US recession fears are growing

Big surprise - the guy who managed to even bankrupt casinos is trashing the US economy.

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The Republicans had the Presidency the last time this happened. Hopefully in 2020 Democrats will get the White House and be able to sort out Trump's mess.

 

Yet another thread in which a leftist wants the US to further subsidize the Chinese military. I wonder why these leftists are so beholden to China.

 

You on the wrong thread maybe? Left your glasses somewhere? Drinking perhaps?

 

Deflection maybe comrade?

 

The American economy has become too addicted and reliant on cheap foreign imports for average consumers to be able to afford things.

It's been covering up an underlying problem.

Chronic long-term massive trade deficits are not sustainable for the economy.

Countries like China are able to manufacture their own consumer products (and China's economy boomed because of manufacturing exports).

 

Yes, very true. The more money the US gives to China, the more money the US is going to have to spend on defense.

Most people are very ignorant about this.
The US (even under Obama) spends many billions of dollars every year "countering China's military presence in the Pacific".

Saving a dollar on a five dollar item might just end up costing you an extra dollar in taxes anyway.

Not to mention all those abandoned factories and depressed economic communities in the Rust Belt region of the US.
Many of those people are moving out of that region because they can't find decent jobs.
(Though the state populations are not shrinking due to steady influx of immigration from foreign countries, taking up the practically abandoned homes others have left behind)

 

I hope not. These illegal, anti-capitalist, anti-conservative tariffs will definitely have negative consequences, but hopefully they will be contained. There could, however, be a recession in our near future. Over 1,000 economists, including 14 Nobel laureates, have tried warning us about it.

The ultimate irony here, however, are those pretending that advocating for a freer market is somehow "leftist" while Trump relied solely on left-wing economic sources to defend his protectionist position on the campaign trail. Hilarious.

 

We manufacture more goods now than we have in quite some time, getting close to matching our highest levels on record. And Hong Kong got filthy rich running on a trade deficit. Trade deficits are not actual monetary losses.

 

The ultimate irony is that so many on the Left are now coming out in favor of economically liberalized free trade policies, just to be able to have any ammunition against Trump.

For a long time the Left considered those policies to be radical Conservative. Remember the 1999 Seattle Anti WTO protests.
Violent riots coming from the Socialist crowd against free trade agreements in general.

 

I'd heard before the 2016 election that elected Trump that if elected, he would trash the US economy. So far, not seeing it. Hopefully, same people are warning of economic damage to the US to come.

 

So far he hasn't managed to ruin any of the positive economic trends he has inherited. The best we can hope for is that he doesn't trash anything with his ignorance.

 

Yes, it is ironic that the sides have switched: the Left advocating for freer markets and the "right" railing against it in favor capitalism's oldest enemy, mercantilism. The right used have at least a couple of things going for it. Shame to see that go.

 

But less goods per capita than we used to.

 

Most standard economic textbooks these days unfairly disparage the concept of mercantilism (or nationalism).

It in large part has to do with the influence of the Chicago school, which took a grip on the academic field of economics.

The Chicago school itself was a counter reaction to increasing regulations and socialistic tendencies that were becoming evident in the academic study of economics at that time.

 

A far cry from the predictions: https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/01/...pens-to-the-markets-if-donald-trump-wins.html

 

Mercantilism deserves its disparagement and has done so for the past couple of centuries (plus) or so. It offers nothing in the way of theory or evidence, only a babyfied zero-sum "theory" of economics that crumbles over the slightest whiff of honest consideration.

Again, you are defending the oldest enemy that capitalism has. Anyone who does so has fewer market credentials than even the Marxists, which is an incredible feat.

 

Take it up with the NYT.

 

To some extent there is a zero sum component in economics.

Trade isn't always a net overall positive for both countries, that's due to the fallacy of composition.

If that wasn't true, why do you think China tries so hard to encourage exports and discourage imports? You don't think their economic policymakers are stupid, do you?

 

GDP per capita continues to grow. Try again.

 

Unless you ask an economist or study economics or spend more than an hour or so considering basic economics.

 

You are badly, badly misrepresenting the fallacy of composition. Of course trade is a net positive for both sides. That's why they voluntarily trade. They wouldn't otherwise.

 

Dang you folks are persistent. Liberals have been yammering for several years now that the economy is going to tank, because you can't stand that y'all lost an election. So, you'll collectively all work to tank the world to get your political way. That's the road you folks are willing to set the nation on, and y'all can't for the life or yourselves understand why the nation doesn't support you and your party.

When you folks are actually willing to attack the nation's economy, you're moral bankruptcy is entirely visible for all to see.

Business has been anticipating a "business cycle" because with every expansion, a small temporary adjustment also usually has to come with it. Why? Because it makes sense to have to take some time for the production cycle to level to less robust demands. That's a far cry different from folks on the left who feel it necessary to destroy the business cycle and replace it with recessions or depressions like what y'all did in 2k7. Folks didn't forget what you did. Cheering for it to happen again doesn't seem very neighborly.

 

If that's true, why can't we handle some reduction in international trade?

You're saying GDP has continued to grow even as Trump has been putting up tariffs?
Good to know.

 

Countries don't trade, individuals do.

Is it better to hire someone else to mow your yard for $5, but then you have to pay your son a separate allowance? Wouldn't it just make more sense if you had to pay your own son $6 to do it?

 

Yes. Which is part of why it is ignorant to look at nation-wide trade deficits as if were something economically meaningful.

But you badly, badly dodged the statement you quoted. Let's try again: You are badly, badly misrepresenting the fallacy of composition. Of course trade is a net positive for both sides. That's why they voluntarily trade. They wouldn't otherwise.

This is not an intellectually honest or accurate comparison. Please read up on the make or buy decision. Some times, most of the time actually, it makes more economic sense to buy a good or service than to make it yourself. You tacitly admit this fact every day.