The overflowing scourge, Isaiah 28. Poll.

This is the most stupid thread. That prophecy already came to pass.
You're trying to read end-times prophecies out of prophecies that do not have to do with it. Those who do this are ignorant about biblical history.

The "overflowing scourge" was Assyria and Babylon.

This is from the 1911 edition of the Encyclopedia Britannica:
"In 722 Samaria, the capital of Ephraim, fell to King Sargon of Assyria, which event Isaiah had also foreseen."

And it really was like an "overflowing scourge" at that time to the Israelites in the Northern Kingdom.
The Assyrians were infamously harsh. So harsh that there are numerous verses that make reference to the Assyrian cruelty without explaining it, because the writers at that time assumed anyone in the ancient world reading it would have known. (The whole story of Jonah is predicated on it, in fact)

 

Do you believe the encyclopedia? And where is there in the article written about morning, day and night, excluding evening?

It is especially funny when people are trying to find an explanation for prophecies that have not yet come true. In the reference books one can find an explanation of 2300 evenings and mornings, where this is associated with Antiochus Epiphanes, but in their interpretations there are neither 2300 evenings and mornings, nor 1150 days.
You can also find an explanation for the four beasts from Daniel's vision, but in fact this prophecy is not about ancient empires, but about religions, and the authors of the encyclopedia did not know this, because no one knew it. You can find various erroneous explanations for Daniel's prophecy about the 70 weeks, but there is not a single correct answer, because we have not yet had time to write a book about it. Etc. I do not advise you to use encyclopedias that take their information from the poisoned wells of the Christian religion.

 

It's just an expression, a Hebraism, some might call it. It's a way of saying it will be persistent and relentless, they will not have a time for relief.

 

Most all Biblical historians agree that it was about ancient empires.

That is an interesting interpretation that it might be about religions in end times.
Do you have any links to additional information about this perspective?

 

It would be even worse today. That was the 1911 edition, mind you. The most modern edition would not even include specific information about biblical prophecies, and would be more likely to include biblical history from a very critical atheist perspective.

 

There are no random words in the Bible. Each word carries a specific meaning. If the prophet mentioned morning, day and night, then this is an essential detail that can help us understand this prophecy.

For example, Jesus referred to "earthquakes, in divers places". (by the way, there are just "places" in the Greek text, without "divers" ones.) All earthquakes always happen in places. Why did Jesus add the word "in places"? It turns out that this came true last year, when a magnitude 7 earthquake struck the Aegean Sea, exactly in the middle of the straight line segment connecting the island of Patmos and Smyrna. The Church of Smyrna is an image of the church building the Third Temple in accordance with the prophecy of Ezekiel. Therefore, this earthquake carried information for us.

 

I think you may be trying to read into things too much.
That can result in distortions of thinking, and is often common in the thought processes of many conspiracy theorists.

"divers places" was an archaic way of meaning "diverse places" or "many different types of places", "several places"

 

There is a forum where you can unearth many of these little-known or unknown explanations for Bible prophecies:

Theology of the Third Temple

Questions about the Holy Scriptures

About animals in Daniel there it is quite transparent even at first glance. The first beast is Judaism, because the lion and "lifted up" (compare with Genesis 49:9 - "Judah [is] a lion’s whelp: from the prey, my son, thou art gone up...") The second beast is Islam, he ate three horns from the back of the fourth monster. The third beast is the Eastern religions: Hinduism, Buddhism, Confucianism and Shintoism. The fourth beast is the Christian religion, which lost the first 3 commandments when it obeyed Caesars, and the little horn is Caesar, or the Pope, or the president, that is, the Antichrists, who began to rule Christianity instead of Christ. The monotheism of the first three commandments was "devoured" by Islam.

There is a clue about the fourth beast in 2 Esdras. There, this beast is identified with a three-headed eagle, in which we recognize the Roman Empire, where the second Caesar, Augustus, ruled the longest. This indicates that the Christian religion is not really Christianity, but a camouflaged Roman religion. The three heads of the eagle are Catholicism, Orthodoxy and Protestantism. All of these empires have symbols of eagles. Where there is a corpse, there are eagles.

