Unarmed Kid Murdered (part 9)

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by SkyStryker, Mar 25, 2012.

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  1. SkyStryker

    SkyStryker Banned

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    I'm going to lay out what happened from start to finish using all known facts. If anyone can show where it is wrong, then please do so.
     
  2. SkyStryker

    SkyStryker Banned

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    I'm going to lay out what happened from start to finish using all known facts. If anyone can show where it is wrong, then please do so.

    1. Trayvon is an route from 7-Eleven to his temporary residence.

    2. Zimmerman sees him and begins following in his suv and since he would be driving very slowly, Martin noticed this.

    3. After Martin notices he is being followed he puts on his hoodie.

    4. Zimmerman dials a non emergency number to report a suspicious person at 7:11 pm. The call lasts for about 4 minutes ending at 7:15 pm.

    5. Zimmerman notices [Trayvon] looking at him and relays this to dispatch. He then exclaims Trayvon runs away and you can hear him exit his vehicle to pursue on foot. When asked if he was following the suspect by dispatch he said yes. Dispatch advised against but Zimmerman said these "ass (holes) always get away"

    6. Dispatch requested a fixed location for Zimmerman to meet the police but Zimmerman refused and stated the police should call his cell phone when they arrive. (obviously because he was chasing Trayvon and did not know what his exact location would be.) The call with dispatch ends at 7:15.

    7. At 7:12 pm Trayvon receives a call from his girlfriend and is using an earpiece so Zimmerman does not see he is on the phone while Trayvon is looking at him. Trayvon runs away and tells his girlfriend he lost him.

    8. Suddenly Trayvon notices Zimmerman is right behind him and he asks why he is following him. Zimmerman responds by asking what he is doing there and then a physical commotion is heard and Trayvon's call is cut off at 7:16 pm. This is when Zimmerman pushed him.

    9. Trayvon pushes back and both fall in the slippery grass and end up on the ground separated. (witnessed by the 13 year old boy)

    10. Trayvon moves faster than Zimmerman and gets on him and punches him. (as witnessed by the person who saw Martin on top of Zimmerman)

    11. Zimmerman pulls out his weapon and either purposefully or accidentally shoots Trayvon in the chest, killing him.

    12. People call 911 and screaming can be heard for less than a minute followed by a gunshot (as witnessed by at least four different people)

    13. Two female witnesses looked outside right after the gunshot and saw Zimmerman standing over Martin. (as corroborated by the guy who saw Martin on top of Zimmerman)

    14. The witnesses stated Zimmerman was pacing back and forth and said he just shot someone. This proves Zimmerman was not seriously injured as he quickly sprang from the ground after he shot Martin.

    15. The police arrive at 7:17 pm.

    The phone records prove the confrontation happened BEFORE Martin's call was cut off because otherwise the police would have arrived BEFORE the shot was fired.

    I numbered these for rebuttles to avoid confusion. If you dispute this account please cite the number and the reason why.

    Even if you want to argue Martin pushed Zimmerman first, the phone call records and what the witness heard proves Zimmerman lied when he claimed he never saw Trayvon again until after Trayvon supposedly attacked him from behind.
     
  3. paco

    paco New Member

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    NINE threads now? Are you kidding me? Go home and take a nap already, troll.

    [​IMG]
     
  4. SkyStryker

    SkyStryker Banned

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    I'm not sure how that addresses any of the facts laid out. Can you show where the contents are addressed?
     
  5. JohnnyMo

    JohnnyMo Moderator Staff Member Past Donor

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    Good synopsis SS
     
  6. Trumanp

    Trumanp New Member Past Donor

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    The relevant part, and which all the usual conservatives on this forum are ignoring is that if Zimmerman had simply followed the 911 operators advice it would have turned out far different.

    Zimmerman chased Martin. How would you react to someone chasing you down for no apparent reason? If anything you could say that Martin was attempting to defend himself and was gunned down by Zimmerman.

    Even the Florida representatives who crafted the stand your ground law say that Zimmerman should be arrested, because Zimmerman chased the kid at the outset. The law was created to give the innocent person on the street who might be randomly attacked the right to defend themselves.

