What are your thoughts on Guadalupe, Lourdes, Fatima and Akita

Each event could be a discussion in and of itself. Maybe for another time but the message rang out clearly in each event.

Guadalupe, Mexico 1531
Lourdes, France 1858
Fatima, Portugal 1917
Akita, Japan 1973

At each event supernatural events occurred.....

 

Wow....24 hours and 22 looks. No discussion....is that because of ignorance or is it simply due to no interest?

 

Such Visions are like the one Paul had - and he likens the appearances of Jesus after death to these visions .. Jesus appearing in the sky to 500 for example.

 

Not really sure what is to be discussed.

What makes you assert that there were supernatural events occurring?

 

Everything has to be judged by its fruits.

Guadalupe was very beneficial. because millions in Central and S. America gave up their pagan practices and became Christians because of it.

Lourdes was beneficial in that it retained the high esteem of Saint Mary at a time when the Cardinals were leaning towards Protestantism. The concept of the Immaculate Conception though is not accepted by the Orthodox Church since the Pope declared himself infallible in matters of the Church to make it dogma, something that can only be done by an Ecumenical Council.

Yet the dogma of the Immaculate Conception hasn't been fully defined, so it leaves it open to further theological discussion.

Fatima did occur and at a time when the Catholic Church was undergoing problems in Portugal, so it was also beneficial.

Akita, I don't know that much about it and what was going on in Japan, but I'm sure it was also beneficial and needed at the time.

 

For Guadalupe....Evidence..... and it can be found in the Cathedral in Mexico City. At the time of the event there was a lot of strife, human sacrifices and discontent in the land known as Mexico. This short clip provides background information and information as it pertains to the garment worn by Juan Diego. The garment that the miracle took place in is made out of cactus. Normally it has a life of less than 20 years but as you can see its in the Basilica for all to see. It is 500 years old AND a picture of Our Lady of Guadalupe is on it.

Another thing....flowers blooming in the 2nd week of December....???????

 

So what do you make of this event?
It either happened or did not happen.....what side of the fence are you on? Explain if you will......

 

It did happen - Alien visitation.

 

Ok....lets go with your theory. Explain away the tunic of the farmer and where its at now? Explain the picture on the tunic... The sudden conversion of the country to Catholicism. The Cathedral being build...the list goes on and on. Do you honestly have faith in your reply?

 

If Aliens can build Pyramids - surely they make pictures on clothing. People often build Cathedrals - in honor of the Gods in which they believe - mistaking alien visitation - and powers - for that of a God.

I don't have faith in much - but what I do have faith in - is that "Aliens" is one possibility.

If "Our Lady" really wanted to help - she should have appeared prior to the Spanish setting sail for the new world - telling them not to go - spreading disease and pestilence.

 

Lets be clear....this event was created and directed by the Almighty God. According to Giftedone.... The Blessed Virgin Mary should have done something other than what God prescribed. Really? How far is a mortal going to get when dictating to God what he should of done.

In looking at all the apparitions of the Blessed Virgin Mary you will find that God thru Jesus' Mother is telling mankind something. The message is loud and clear for those who chose to listen. This is extremely evident in other apparitions with the Blessed Virgin Mary.

Just hoping that people can look at these with an open mind and understand the message that is being given.

 

And what do you perceive as the message?

 

See Mathew 21:21.

 

Never said or implied that .. go back and re-read post. Nor did I suggest that the virgin mary did it.

so we have two made up fantasies about my position - that do not exist, cept in your mind of course .. go back and re-read.

 

Insofar as Guadalupe is concerned the message was of hope and comfort as promised by God's compassion. Our Lady of Guadalupe continues to inspire new generations of faithful believers in their daily routines and struggles. Lets remember the environment at this time back then. The Aztecs were pagans....thousands of human sacrifices. War....what this event did was transpose the entire nation to become Catholic. Now we see the remnants of that action 500 years later.

The other Marian Apparitions have clear messages and it pertains to ALL mankind.

 

I saw Matthew 21:21
thank you....

 

Right there....you said if Our Lady really wanted to help.....your inference is that she SHOULD have done something other than what she did.

Please take the time and comprehend what you write....

 

I told you that "Our Lady" was an Alien off the get go -- and use quotes when using the term "Our Lady"

That you can't figure out that I did not say that "Our Lady" was the virgin mary from that .. I can help you no further other than to suggest reading comprehension classes.

 

Of course it happened, and it's how pagans were converted. From what I read the American natives hated the Spanish for the way they were being treated that there was no way they would have given up their deities and the cruelties they committed to appease them.

It was Saint Juan Diego, and the love emanating from his heart to save his people, that aroused God's mercy - thus the miracle of the tilma and roses, and the thousands of cures that occurred afterwards. Had it not been so, there would have been no way the natives could have converted - and in such a short time.

 

And aliens are going to help the natives give up their human sacrifices and tortures and become Christian? Hmmm, wouldn't that mean the aliens are Christians.

And they would have just continued their human sacrifices, etc., etc.

 

That was a nasty way to appease the Gods - but - the death toll from the Pox - was quite high .. biological warfare.

 

The message is Christianity, and it's given to individuals in a way that they can understand and within their own cultural context.

 

Smallpox was quite rampant in the world, my grandfather had gotten a very virulent form in India and he survived. If the Indians got it, it would have spread rapidly since they had no immunity. Most probably died from the measles. The American colonists noticed that the native children died but not the half breeds.

The bad thing with small pox was the disfiguration. I saw a woman once who had smallpox and her face looked like a sponge. The Macedonians gave one another a small dose so as to establish immunity, something they probabl picked up with Alexander's sojourn in India.

Talking about biological warfare, well invaders usually catapulted dead bodies into fortresses. The Mongolians catapulted their dead from the plague into the Genovese camp in Crimea, and their ships carried it into Europe and killed off 1/3 of the population. Does this mean the Genovese wanted to kill off the Europeans?

 

Interesting stuff - but - how about those miracles what say you .. Visions - Aliens - what manner of forces are at work?

are these a break in the space time continuum - dark energy - these outliers happen - particles sometimes go beyond the probability barrier - but it happens - due to these little tunnels - warps in the fabric - like a black hole but of a different form - via say dark energy instead of gravity..

Perhaps from time to time - the Creator stops by and looks in on his little experiment - tinkers .. or perhaps one of the others - is at work - those pesky other Son's of God - .. having some fun .

 

I'm a Christian so I define everything within Christian beliefs. I know that God's angels can enter our own dimension freely and can influence us - and that includes the fallen ones as well. From what I read and from my own experiences, a guardian angel will appear at a time when they're needed but not as an angel. If they appear as an angel, then I'd beware because the angel of darkness can appear as an angel of light.

When Mohamed told his wife about the angel that appeared to him and gave him the Quran, she asked him: "Are you sure that it's an angel of light and not of darkness?"

Saints are people that have become purified through their prayers and fasting so that they're spiritualized while still alive. God gives them certain gifts, but since they're misunderstood and sometimes slandered by others, their sanctity is not recognized until later in life.

There are also fakers who pretend to be saintly and are not, as well as witches and warlocks who can cure through magic, so the Church is very careful before they canonize/glorify someone. God will usually give signs and miracles after a person dies for them to be declared a Saint.