When will man be able to survive, long term? AFFORDABLE?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Guyzilla, Apr 19, 2018.

  1. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    This is nothing more than bellyaching from liberal progressives. Whining about capitalism and the next thing you know we have the gulag.....

    How about proposing a better way instead of complaining, mmmmkay?
     
  2. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    Got a better solution? You lefties should find an island somewhere to build your utopia. Then get back to us when it works. Otherwise preaching to folks is silly.
     
  3. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    Reality is where we are. I do not know where you are.
     
  4. Belch

    Belch Well-Known Member

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    Control yourself, and I'll do the same.

    or maybe I won't. Anyway, it isn't something I'll allow you to decide. You decide for yourself how to control yourself.

    Be a man and take control of yourself, while realizing that you are dealing with other men, and we don't particularly care what you think.
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2018
  5. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not true.

    Their creation of Romanization allowed them to maintain control while allowing the conquered to operate mostly independently.

    As I said, economically it was brilliant, they just couldn't defend all that territory with any efficiency which was one of the many reasons why it fell, hardly the biggest one. Their biggest problems occurred in Rome itself, from within.

    So my original point is correct.

    From an economic perspective, expansionism can eliminate the problem described in the OP, we don't need to change from capitalism to do that.

    Just create more of it.

    Don't want a trade war with China because it hurts our economy then eliminate them or take them over, BOOM, no more trade war.
     
  6. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    Your thinking is exactly the same as that of 100s of millions who believe that their current way of life will extend ad infinitum. In psychology, this is is called recency bias.

    The physical fact is that infinite exponential growth (i.e. economic growth) in a finite system is impossible. So, the opening poster is quite correct in pointing this out, and that it will most likely be the exhaustion of physical resources and/or pollution that will cause downfall of our civilization, just as it has done for previous documented cases.
     
  7. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    Your first error is assuming you were living off the grid, when you were still using fuel and ammo. Those will be the first things gone when the shi% hits the fan.
     
  8. jmblt2000

    jmblt2000 Well-Known Member

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    You're assuming that I bought the ammo instead of reloading. I currently have enough powder and supplies to provide for a small army. The second is that I have 2 hunting airguns that only require a pump, instead of CO2 cartridges...And I'm very proficient with other weapons and how to make them.
     
  9. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    You are correct. This is why capitalism is winning. There are people who dedicate 80 hours a week to innovating and producing products that others buy. Meanwhile the leftists are complaining and riding the pine instead of getting in the game.

    If the rich elitist leftists really believed this crap they would give up their private jets and armed security and dedicate their lives and resources to "saving the planet."
    Instead they expect the average person to give up any comfort and make a sacrifice.....sad.
     
  10. Thought Criminal

    Thought Criminal Well-Known Member Donor

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    "Tell me how we don't go boom, those on the right. Tell me how a rightward tilt, will make things better, long term. Instead of ruining things faster.

    YOU CANNOT."


    Why ask for answers, then say you won't listen to them?
     
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  11. GoogleMurrayBookchin

    GoogleMurrayBookchin Banned

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    If you don't like my solution, come up with one that isn't so stupid it's literally going to kill billions of people just through collective laziness.

    Most of the area surrounding the equator is going to become unsuitable for civilization. Some regions will carry an extreme risk of death by overheating. There will be mass emigration from equatorial areas and neonazis will have a field day tormenting people fleeing civilizations that are being consumed by spreading deserts. New frontiers will open up in the extreme north and require a massive rebuilding of infrastructure. A shitton of people will die in resource wars and just because of the disastrous effects on the climate causing disasters.

    It'll be to global civilization as the black plague was to Europe. Maybe worse.
     
  12. Guyzilla

    Guyzilla Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    THE FED is not following my advice. We need to create not only money, but the interest also, so that economic expansion is not life or death. This is a crucial aspect to sustainability.
     
  13. Guyzilla

    Guyzilla Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Sure, this is still a pristine planet. Not a footstep or municipal dump.
     
  14. Guyzilla

    Guyzilla Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Brilliant for ROMAN CITIZENS. You are forgetting game theory. Game theory is why we don't still Rome to kick around.

    Those NOT on top, will maneuver to dethrone you. BY HOOK OR BY CROOK.
     
  15. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think that your keyboard kinda runneth over here.

    There are two choices.
    One-
    Allow people to make their own choices and live with the consequences, which will either eliminate the foolish or enlighten them- and so long as they don't interfere with others to do the same, leave it alone. This is called freedom, in it's purest form. We live in an abridged form of that, which dilutes the success in order to save those who won't save themselves.

    Two-
    Impose rules on everybody for their "own good", (which really satisfies only the person making the rules) so that all can live in some kind of dependent mediocrity, without the power of human spirit that makes life worthwhile.

    We have the ability. We have the intelligence and knowledge, and all the natural gifts we need to be successful people. Many lack the courage to do that, and others lack the courage to allow others to do that. The enemy is- US.
     
  16. Guyzilla

    Guyzilla Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Sounds nice, we ALL will live with the consequences, and YOU, are deciding for your children, and your childrens children.

    And yes, we, as a species, are STUPID, and only see our own comfort.
     
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  17. Pycckia

    Pycckia Well-Known Member

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    The one thing I can guarantee you is that a shitton of people are going to die one way or another. The only question is how quickly and what the total number is at any given time.

    The black plague in Europe saw many people dying, but it didn't wipe out civilization there. In fact, once it was over, Europe did rather well for itself.

    You are quite correct that capitalism cannot be sustained indefinitely. It is an excellent system for growing economies but growth cannot be sustained indefinitely. Capitalism cannot survive without economic growth. Money lent must be returned with interest and to create that interest the economy must grow.

    The immigration crisis in advanced economies is caused in large part by the requirement of capitalism for population growth, especially during times of low productivity growth. Conservatives who argue for both free markets and immigration restriction are arguing incompatible policies. Similarly, liberals who espouse socialism and open borders are at cross purposes with themselves as socialism cannot produce prosperity for an increasing population. That is the tragedy of Sweden whose successful socialism is buckling under the strain of recent immigrants (in addition to the other social dysfuntions caused by culture clash.)
     
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  18. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    Still doesn't matter. Do you know how fast game would be wiped out if everyone was forced to survive by hunting? Our population by far exceeds the carrying capacity of the land, if you take mechanized agriculture (i.e. indirectly eating oil) out of the equation.
     
  19. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    So what? If you are so concerned then devote 80 hours a week to solutions instead of complaining.
     
  20. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    I have yet to see your solution unless it is bellyaching....
     
  21. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    Let's look at the Rapanui civilization from the Easter Islands, which was wiped out. They had freedom to cut down as many trees as they liked. Would they have been better off curtailing that freedom and instate a quota per person? They probably would still be here, had they done that.

    That's the problem with exponential growth: It is hard to see when the limit is reached, and the limit may come very quickly. But freedom.....
     
  22. Crownline

    Crownline Banned at Members Request

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    You could do really well if someone else payed for the fuel and ammo, did the hunting, fishing, catching, chopped the wood...etc.
     
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  23. Pycckia

    Pycckia Well-Known Member

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    What else is there?
     
  24. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    He is not a native english speaker.
     
  25. MolonLabe2009

    MolonLabe2009 Banned

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    If you don't like capitalism, then move to Venezuela or Cuba.

    No one is stopping you.
     
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