    I challenge any of the nut cases who are arguing that Zimmerman is innocent to consider that simple fact. Had Zimmerman simply stayed in his car and listened to the Cops, Martin wouldn't be dead today, and Zimmerman, the NRA and other law abiding gun owners wouldn't be feeling the heat over this idiots poor judgement.
     
  7. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    the bolded clearly describes trayvon
     
  8. Tipper101

    Tipper101 Well-Known Member

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    Don't really see how that's relevant. Zimmerman gave up his right to defend himself because he disobeyed orders? That's absurd.

    Every individual has the right to defend themselves. Period. If Zimmerman's intent was simply to talk to the kid, find out what he was up to, and hold him there until police could arrive, with no intent to shoot the kid, then he has just as much right to defend himself from a perceived threat as the kid does.

    Trayvon, perceiving Zimmerman as a threat, sought to defend himself, and during the physical confrontation, if what's listed in the OP is correct, then Zimmerman, getting punched with the kid on top of him, has just cause to defend himself from Trayvon's attack.

    Ultimately, both guys are defending themselves, and both guys have the right to do so. The tragic thing is the neither of them have any idea of the others intentions or reasons for being there--and are thus acting out of ignorance.



    So unless something comes out supporting the idea that Zimmerman wanted to provoke a confrontation with the full intent of killing Trayvon (highly unlikely given what we know), or that Zimmerman was not under duress at the time he shot Trayvon (heard claims that Trayvon was pleading for his life just before he was shot, so perhaps this is the case), then I don't see enough evidence for a murder charge.
     
  9. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    the bolded is known as false imprisonment, and doesnt include a self defense claim
     
  10. Tipper101

    Tipper101 Well-Known Member

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    Poor choice of words then. Try "delay". "distract". "slow down". There are plenty of other adjectives to use that don't insinuate holding the kid at gunpoint or otherwise forcibly keeping him there. Take your pick.
     
  11. BringDownMugabe

    BringDownMugabe Well-Known Member

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    Zimmerman instigated this entire thing, which eventually led to the death of young Travon Martin. This is the most open and shut case I've heard in a long time. I can't believe people are defending Zimmerman... :no:
     
  12. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    he chased him down and then asked him nicely to stay there? hard to believe
     
  13. Tipper101

    Tipper101 Well-Known Member

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    Innocence and guilt are not determined solely by asking the question "who started it?"

    As far as I can tell there are primarily two groups of people on this issue:

    1) People who think they know all the facts they need to.
    2) Those who think there is more to learn before passing judgment.


    Neither are necessarily wrong. But one is the far more prudent.

    And I like prudence.
     
  14. James Cessna

    James Cessna New Member

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    Ha-Ha!

    you are funny, Mugabe.

    Reliable sources please!

    P.S. -- This is no racism here except on the part of the people who want it to be about "racism".

    By the way, Treyvon Martin could have easily wrestled the weapon from Zimmerman, shot Zimmerman and then the discussions today would be very different.

    The "Lefties” would be telling us how justified Martin was in killing Zimmerman!

    Will the irony in this remarkable case of victimization never end!
     
  15. Tipper101

    Tipper101 Well-Known Member

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    You seem to be making either one of two points here. Maybe both.

    Either

    1) His intent was to gun him down from the outset. Hard to believe.

    or

    2) He only had the right to defend himself if he was polite to Trayvon.


    Please clarify.
     
  16. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    its neither, so your deductive reasoning might need to be reevaluated.
     
  17. Tipper101

    Tipper101 Well-Known Member

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    Then make your point please. I've already asked you to clarify it, and I hate repeating myself.
     
  18. JohnnyMo

    JohnnyMo Moderator Staff Member Past Donor

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    I'm all for letting our legal system determine Zimmerman's innocence or guilt. There is no doubt that, carrying a 9mm handgun, Zimmerman followed the teen and ultimately killed him. It's up the courts to decide Zimmerman's fate, not the SPD.
     
  19. BringDownMugabe

    BringDownMugabe Well-Known Member

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    Ha-ha! indeed James. "(*)(*)(*)(*)ing coons?" And there's no racism? Jokes on you. :no:
     
  20. James Cessna

    James Cessna New Member

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    Sanford Police Department Chief Bill Lee will be exonerated.
     
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