You claim that God does not exist.

Because your professor of literature, critical thinking, or philosophy at the local junior college asked your class today, "If God could do anything could He make a rock so heavy He couldn't lift it?" This was probably a follow up of the geat expenditure of tax dollars yesterday when he asked if while turning a door knob if the knob was actually turning or if it remained still while the rest of the universe turned.

In all seriousness, to answer your question, the claim is made due to many references to the effect of Father, His, and He referring to God.

 

God in my opinion is a noun we created for something we don't understand and hence need something to credit that what we don't understand to. For some reason it's not ok to say "I don't know", "we don't know", or "we don't understand". For every bit we don't understand or don't know, we need an answer instantly. And creating a character who knows, but doesn't want you to know is a good a solution as any. I personally don't understand why admitting to not knowing or not understanding is so bad.

 

That can only be done if you pick some discipline within which proofs exist.

No one can "prove" you wrong to you.
You are the one and only juror who can say it has been proven to you, but, likewise, you always deny that is has be proven to you.

But, for example, if you accept Euclid Geometry, things can be proven to you within that discipline.
If you submit to Mathematics, 2+2 is four in Arithmetic.
If you pick Sociology, books fill of statistical Facts can prove that America is Coming Apart, culturally.

It is an exercise in both futility and stupidity to try and prove things to a hard head if he won't accept any discipline by which to make sense to him.

 

But I have accepted a discipline. It is the discipline offered through the Mind of Christ. I firmly believe that discipline.

 

And in that discipline is there any method for me to prove or disprove anything to you?

Psst, still waiting for a response to this: "Would my hypothetical belief about a unicorn existing be evidence that the unicorn itself, and not the belief about the unicorn, objectively exists in a material sense outside of my mind. "

 

Sure there is... but you have to be very well trained in that discipline in order to have such an effect on another person. Research the term 'admonish' in the Bible. Find out what procedures are involved in the proving of something alleged to be wrong and the admonishment that can be rendered and by whom the admonishment can be rendered.

Already gave you an answer... redundancy seems to abound in your requests for answers that have already been provided.

 

Care to specify which verse or even what book you're referring to? I'm not going to go read through the entire Bible to try to find a vague reference to how to prove something wrong.

No, you gave a tautology. You answered that a belief was evidence that the idea existed in the mind. That isn't what I am asking here.

 

Yes! I do care. I am not going to provide you with what took me years of study and experimenting to find out. If you want to know,,, jump through the hoops of studying the word of God as opposed to simply attempting to deny what you now obviously have no knowledge about. Per your admission of laziness above... "I'm not going to go read through the entire Bible to try to find a vague reference to how to prove something wrong."

No! That is your interpretation of what I said. No where in my text did I say "a belief was evidence that the idea existed in the mind." That is your contorted view of what was stated.

 

Then why should I believe you?

And what exactly do I "obviously have no knowledge about"? Can you irrefutably prove that claim to me?

I'm not sure how that is an admission of laziness. If I told you that the secret of life was found in the Bhagavad Gita, and you refused to read through it, is that laziness?

First off, you never responded to the question I just now posed to you. You responded to this question: "IF I believe a unicorn exists. Do you think that is evidence that the unicorn exists objectively or subjectively?"

You responded with: "The answer would be "both"... objectively (being in your mind and your mind being in this objective world) and subjectively because it exists in your mind."

The bolded portion of your answer, correct me if I am wrong, is saying that a belief that unicorns exist is evidence that the the unicorn exists objectively because it is in my mind and my mind is part of the objective world.

 

I care less whether or not you believe me.

"Care to specify which verse or even what book you're referring to? I'm not going to go read through the entire Bible to try to find a vague reference to how to prove something wrong."
Those items quoted immediately above. If you knew the answers then you would not have asked the questions. If you knew the answers and want to say that you were just testing me, then you would be intellectually dishonest. Take your pick. Irrefutable proof? Not hardly,,, but it is my rationale and my belief.

You would be too late. I have already read the Bhagavad Gita.

The answer to the question you "just now posed to" me is located immediately above.

Yes I know.. it was either the last post of mine or the one prior to that.

Yeppir that is what I wrote.

Bravo... you finally got it right. Now are you going to suggest that your mind is not a part of the objective world?

 

Where does one find this offer of christ's mind? Who is this christ?
How does one know it is christ's mind that is offered?
What is the discipline?

 

So there is no verse or book on how to prove something wrong, it only exists in your mind. But you did claim it was in the bible, correct?

 

1: http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Bible-Verses-About-The-Mind-of-Christ/

2: Christ is the Son of God. Jesus was the son of man.

3: Trust, faith, confidence, belief... wow look at all those words that mean almost the same thing.

4: A question that is best answered by saying: years of study, years of prayer (in some cases just one prayer), doing as instructed by the Holy Spirit and loving every minute of it, following in the footsteps of Jesus (metaphorically speaking). WWJD living that question throughout each and every day.

- - - Updated - - -

That is not what I said. You are misrepresenting the very clear and explicit language that was posted. A disingenuous approach to be seeking truthful answers.

