequency of the operations they were tasked to carry out after fifteen years of constant deployments. Men become mentally exhausted and prone to suicidal thoughts.

    A recent study ordered by the Pentagon revealed that the number of sex crimes committed across the US armed forces has been going through the roof year-after-year. (women should stay out of the military fighting units!)

    Many high-profile Japanese politicians refer to the ongoing US military presence in Japan as “Okinawa’s burden” because of rape scandals involving American soldiers.

    US forces stationed in the Polish town of Powidzki have recently outraged the local community by showing complete disregard to environmental protection requirements, established for Polish national parks. The local population would go so far as to create a special Facebook group to express their outrage: Say No to Trump’s Fort in Powidzki.

    There are signs of protest and outrage in all of the 180 locations where US overseas bases are located.


    https://www.veteranstoday.com/2019/08/28/neo-the-not-so-subtle-moral-decay-of-the-us-military/
    ----
    This sure is a big problem and a stain on the USA! I feel for the boys. Fighting these endless and senseless wars destroys their best years of growth and creativity. I think it would be better to send old men out to fight. Most of the fighting is done anyway from an airplane, with drones or various vehicles. Physical prowess and agility is no longer necessary. Bespectacled, with hearing aid and false teeth armed balding and arthritic men would probably be welcomed by the so called "enemy" and given preferential treatment as a friend rather than foe.
    [​IMG]
     
    DavidMK, Eadora, HumbledPi and 5 others like this.
  2. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,627
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Nationbuilding in backward muslim society is an unwinable war for the US military

    Its the bleeding hesrt lobs who losy
     
    JET3534 and JakeStarkey like this.
  3. Texan

    Texan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2014
    Messages:
    7,686
    Likes Received:
    2,889
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    John Kerry? Is that you?
     
    Draco, Talon, Injeun and 4 others like this.
  4. HonestJoe

    HonestJoe Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2010
    Messages:
    11,578
    Likes Received:
    2,014
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It could be argued that nobody has. Conflict in the 21st Century isn’t the kind of simple war where everyone lines up, has a straight up fight and a definitive winner can be declared. It could be argued that the fundamental purpose of conflicts in Iraq and Libya succeeded in their missions of overthrowing the leaderships in those countries and that the subsequent failures of their replacements isn’t the fault of the military itself and it could also be argued that none of those conflicts had definitive victory conditions for the military forces in the first place.

    I’m not convinced. I feel the history of the US military (and military forces in general) is being viewed with rose-tinted spectacles or outright ignorance. The fact there is more evidence of inappropriate and (now) illegal behaviour in the public domain isn’t the same as there actually being more of that behaviour and could even indicate an improvement in the behaviour being formally declared as wrong and punished (at least sometimes).

    I’ve heard first-hand stories of some of the things done by allied forces during WW2 that were just as bad as anything you might hear of today but were ignored or quietly swept under the carpet at various levels and you don’t have to go much further back to find horrific behaviour in warfare tacitly ignored or even actively encouraged. People of older generations aren’t actually as different from us as we so often imagine.

    That isn’t to say that there aren’t major problems to address today and unique and changing circumstances to consider but I don’t think the negative perception of an inevitable moral decay is necessarily justified.
     
  5. Yazverg

    Yazverg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2012
    Messages:
    3,399
    Likes Received:
    217
    Trophy Points:
    63
    A group of men with arms is the most risky team possible. Especially if they don't have any clear goals and have a lot of free time. Just imagine that you got a heavy weaponry and you don't need to think of earning your living for a long period of time. Frankly speaking I don't know if my morality won't decay.

    There is only one war possible to have high standards of morality - which is active defensive war. When an enemy occupied your house, family and town you are quite likely to do nothing but train and fight until you get everything back. In all other cases it is extremely difficult. Especially nowadays. Because they often say over TV about vague principles and blatant lies but in fact the war might happen just to double some billionaire's bank accounts... Would any person feel fine dying for that? Doubt it.

    So, being a russian I wouldn't join this view of american soldiers. They are anyway better than ISIS used to. And for a much longer period of time.

    Instead I would rather point at morality in general. At the moment mankind has the resources to reach much better results in space and on earth, solving world problems with ecology, starvation, education and level of welfare. For some reason we are not at all that efficient in what we can do. And it is really not a problem of the soldiers and armies. It is up to us.
     