Four winds fought over the sea, that is, over the world. Here we are talking about the political component of these religions. And the combination of these four beasts is shown in the 13th chapter of Revelation. That is, in the modern world, all these religions have merged into one monster of today's civilization, striving for prosperity without God.

 

There is one word in the original, "topos". I've always found this verbal appendix strange.

You do not have all the information that came to me. It is a sequential process: asking questions of God relentlessly and then, sometimes years later, getting answers. Therefore, for me Patmos - Smyrna is very significant information. And the overwhelming scourge was also among the mysteries that I tried to understand. There is no conspiracy theory here. God is real.

 

Gods work is Gods work. And salvation doesn't come by prophecy or his work in the world. It comes by his work in ones heart, intellect and spirit or soul. Granted his servants carry out his purpose. But it is to individual conversion, to rebirth. Jesus said that man must be reborn of spirit and water to see or enter the kingdom of heaven. His counsel is to forgiveness and kindness. His heart is a Fathers heart. His blessings are peace. His voice fills our inner chambers. There is only one God with whom we may come and go as friends in all sharing. So we cast aside stubbornness, impatience, and all less than wholesome so as to visit. And in our makings or preparations, we are made miracles of his handiwork. Our God is the lowliest of servants.

 

You are just making things up. False Prophet. Zech 13:6, "And one shall say unto him (Jesus Christ), What are these wounds in thine hands? Then he (Jesus Christ) shall answer, Those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends (Judah). What are the people talking to? A ghost? A wind? No, obviously a personage with nail prints in and between his hands. To say anything else is making up one's own imagination. Zech 14:3-4, "Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. And his (Jesus Christ) feet shall STAND in that day upon the Mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the Mount of Olives shall cleave (divide or part in half) in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; half of the mountain remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south."
So, there you go. No mysticism. No wind ghosts. The people shall see the glorified body of the Savior Messiah, Jesus Christ standing in the midst of the Mount of Olives and the armies of the North shall be defeated. The "Body of Christ" concept is we can be members of the Church of Jesus Christ. But, Jesus Christ is at the head of His Church and is one of the physical members of the Godhead. Your doctrine is false.

 

Interpretation? The words are clear and don't need to be twisted and contorted by using the uninspired Apocrypha writings. What you end up with is the Nicene Creed in which most of Christianity uses with their twisted creeds as well. You end up with a God with no body, parts or passions that is so large it fills the universe yet so small it can dwell in your heart. Just a blob of wind and nothingness. Such nonsense and it makes me laugh. Your doctrine matches the doctrine of every Christian mainstream church. You only delve more deeply into the mysticism.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not a denomination of Christian churches as you denounce. Just ask them. They say the same thing you say about the true Church of Jesus Christ. You actually fit in nicely with those you condemn. Nice going. It's generally known as hypocrisy.

 

It is not about Jesus Christ, but about false prophets (see previous verse).

The Third Temple, according to the prophecy of Ezekiel, will be built 30 km south of Jerusalem. There, near the future Temple, there are already two mountains, one to the north, the second to the east. This is the "Mount of Olives". We have the power to move mountains. The "feet" of Jesus are the evangelists of the Gospel, chosen from the four winds, who will camp on these two mountains around the Third Temple.

The fact of the matter is that you will not see anything, staying within the framework of your denominational doctrine. Just like the Jews could not see the Messiah in Jesus: they were hindered by their dogmas.

 

That's your false interpretation of Ezekiel. If you actually understand the development of Israel, you would know there was a north kingdom and south kingdom of Israel. The southern portion is known as Judah and Benjamin while the northern is called Israel. So, when he says all the house of Israel companions, he's referring to the northern kingdom of the 10 tribes in which Joseph is the leader. Ephraim being one of his sons. Following the conquest of the northern kingdom by the Assyrians in 721 BC, the 10 tribes were gradually assimilated by other peoples and thus disappeared from history. Half of Benjamin were also carried away. Judah nor the other half of Benjamin. Benjamin assimilated in with Judah. Judah was attacked and carried away by the Babylonians in 586 BC. They returned as told in Ezra and Nehemiah and became the Jews. Within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, we have Patriarchs who give patriarchal blessings in which our lineage of Israel is given. Most members are of Joseph through Ephraim. But, many are of other tribes as well. But, you will find in the world that other people believe they are of one of the lost tribes of Israel (Northern Kingdom). This includes Assyrian Christians, the Afghans, the Beta Israel of Ethiopia, the American Indians and the Japanese.