 

Matthew 10:20 - For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

I will only use 1 from your list. From the posting I see from you on this forum, I have a hard time believing the "sprit of your father speaketh in you."
It is not how I would want to treat other human beings. And if you speaketh from the spirit of your father, you father isn't helping bring humans to his side.(for lack of a better word)

2

A claim that can't be proven. Just believed. You have to admit that.

Again, nothing concrete. Islam is just as trusting, faithful, confident, and believable as yours.

I know people who claim to have the holy spirit. Your posting style is not even close to showing that.

Not what you said. But the fact you can't/won't provide a (holy spirit type experience) shows you are incapable of showing what you know. Would not the holy spirit share his message?
And you have made if very clear, what you believe is for you and you alone. You don't care what others believe or what they think you believe. So if you have no evidence to back up the claim that the bible can prove something wrong, well then we'll just have believe it is in your mind alone and leave it at that.

 

From your perspective, and I am not concerned with your perspective... I have only to serve my Lord and King. Matters not what you think. Based on what you have stated on this forum, I find it easy to believe that you find it hard to believe... hard for you to believe anything about Christ or the Christian way of life.

A claim that you cannot disprove... you have to admit that. Even as an unbeliever.

OK... another perspective... Are you Islamic?

How would you know that. Are you filled with the Holy Spirit? Be honest now.

Then you admit that you were making a misrepresentation of what I previously stated.

Nope.. It means that I am adhering to scripture and "not casting pearls before the swine.."

Surely the Holy Spirit does share his message.... At the time, place, and to whom he chooses to share it with.

Obviously not, when not too long ago, you posted an admission showing where you agreed with me pertaining to belief and perspective.

That is very true... why... my cares are not of this world, and when people show by example that they are more interested in this world than they are in the Lord, then there is no need for me to care. I am not the one who will be sitting on that judgment seat.... and subsequently,,, I have my own valley to traverse...

Your assumption is wrong about the evidence. I have it, but I am not obligated to share it with you. You have already determined (like I have) that you will believe whatever it is that you want to believe. So why should I even waste my time?

 

::sigh:: at the atheists out there, DO NOT BE LEAD ON MY THE DARKNESS for I have seen the evils that lie in the spiritual realm and in spiritual darkness. I have dispelled the meth of Atheists before. Atheism does not exist for Atheist believe in DEATH, you believe that after this flesh life you die among things, you always believe what you see with your two eyes, you have faith on many a things.....the most important being that you believe in death.. you freely choose to believe in the darkness so that will be your spirits final result for you have denied the eternal kingdom of god... I explained this in my youtube video..http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6nzZmdWyYw in my first episode because it is one of Satan's greatest tricks to make you believe in spiritual death.

 

IF there is a Father of lies and Great Deceiver, I will say this, we see who is the spirit speaking thro' the fundy / creo.

A little bit of evidence to toss in: no application of fact or reason will sway them, they will never ever under any circumstances admit they got anything wrong.

 

They are under the duress of their creed. In traditional Christian doctrine, the penalty for apostasy is eternal torture.

 

"But I have accepted a discipline. It is the discipline offered through the Mind of Christ. I firmly believe that discipline" You made this claim and one of the proofs of your claim was Matthew 10:20 - For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.
If no one listens to how you speak or type in this case, that is not serving the Lord in a positive way.

Nor would I try.
Where did you make that ASSumption off of? Cuz I don't believe the same as you?

Does it matter, whatever I believe is just as valid as yours.

How would I know, is there a sign that says so?
I stated I know people who claim to have the holy spirit in them and they are helpful and sharing and want others to share the holy spirit. Not turn them away.

.
Nope

I have no intention of diminishing anything you offer. Only understand how one reaches an opinion to further my enlightenment.

sure

I agree, if I remember correctly, that you are entitled to your own belief and perspective, but I may not agree with what you believe.

Then why do you share your thoughts if you have no intention to care for any who don't believe like you.
What is '"that seat of judgment"?

It is not an assumption, it is known based on the facts presented before me. Now that could change if the facts change, but it seems they will not.
I will believe what is deemed worthy, yes by me, but my beliefs are subject to change as new information is seen.

 

There are posters in the forum who would speak, IMO, like they had the holy spirit in them. But they can't as 1 is in the jewish religion and another is in the islam religion.
Funny thing though, I can't think of any in the christian religion here that would speak like they had the holy spirit in them. Maybe I don't know what the holy spirit speaking through a chrisitan sounds like.

 

Sure it is. It is not my fault that those people you refer to have a disdain for what I say. Gee... did the scribes and pharisees accept the things that Jesus said? Seemingly not.

Having a differing system of belief implies that either you are right or that I am right. Such is the danger that was spoken of by Paul...
"11 For it has been declared to me concerning you, my brethren, by those of Chloe’s household, that there are contentions among you. 12 Now I say this, that each of you says, “I am of Paul,” or “I am of Apollos,” or “I am of Cephas,” or “I am of Christ.” 13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?

