Interesting...

You seem to be comparing Israel considering removing Palestinians from Israeli Territory to Muslims trying to remove Israel as a Nation?!?!?

You believe those 2 things are the same?

Sorry, I do not.

Regards,
Gaar

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"...I shall prefer emigrating to some country where they make no
pretense of loving liberty -- to Russia, for instance, where despotism
can be taken pure, and without the base alloy hypocrisy."

Abraham Lincoln

The Palestinians should just let the U.S. and Israel decide who they want to run the government in Gaza. It really is more efficient, as it eliminates the middle man (Palestinian voters).

While I may not agree with some of the positions held by Hamas, I do agree with your point above. Our hypocrisy probably guarantees Hamas landslide victories for many years to come. Democracy cannot be forced at the heel of a jackboot. It's a pity that not all Americans can see that.

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"Tweeter was a Boyscout before she went to Vietnam and found out the hard way... nobody gives a d@mn."

I mostly agree with Gaar.

I have sympathy for the Palestinians, if not for the actions of their extremists. And I generally think that we should be spending far more on foreign aid than we do now, out of enlightened self-interest as much as anything else.

But....

The Palestinian people elected Hamas. That does not mean we have to approve of the choice, and continue supplying aid. A democracy is capable of having interests and practices at odds with our own.

We mostly supply aid as part of the peace process. If one side or the other isn't moving that process forward, there's no reason to continue the aid.

When Hamas won the election, I argued that they should be given a chance to show they were serious about governing. I continued that right up until Hamas refused to condemn a suicide attack on Israel. Having shown they weren't changing their stripes, they no longer deserved our assistance.

I do not advocate toppling the Hamas regime, as we did Salvadore Allende back in the 1970s. *That* would be interfering with democracy. What we are doing now is simply the normal business between nations.

And it seems to be working. I've always thought Hamas does not really represent the heart of Palestinians; they were elected largely on the strength of their social programs and voters being sick of Fatah's corruption and ineffectiveness. Mahmoud Abbas basically proved that point when he threatened to call a referendum on recognizing Israel -- a referendum that everyone including Hamas expected would pass.

So now, feeling the pinch, Hamas and Abbas have agreed to a unity government, with Abbas empowered to negotiate with Israel. It remains to be seen whether that will lead to meaningful change on the ground -- but continuing to provide aid to an unrepentant Hamas wouldn't have achieved even this much.

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Man up.

So....where are their Arab brothers? Their Islamic brothers???? It's amazing to me that Iran can sponsor Hezbollah to the tune of $40 million per month and yet don't get food and milk to these Mothers and their children? Sounds like they don't care to me.

I've always believed that Arabs don't really want to bother with their Palestinian "brothers." They don't bring them into their countries......they don't support them with food.....they don't seem to be willing to help with anything but arms and weapons.

YET, they expect the U.S. and Britain to do it.

Amazing.

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"What exactly is this foreign policy experience?" Obama said mockingly of the New York senator. "Was she negotiating treaties? Was she handling crises? The answer is no."

While these countries are free to "elect" whomever they choose.....we are also FREE to not deal with them.

And you don't agree with "some" of the positions held by Hamas??????? An unbelievable statement.

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"What exactly is this foreign policy experience?" Obama said mockingly of the New York senator. "Was she negotiating treaties? Was she handling crises? The answer is no."

In that case it's time to cut US aid to Israel. They bigboys now, it's time to stop breastfeeding them.. hell, Israel is now THE superpower of the middle-east and the only nuclear armed state in the arab world.

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"When I'm in command, every mission is a suicide mission!" -Capt. Zapp Branigan
The United Church of the Latter Day Tangential Tarts

I can't exactly say that I don't agree with ANY of the positions held by Hamas... since I don't know about ALL of their positions, now can I?

Absolutely, we're free not to deal with them. But as our Israeli pals put on their act of Warsaw Ghetto Part II, is Hamas weakened or stregthened?

Sometimes ya get what ya pay for... and then some.

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"Tweeter was a Boyscout before she went to Vietnam and found out the hard way... nobody gives a d@mn."

..., and you were being so brave, but now you`ve backed away.

my emphasis

So Gaza and the entire West Bank is considered by you to be `Israeli territory` then? Greater Israel?

And you didn`t explain how you were able to dismiss Hamas` offer of a negotiated two-state solution and still consider them "trying to remove Israel as a Nation".

Forgive me, Gaar, I must be dense. Explain to me again, if you can, how your definition:

Anyone whose end is to destroy another Nation and not recognize their Right to exist, is a Terrorist.

applies to Hamas (who say they can accept a two-state solution) and not to Moledet (who will not accept a Palestinian state in 22% of Mandate Palestine that was left for them).

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Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.
Marx (G.)

Well before this, in October 2003, the UN Special Rapporteur for Food found that 22 per cent of children in Gaza were starving as a direct result of Israel’s siege policy: Gaza had long been surrounded by electric fences, its population of 1.25 million imprisoned, and its economy shut down. Unemployment was nearly total; poverty was at 75 per cent. The UN Special Rapporteur’s findings were confirmed by the World Bank and by USAID. All understood that the starvation was a direct result of the closures. By 2006, the World Food Program was reporting that 51 per cent of Palestinians – 2 million people – were malnourished.
http://dominionpaper.ca/foreign_poli...anadas_dr.html

This is the price Palestinians must pay for their democratic elections in January. The majority voted for the "wrong" party, Hamas, which the U.S. and Israel, with their inimitable penchant for pot-calling-the-kettle-black, describe as terrorist. However, terrorism is not the reason for starving the Palestinians, whose prime minister, Ismail Haniyeh, had reaffirmed Hamas's commitment to recognize the Jewish state, proposing only that Israel obey international law and respect the borders of 1967. Israel has refused because, with its apartheid wall under construction, its intention is clear: to take over more and more of Palestine, encircling whole villages and eventually Jerusalem.
http://www.antiwar.com/orig/pilger.php?articleid=9144

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Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.
Marx (G.)

No, I didn't say that. And I do not believe I said anything that would draw you to conclude that.

They can "offer" all they like...

When they cross the Border in a Military campaign that kills Soldiers and takes some Hostage, you have declared War.

I must say that I would have to agree with you on that one.

They can SAY anything they like...

But their ACTIONS as Elected Representatives will speak much louder than their words.

Not sure what you don't get about that.

Regards,
Gaar

__________________
"...I shall prefer emigrating to some country where they make no
pretense of loving liberty -- to Russia, for instance, where despotism
can be taken pure, and without the base alloy hypocrisy."

Abraham Lincoln