  6. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    7,413
    Likes Received:
    2,649
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Wars brought under fraud, like the US Global War Of Terror, are war crimes. That takes a terrible toll on morale of the troops.

    Men rightly are proud to defend their country.

    Men killing innocents have trouble with their conscience, and those trouble often lead to suicide as we see today.

    As Hartley Shawcross, a US prosecutor at Nuremberg noted, "There comes a point when a man must refuse to answer to his leader if he is also to answer to his conscience."

    We reached that point in the US years ago.
     
    Pants, HumbledPi, Jazz and 4 others like this.
  7. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,627
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Bush and later obama misused the military

    We should have invaded afghanistan and killed every taliban and foreign fighter we could find is 6 months.

    And after 6 months go home
     
    Draco, Bridget, Jarlaxle and 5 others like this.
  8. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    7,413
    Likes Received:
    2,649
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You're right that both Bush & Obama participated in the fraud and the war crimes. Yes, no doubt.

    But the rest sounds like Vietnam: "Heck, we could have won if they just kept the politicians out of it" or words to that effect. Not persuasive at all.

    The US has behaved and is behaving like so many others empires in decline throughout the history of mankind.
     
  9. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2009
    Messages:
    9,881
    Likes Received:
    2,638
    Trophy Points:
    113
    We would do well to avoid wars that aren't protecting U.S. security or interests. Trying to be a planetary police force is fraught with negative consequences. The wars we lose are other peoples' wars.
     
    Draco, Bridget, Jarlaxle and 6 others like this.
  10. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    7,413
    Likes Received:
    2,649
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Except that WE brought the wars.

    WE invaded Afghanistan. We invaded Iraq. We invaded Vietnam and 75% of Central and South America.

    I'm not proud or happy about it, but WE are the bad guys and war criminals.
     
    Jazz likes this.
  11. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2015
    Messages:
    3,054
    Likes Received:
    596
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yes, of course, and you should stop fighting those wars! America, if it wasn't the play thing of special interest groups pushing it in all the wrong directions, could really be that "shinning city on the hill". All the wealth, resources, credibility, and more, which America has squandered mostly to satisfy agendas that have nothing to do with American security interests. It will take a long time for America to untangle itself of it, and the process may at times be chaotic, but ultimately that is the only road that can not only save the rest of the world from its horrendous actions, but ultimately save America from its other self.
     
  12. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,627
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The goal in vietnam was to deny a communist takeover of the south

    And when the US military withdrew the south was free and independent

    In afghanistan the mission became transforming that place into a democracy

    Which the US military was not designed to do
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2019
  13. 61falcon

    61falcon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2018
    Messages:
    8,571
    Likes Received:
    4,292
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Our U.S.Navy has had the Fat Leonard trials going on out in San Diego which have shown the long time(back to Reagan) corruption among our high ranking naval officers.There is no branch of our military that has not been touched by some scandal.
     
  14. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    86,664
    Likes Received:
    17,627
    Trophy Points:
    113
    What are the Fat Leonard trials?
     
  15. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    7,413
    Likes Received:
    2,649
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You have the government talking points down quite well!

    Sadly, history and reality have shown those talking points to be nothing more than bullshit propaganda.
     
    JET3534, Ethereal, ronv and 1 other person like this.
  16. Margot2

    Margot2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    72,387
    Likes Received:
    13,198
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Veterans Today has nothing to do with US veterans.

    Veterans Today - Wikipedia
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veterans_Today
    Veterans Today
    is a pro-Kremlin and anti-Semitic conspiracy theory and fake news website. It describes itself as a "military veterans and foreign affairs journal", but the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) had said "the anti-Israel bent on VT can slide pretty quickly into overt anti-Semitism.". History. Veterans Today was founded in 2003 "in opposition to the invasion of Iraq."
     
  17. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    7,413
    Likes Received:
    2,649
    Trophy Points:
    113
    VT is run by veterans, both older and younger. Does that offend you Margot, or are you one of those who believes everything on Wikipedia?

    Your statement is a falsehood, a propaganda tidbit offered by those afraid of the truth.
     