14 I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 lest anyone should say that I had baptized in my own name. 16 Yes, I also baptized the household of Stephanas. Besides, I do not know whether I baptized any other. 17 For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of no effect."

Valid from the perspective you are viewing things... however not necessarily in accord with scripture (just as you are suggesting with regard to my writings on this forum).

You answer your own question.... "How would I know"... If you were, then you would know. Is there a sign? Yes... study the scripture and find that sign.

And because they are 'sharing' means that what they say is valid? Because they say they want others to share the 'holy spirit' , means that they are sincere in their words of said desire?

Nope, what?

Very cryptic in your words above. Explain how one would "reach an opinion" that would/could "further your enlightenment." This gives the connotation of showing that you are only interested in opinions that will further your current enlightenment. Not necessarily referring to an opinion showing how your current enlightenment might be in error.

Then you agree that the Holy Spirit will share with whomever the Holy Spirit needs to share something with and will pick the place and time of that sharing.

Absolutely correct. On the same token, neither are subject to justify their beliefs to the other, especially when the other has shown by word or deed that he/she is not interested or is opposed to your beliefs from the onset.

Because it is part of my current mission. Just because I have a job to do, does not mean that I have to enjoy that job,,, it just means that the job has to be done.

2 Corinthians 5: 10 "For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he has done, whether it be good or bad."

Well PTL... you are catching on to that concept of 'belief'. Believe as you may, believe as you might, but only the Lord Jesus knows who is right.

 

I dont happen to know what Genghis Kahn looked like. But I know someone (me) who for sure does not look like him.

 

Sure, that can be your opinion. I'm of the opinion that you're just making (*)(*)(*)(*) up.

And you obviously didn't find the super secret meaning of life hidden in it. Don't worry... I found it. But, obviously I have no reason to tell you.

Quote your answer, then.

So, let me get this straight. I call you out for giving me an answer of "that a belief was evidence that the idea existed in the mind."

You reply, 'No! That is your interpretation of what I said. No where in my text did I say "a belief was evidence that the idea existed in the mind." That is your contorted view of what was stated.'

To which I said, "The bolded portion of your answer, correct me if I am wrong, is saying that a belief that unicorns exist is evidence that the the unicorn exists objectively because it is in my mind and my mind is part of the objective world.

And finally you say. "Bravo... you finally got it right."

...

How is "a belief that unicorns exist is evidence that the the unicorn exists objectively because it is in my mind" different from "a belief was evidence that the idea existed in the mind."? Why is one view of what you said "contorted" and the other "right"? I see no discernible difference between the two views of what you said.

 

I'm sorry, but the Bible disagrees with your "discipline" and your refusal to provide a defense for your beliefs goes against Scripture. Try studying harder next time because apparently you missed these verses in your multi-year Biblical study.

1 Peter - "But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have."

2 Corinthians -"We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ."

Hell, even Jesus believed that he had to offer some sort of evidence (his works and prophecies) to prove himself to non-believers.

John - "Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in my Father’s name bear witness about me."

John - "but if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me and I am in the Father.”

John - "And now I have told you before it takes place, so that when it does take place you may believe."

Finally, even the big man himself thought that he needed to provide some sort of evidence for his existence and power in the Old Testament.

Exodus - 'Then Moses answered, “But behold, they will not believe me or listen to my voice, for they will say, ‘The Lord did not appear to you.’ ” The Lord said to him, “What is that in your hand?” He said, “A staff.” And he said, “Throw it on the ground.” So he threw it on the ground, and it became a serpent, and Moses ran from it. But the Lord said to Moses, “Put out your hand and catch it by the tail”—so he put out his hand and caught it, and it became a staff in his hand— “that they may believe that the Lord, the God of their fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has appeared to you.” Again, the Lord said to him, “Put your hand inside your cloak.” And he put his hand inside his cloak, and when he took it out, behold, his hand was leprous like snow. Then God said, “Put your hand back inside your cloak.” So he put his hand back inside his cloak, and when he took it out, behold, it was restored like the rest of his flesh. “If they will not believe you,” God said, “or listen to the first sign, they may believe the latter sign.'

Kings - "At the time of sacrifice, the prophet Elijah stepped forward and prayed: “Lord, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Israel, let it be known today that you are God in Israel and that I am your servant and have done all these things at your command. Answer me, Lord, answer me, so these people will know that you, Lord, are God, and that you are turning their hearts back again.”
Then the fire of the Lord fell and burned up the sacrifice, the wood, the stones and the soil, and also licked up the water in the trench."

So, no, your position is entirely not justified by the Bible. At all.

 

I am not concerned about your opinion.

Good, that means that you should be satisfied in your search.

Read it again and look again.

What, when and where did I "call you out"?

1 + 1 = 2

Because you keep twisting what I am saying, therefore, your view is contorted. You seemingly have a problem comprehending and therefore you find a need to rephrase what was said, so that you can apply an alternative meaning. That is one of the oldest games in the world... Kindergarten children play similar games.