US/NATO rule out halt to expansion,reject Russia demands.

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by zoom_copter66, Jan 8, 2022.

  1. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    I remember it well. I watched it unfold in real time. Not to mention I grew up about an hour from the Mena AR. airport which played a significant role in events in Central America.

    None of that means actual atrocities as you described occurred (though I do not deny it was a possibility).
     
  2. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    which ones ,, the rape/torture/murder of nuns - missionaries ,, assassination of Romero - training in terror at the "School of the America's" all of which have been proven to you ad-nauseum previously .. which one are you going to deny today ..
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2022
  3. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    The first and he last. And I don't know why you think you providing a couple of links adds up to "proven to you ad-nauseum".

    Have you ever accepted links provided by me as "proof" of anything?

    It works both ways cowboy.
     
  4. Elam

    Elam Banned

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    Afghan deja vu ?!


    Families of US embassy workers in Ukraine said told to start evacuating soon

    " The US State Department has instructed the families of diplomats at the American embassy in Ukraine to begin leaving the country in the coming days amid concerns of a possible Russian attack, according to a report Saturday.

    Citing unnamed US officials, Fox News said relatives of embassy personnel were told to start evacuating as early as Monday.

    An official also said that next week the State Department was expected to urge Americans to start departing Ukraine on commercial flights “while those are still available.”

    more at link

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/famil...n-ukraine-said-told-to-start-evacuating-soon/

    .
     
  5. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If your links proved your claim .. I would have accepted .. but this is about you denying history .. you need links to prove "Iran-Contra"happened .. ? how about for Rotten Ronnies "School of the Americas" aka terrorist training centre ..

    Desperate Denial ... talking nosense about links being proof of something .. obvously some are and some not . surely you are capable of more.
     
  6. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    I've never denied that Iran/Contra happened. Nor that there was a "School of the Americas".

    I resent the hell out of you disrespecting President Ronald Reagan by calling him "Rotten Ronnie". Your hatred of him says much more about you and your ilk that it does President Ronald Reagan.

    One reason that if I hated anyone you would be on my list. That and your tendency to lie about what people have posted here.
     
  7. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Said you knew nothng of arms in to central America - Reagan Dirty deeds .. which is what Iran Contra and our Friend Oliver North was all about .. then you claim to have heard of Oli North .. knew all about it.

    So .. if you knew all about Iran Contra how come you claimed not to know anything about arms/support to central America ? .
     
  8. Bill Carson

    Bill Carson Newly Registered

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    Oliver North is probably one of the biggest DC swamp rats in history. A real POS that guy is. Ought to be buried under the jail.
     
  9. bigfella

    bigfella Well-Known Member

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    Then you need to educate yourself. Nothing of the nature or scale of the holocaust or Japan's mass murders, but it happened. The deliberate boming of civilians was described as a 'war crime' by the Allies when Japan & Germany did it. There is also the bengal famine, which wasn't deliberate, but could have been dealt with better had Britain cared to do so. There are also numerous smaller examples of thisg we would call 'atrocities' had the other side done them (A US submarine captain getting an award for machine gunning Japanese floating in the ocean after torpedoing their ship, for example).

    Again, the scale and nature of these was very different to Axis atrocities, but they happened. Similarly, the scale & nature of Serbian atrocities were different to other participants in the Yugoslav civil wars. People who claim otherwise are ill informed at best, lying at worst.
     
  10. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    Your lying is pathetic and laughable and should garner you being banned.

    I said not one word about knowing nothing about the U.S. shipping arms to central America.
     
  11. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    Prove it with a link to an unbiased source please.
     
  12. bigfella

    bigfella Well-Known Member

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    Dear me, someone is sensitive....and not well informed.

    Dudley Morton, USS Wahoo, Jan 26 1943. Ordered crew to machinegun Japanese in boats & the water. Turns out some were Indian POWs. Oops. Awarded the Navy Cross, boat awarded a Presidential citation for the whole action, including sinking the ship & killing the men in the water.

    OK, so this isn't an 'unbiased' source. It is actually biased toward Morton (you'll probably like this one).

    http://www.warfish.com/patrol3con.html

    If you want something less biased here is the account from the communists in the US Navy. It is more detailed.

    https://www.history.navy.mil/conten...ectors-corner/h-grams/h-gram-022/h-022-4.html
     
  13. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I said : " You dismiss these crimes on the basis of the fallacy - "That's an inevitable part of war" - often in defense of Rotten Ronnie - and the death squad dictators he supported and armed" .

    You said the above -- referring to shipping of arms to central america was "Alleged" - as if this is not well established history - "Never heard of Oli North - Iran Contra" .. to which your respond that you know Iran-Contra well ...

