World leaders congratulate Joe Biden on his victory

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by Space_Time, Nov 7, 2020.

  1. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

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    You are right about Turkey, but Turkey wasn't that way when it entered NATO. Turkey became the aggressive entity it is now only recently, under its current leader. Many other NATO members are seriously concerned about Turkey. Trump admires authoritative leaders, so he's been sittling between supportive silent to actually encouraging toward President Erdogan. I expect our new President Biden to be substantially less supportive of Erdogan. We'll see. But that doesn't negate the value of NATO or of being a member of that organization.
     
  2. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

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    I disagree. History stands as a strong reminder that the U.S. has fought two World Wars in Europe. The U.S. has also had separate wars with Spain & England on different occasions. Europe is definitely a significant part of our sphere of influence. We are also strongly influenced by Europe in many ways in our daily lives. We have always been connected to Europe. We always will be. Your post reflects an old American theme. It's called isolationism. It has never worked. It never will. It is dangerous to those who practice it. Check the histories of China & Japan during the 19th century, for examples supporting my statement.
     
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  3. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Actually it worked just fine for us. Besides, allowing others to defend themselves instead of relying on us isn't isolationism. I for one would like to scale down our military but we can't because we are expected to defend 3/4 of the world. That is our money, not theirs, that we could be building better schools or roads with and not defending against some threat that will never happen.
     
  4. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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    Like Afghanistan, still ongoing? Oh, wait ... that was a Republican. How about Iraq, and their non-existent WMDs? Oh, wait ... that was the same Republican, wasn't it?

    At least when Democrats spread troops around, like Clinton in Europe after Yugoslavia broke up and started killing each other, or like in Somalia when warlords were hoarding donated food during a severe famine, he raised a couple of taxes on some people in order to pay for it. GW Bush just grew the deficit that had been a surplus when he took office. And who created that budget surplus, the only one we've had in many decades? A Democrat.
     
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  5. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

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    Weird. . .I'm actually agreeing with you on something. :) I too, would like to scale down military spending, & our habit of being the policemen of the world. No nation, no matter how wealthy, can sustain such activities forever. Plus, the world is a complex place. It's not always easy to determine which side we should come down on in these tribal conflicts scattered around the globe.

    I also agree, those monies used for policing should be reallocated toward building better schools, supporting them, better highways, bridges, rails, etc. Unfortunately, politicians don't always do what they promise. Oftentimes funding taken from one project, that everyone says should go to a specific other, gets sucked into a black hole somewhere, & never gets reassigned to that "other" project as intended. I've watched that happen repeatedly. I mention it just to get it on our radar. I very strongly support funding new infrastructure. That shouldn't be a partisan issue.
     
  6. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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    You most certainly can, if you've studied the history of those conflict and put them in context. Or lived through it, but you'd have to be old like me for that.

    And don't forget, the ideologies of both major parties have changed quite a lot from what they were even two decades ago.
     
  7. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Do you know how many conflicts we have bee in and you single out two to try and prove wrong? What I said is a historical fact and it's right there where you can add them up. Straight up simple math.
     
  8. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The ideologies have essentially remained the same. There is not a major difference between Jefferson and Obama..
     
  9. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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    They had fireworks in Paris over our election results. There were parties all over the globe. A lot of hooch got consumed Saturday and Sunday.
     
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  10. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well we can't do it if we also have to fund relics like NATO.
     
  11. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think the general feeling is that Biden will 'Make America Normal Again' (I stole that line from a political video!)
     
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  12. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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    This wasn't just world leaders.

    I liked the tweet from the Mayor of Paris, who simply said "Welcome back, America."
     
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  13. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    How in the world was Paris affected by Trump?

    It wasn't they are just drunks over there and drink for any reason. They would have been drinking if Trump won.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2020
  14. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

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    Gee, I open up a door for us to agree on something, & you just find something else you can disagree with me on. How does that help? :( Is being negative & disagreeable just a habit, or do you really think it's endearing?
     
  15. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If we agree on something there is no point in discussing it.
     
  16. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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    Our jobs were already shipped to China. That happened decades ago for the most part. To China, India, Bangladesh, Taiwan .... etc etc. And after NAFTA was passed, add Mexico, bigly. Any place where corporate America could benefit from cheap, unregulated, union-free labor. My big bad Lincoln was built in Mexico. The twist on that is my last car, a BMW, was built in South Carolina. Go figure.

    What we need in order to re-establish a strong manufacturing base are new technologies. We need to be the world leaders in designing and manufacturing solar cell arrays and windmills. We need to build more electric vehicles. And we most certainly need to make our own medical supplies like masks, gloves, gowns, scrubs, various types of life-saving gadgets, lab equipment, and so forth. That's a boatload of jobs right there.
     
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  17. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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    "Oh, woe is me!"

    Right. You're the downtrodden martyrs who are just trying to save us all from the big bad liberals, who've done none of the ridiculous things you all have accused them of in the many other years over the last five or six decades when the Dems held the House, Senate, and Oval office.
     
  18. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well what's coming is what you asked for so you will find no sympathy here.
     
  19. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

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    Well now, that's a new one for me. What if every Congressperson had that attitude? What would ever get accomplished? Discussing only those things we disagree on gets boring & exhausting. It's a senseless act, for nothing ever results. If your attitude reflects the dominant Republican one, I can certainly see why our country is in trouble. That's really sad. :(
     
  20. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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    Provide a link to prove your claim, please. I'm only going as far back as WWII.

    And as I already said, the ideologies of both main parties have changed significantly. Instead of saying that everything is the fault of Democrats, why don't you look at it in terms of conservatives vs liberals?

    And I did mention two conflicts on Clinton's tab, so claiming I only singled out two is bogus.
     
  21. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Go read a history book but I am not listing every war we have been in for you. If you don't want to believe than fine but pretty much everyone here knows it's true because we have discussed it before.

    But by all means, pretend it's not true while everyone snickers at you.
     
  22. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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  23. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  24. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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    Kind of like MANA from heaven. I feel like I've been wearing very unconfortable toe-pinching high heels, but now I get to kick them off and put on the comfy old slippers. The ones with memory foam.

    Normal, and predictable. Unpredictability is only a good thing during contests.
     
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  25. Sleep Monster

    Sleep Monster Well-Known Member

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    Trump kow-towed to Kim Jong Un and stopped our military from holding its annual joint training that we've done with SK's military since the Korean conflict. He was signaling that if pressed, we would back off shout NK decide to misbehave. That's one of the reason I read and heard about from long time diplomats.

    We also abandoned our allies in Syria, the Kurds, to be butchered by Erdogan, after they had fought for years by our side in Iraq against ISIS. That was shameful, and lost Trump most of the support he had enjoyed within our military up till then. Don't take my word for it, ask a soldier or two, or visit the Stars and Stripes website. Or the Military Times.

    Worst president ever on foreign policy. The only good he did was to get certain NATO members to pay past dues and spend more on their own defense, plus cut off foreign aid to Pakistan ... those folks are not our friends,
     
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