 

This is exactly the denomination. I am amazed how people can believe such primitive deceptions as the Book of Mormons.

There is not a single Christian denomination in the Body of Christ, including your pseudo-church.

 

You can count the tribes of Israel as you like, but Ezekiel 37 does not detail these tribes. Jesus Christ gathers all the lost, including those lost from the tribe of Judas. And among the Jewish kingdom in the days of Jesus Christ there were representatives of other tribes, besides Judah, Levi and Benjamin. Therefore, there are also 12 tribes among them, although some are in a very small number of people.

Who belongs to which tribe now, it will become clear after the construction of the Third Temple, when Israel will occupy the territory according to the prophecy. I don't think there are any compact groups of Christians today that belong to some of the lost tribes of Israel. The issue will be decided on an individual basis. Whoever appears at the Temple on the set days will be recognized as one of the lost tribes of Israel.

 

Nice diagram. But, once again, the scripture says one individual will be parting the mount and standing answering question about the crucifixion marks. No need to get mystical about this. It doesn't say one iota about people moving mountains. Just the one personage, the Lord. You are making up the story you are preaching. It's false. Live with it.

 

Actually, in the early years of the restored Church of Jesus Christ, entire congregations of protestant churches were converted here in the Americas and in England. Today, it's become quite lucrative to run a church and of course they don't want Mormons converting their money away from them. Is this your angle too? I have no idea why you attack the Book of Mormon other than for this reason. The Book of Mormon teaches and testifies of Christ. Because of this, its evil? Your logic and reasoning escapes me. You even deny prophecy of its very existence from the Bible.

 

And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

As you please, stay with your disbelief.

 

Who cares of Ezekiel details the tribes or not. The entire OT does! You just pick out certain lines in the Bible and Apocrypha and run with it with your wild imagination. Any Jew and Christian knows that 10 tribes were carried away by the Assyrians, not 12. Who is the tribe of Judas? Judas Iscarriott? Good grief! Help me!!! Yes, we are in the middle of gathering Israel as we do when we baptize new members. That gathering is taking place. We even do so for those who have died.

 

Can't reason logically so you try to get preachy. The only unbelief are those who won't read the words as they are written. Instead, replacing them with made up stuff. It's just one man parting the mount of Olives. He is even seen by the people as one man with two hands with nail prints in them.

 

All your denominations are just a business of taking money from suckers. Look at the faces of your leaders, everything is written on them, who they really are. You are hooked on them, this is your problem. From the very beginning, I ruled out the possibility of a true denomination, because the entire Gospel talks about the judgment of believers. One is taken into the Kingdom of God, the other is left next to the corpse of the denomination. Five wise virgins and five foolish virgins. Jesus said enough to keep us from believing false religions. Therefore, I have no problem with denominations, I have always lived outside their structures.

As far as the Book of Mormon is concerned, it is an obvious lie, a cheap knock-off, and does not even need to be studied.

 

I have already said that it does not matter how many tribes of Israel are lost as owners of certain land plots. It is important that there are lost and there are survivors. Both there and there are representatives of all the tribes of Israel. Representatives of the 12 lost tribes of Israel will enter the Eastern Gate of the Temple. And they will be assimilated with the Jews in present-day Israel.

Your arbitrary manipulations with the simpletons, which you self-styled as the tribes of Israel, have no power. Because the issue will be decided in the Third Temple, built in Israel, where you will not come, because you believe in your false church.

You have a general insanity.

 

If you haven't read the Book of Mormon, how do you know it's a cheap knock-off? That's another example of poor reasoning. You obviously have a problem with denominations as you attack them viscously. Actually, the Gospel does no such thing. It talks about Christ and his atonement and how to help gather his sheep. We are to become more Christ-like with patience and love. You look down upon those who differ from your interpretations and beliefs. May God teach you patience, doctrine and understanding.

 

I'm reading the scriptures as they are written. It's you that are manipulating them into something that doesn't exist. Like 12 lost tribes. There are only 10 lost tribes. Judah and Benjamin are not lost. You are certainly lost in understanding the Bible. I'd advise you to stop reading the Apocrypha for now. It's uninspiring.