    So if you know about Iran Contra .. why were stating that what you know as face .. is "Alleged" .. pretending not to know these historical facts .. but claiming to have been a History Professor.

    Who's "Lying" .. not me .. you projecting your actions onto others - because you can't deal with the message ... one which conflicts with your perspective that killing of innocents in justified regardless of reason .. its inevitible.

    No worries about Rotten Ronnie arming, supporting and training the troops of death squad dictators in terror tactics - "our bad guys" who rape- torture - murder Nuns - mass crimes against humanity .. unspeakable acts of depravity .. such as dragging children over barbed wire - "till flesh hung from bones" in front of parents .. and other terrible atrocities revealed in the "Truth Commission"

    Disagree with this twisted false logic ..as justification for depravity.

    .
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2022
  14. Toggle Almendro

    Toggle Almendro Well-Known Member

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    The US never did that. We were always trying to destroy legitimate targets.

    I am not as familiar with the UK's bombing of Germany as I might like, but I suspect that someone who was familiar with it could make a good case that the UK as well was trying to destroy legitimate targets.


    I've never heard of us doing that. If we did so, I hope it was prosecuted.


    It is still not acceptable.


    I don't think the US or UK ever did that.
     
  15. Toggle Almendro

    Toggle Almendro Well-Known Member

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    That's why war should not be undertaken lightly.

    I'm not saying we should refuse to go to war if Russia attacks NATO.

    But it will still be a horrific undertaking.


    ---------------------------------------------------------------
    We did what we had to do to keep the Communists from taking over the world.


    ---------------------------------------------------------------
    Not at all. He is a great patriot who helped to save the world from Communism.
     
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  16. Toggle Almendro

    Toggle Almendro Well-Known Member

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    Is there any evidence of the US or UK deliberately bombing civilians?


    The submarine captain should have been prosecuted.


    The Serbs were the strongest and best organized, so their atrocities tended to be larger in scale.

    I'm not sure how the nature of the atrocities differed, beyond the issue of their scale.
     
  17. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Communism -- in Salvador -Guatemala -- do tell Ends justify the means .. cept don't think we needed to be raping, torturing and murdering US nuns - towns full of villagers -- summerly executed - on the basis of what ever communist threat you are going to laughably try and make .. training death squads in terror tactics ..

    So tell me about this big commie threat in El Salvador-Guatemala .. should be a hoot :)
     
  18. bigfella

    bigfella Well-Known Member

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    Yes. Lots. They treated it as a legitimate tactic. Arthur Harris at Bomber Command was a particular fan in Europe. Similarly, the firebombing of Japanese cities was unambigiously aimed at the destruction of civilian infrastructure. There may have been parallel aims, but that was among them.

    He was awarded the Navy Cross & his ship given a Presidential citation.

    Whatever. If you feel the need to justify, minimize or rationalize Serb atrocities that is on you. No other side in that war even came close to what they did, though they had opportunities.
     
  19. Poohbear

    Poohbear Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The Serbs did this. And America stopped them.
     
  20. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    I read the l links. The captain did not get the Navy Cross nor the submarine the presidential citation BECAUSE of the killing of the Japanese sailors.
     
  21. Ixan Joben

    Ixan Joben Banned

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    Good evening, gentlemen! I have specially registered on your forum for the fact that it is simply very difficult to perceive the nonsense that individuals carry. As a representative of the country that you are all so vehemently discussing here, bombing with nuclear bombs, discussing the consequences of this bombing, I fully doubt your adequacy. The first question I would like to ask is, please tell me, if you trace the entire history of relations between Russia and Ukraine, starting with the collapse of the Soviet Union, you will see that until 2014 we not only communicated well, we went to each other's cities to rest. As an example - Kharkiv and Belgorod. And so, the question is - what do you, dear gentlemen, care about a country whose location is unknown to most of you?And if, with the help of your specialists, there had not been a violent change of power in Kiev, you would still only know about it that it is located next to Russia.
     
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  22. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    Your reply is more or less exactly what I was expecting: You didn't read farther than the first sentence, and didn't read the links.
     
  23. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    Am I "universities"?
    We're not as bad as the Nazi's ffs, do not put words in my mouth.

    No one endorsed "woke, socialist', green and alternative movements".
    No one mentioned Maryland. No one mentioned any defund the police campaign.

    Stop molesting that strawman.
     
  24. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    I've given a link and response already, maybe you should leaf through that link?
     
  25. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    They agreed and breached.

    They did indeed engage in ethnic cleansing.
     

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