    Jazz likes this.
  18. Margot2

    Margot2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    72,387
    Likes Received:
    13,198
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Veterans Today was founded in 2003 "in opposition to the invasion of Iraq." According to Politico, the site "soon began publishing wild conspiracy theories" and, according to Politico, "has consistently published articles that push the Kremlin party line".[2] It has ties with the Iranian state-backed Press TV, and has had ties with Russia's New Eastern Outlook since 2013, though according to The Daily Beast, the latter connection ended in 2018.

    The website is formally partnered with several other Russian institutions.[2][3] According to University of Washington professor Kate Starbird, Veterans Today is a fake news site actively pushing the Kremlin party line.[2]

    The New Hampshire Union Leader says that the website mixes "advice for veterans on how to find jobs and pay medical bills" with conspiracy theories and Russian propaganda.[4] Its editorial board includes a former head of Pakistan's intelligence services.[2]

    It has published false headlines such as, "Pravda: Ukraine indignant at 80% of Jews in power" and "Water Terrorism by India to Overawe Pakistan."[2] A joint article with Press TV, written by Jim Fetzer, was entitled: "Did Mossad death squads slaughter American children at Sandy Hook?"[5]

    According to Veterans Today, Israel was behind the 9/11 attacks in collaboration with the United States and Julian Assange of WikiLeaks is controlled by the Israeli government.[1]

    continued

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veterans_Today
     
    Seth Bullock, Doug1943 and PARTIZAN1 like this.
  19. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2015
    Messages:
    34,512
    Likes Received:
    10,886
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Anything that is pro Russian and / or anti Semitic needs to be neutralized so as to no longer be spewing propaganda.
     
    Dayton3 likes this.
  20. Margot2

    Margot2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    72,387
    Likes Received:
    13,198
    Trophy Points:
    113
    No I came across Veterans Today about a decade ago and quickly realized it was a fraud.
     
    Seth Bullock, Doug1943 and PARTIZAN1 like this.
  21. Margot2

    Margot2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    72,387
    Likes Received:
    13,198
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Buyer Beware: Veterans Today and its Anti-Israel Agenda ...
    https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2011/01/06/buyer-beware-veterans-today-and-its...
    Veterans Today (VT) is a website that bills itself as a "military veterans and foreign affairs journal." And, indeed, many of its contributors are military veterans or veterans' advocates from across the political spectrum. VT also offers some information about veterans' benefits (lifted from the Veterans' Administration) and links to home and ...
     
    PARTIZAN1 likes this.
  22. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    7,413
    Likes Received:
    2,649
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Which branch of the US military did you serve in Margot?
     
    Jazz likes this.
  23. Up On the Governor

    Up On the Governor Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2010
    Messages:
    4,458
    Likes Received:
    156
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Nation-building isn’t our job. There’s the first mistake.
     
    Bridget, Jazz and Mac-7 like this.
  24. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2015
    Messages:
    34,512
    Likes Received:
    10,886
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    That is because you can think for yourself.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2019
  25. Jazz

    Jazz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2008
    Messages:
    6,171
    Likes Received:
    739
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    Afghanistan had no regular army the US could fight against for any made-up reason, yet, they have stayed there the longest. I wonder why?

    Iraq was attacked 2 years after Afghanistan, also for a phony reason. After they had Saddam hanged, they still stayed and wreaked havoc in the country, but also established a fortress of an embassy for themselves complete with a military base. Gruesome atrocities were committed by the American soldiers, just like in Afghanistan:

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/us-atrocities-and-war-crimes-cover-ups-in-afghanistan/5358140

    Torture done to women by Iraqi criminals put in power by the Americans...
    https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-d...aq-horror-stories-of-female-prisoners/5313974

    American troops commit atrocities and murder...
    https://www.globalpolicy.org/invasion-and-war/atrocities-and-criminal-homicides-.html

    The Destruction of Libya, the Destabilization of a Nation. US-NATO Crimes against Humanity


    https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-d...ation-us-nato-crimes-against-humanity/5437027

    Yes, one could say the American soldiers succeeded in their mission in Iraq and Libya by killing the top leader of each country, and it is not the soldiers duty to take responsibility for whatever comes after. They only take orders. Only a "few bad apples" behave criminally!
     
    Eleuthera likes this.

Share This Page