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Old 10-31-2006, 06:40 AM
apotropoxy apotropoxy is offline
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Default Waterboarding Ruled War Crime

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Four Japanese defendants were tried before a U.S. military commission at Yokohama, Japan, in 1947 for their outrageous treatment of American and Allied captives. The cases of the USA vs. Hideji Nakamura, Yukio Asano, Seitara Hata and Takeo Kita, water suffocation techniques were specifically cited as war crimes.

http://www.sptimes.com/2006/10/22/Co...Japanese.shtml
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Old 10-31-2006, 07:06 AM
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As you likely know, "war crimes" really only apply to the folks who lose. The folks who win can do pretty much whatever they want.
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Old 10-31-2006, 10:35 AM
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The folks who win can do pretty much whatever they want.
Spoils, y'all. Booty. Cookies. Markers of human power.
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Old 10-31-2006, 10:46 AM
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Default ...

We can do what we want but it wont be without consequences.

Going down that path will bring consequences.
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Old 10-31-2006, 10:58 AM
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The Japanese invented a stunt later used by the Cong, in which an old-fashioned glass thermometer was inserted catheter-style into a male prisoner's penis, then pulverized. After that, an all-liquid diet usually got whatever the interrogators wanted.

It was either the Japanese or the Germans who played around with strobe lights (now piezo lighting) to disorient a prisoner. That and subsonic sounds blasted at fierce intensities. Nowadays they seldom leave a mark, but even old-style flatfoots knew if you had to give a bruise-free kind of beating, you always bashed the nightstick against a phone book. No visuals for the jury.

I think the LAPD or someother big police force is testing sound-cannons for crowd control. Stun someone at fifty paces, that kind of stuff. But if you do it with subsonics and subliminal messaging and broadcast it loud enough in a town where your target is located---maybe his own supporters will kill him and you never had to send any troops to do it.

Modern science really picked up after they developed good night-sights and laser sighting. But now we can wage propaganda wars on people who aren't even awake....
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Old 10-31-2006, 12:35 PM
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Default I think he's onto something...

apotropoxy's trying to devise a way to wage war without actually hurting anyone.

Except Bush, that is.
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Old 10-31-2006, 12:40 PM
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Default what is torture??

If you were to ask most americans if they gave a (*)(*)(*)(*) about the rights of terrorist, you would likely get a hell no. With that being said, not every detainee is a terrorist. So you can not go around torturing anyone you want. If they are known terrorist, who care want you do to them. A terrorist group will not treat our soldiers better if their terrorist friends are mistreated. Use military personnel should not be in the torture business. Leave that for the OGAs.

The USA probably abuses/tortures a lot fewer than most other countries (at least the ones who actually fight anymore). The difference is they straight up lie about it. Why do you think the detainees who were facing transfer back to their countries or near by homeland countries wanted to stay in the "American Gulag"

I don't believe Al'Qeda signed the Geneva Convention. Why afford them any rights?

As for the Japanese soldiers who faced trial for water torture, that was probably their least offense.

Torture needs to be better defined and agreed upon. Some thing loud music, others isolation, other darkness.

Once again history is written by the victors
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Old 11-02-2006, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by WARRIOR";p=&quot View Post
If you were to ask most americans if they gave a (*)(*)(*)(*) about the rights of terrorist, you would likely get a hell no. With that being said, not every detainee is a terrorist. So you can not go around torturing anyone you want. If they are known terrorist, who care want you do to them. A terrorist group will not treat our soldiers better if their terrorist friends are mistreated. Use military personnel should not be in the torture business. Leave that for the OGAs.

The USA probably abuses/tortures a lot fewer than most other countries (at least the ones who actually fight anymore). The difference is they straight up lie about it. Why do you think the detainees who were facing transfer back to their countries or near by homeland countries wanted to stay in the "American Gulag"

I don't believe Al'Qeda signed the Geneva Convention. Why afford them any rights?

As for the Japanese soldiers who faced trial for water torture, that was probably their least offense.

Torture needs to be better defined and agreed upon. Some thing loud music, others isolation, other darkness.

Once again history is written by the victors
Why is it that America's POWs are the best-fed in history? Why are our captives GAINING weight, if they are so "mistreated?"
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Old 11-03-2006, 07:12 AM
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Default ?

link to a chart showing average detainee weight gain over time, starting october 2001?
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Old 11-03-2006, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quiller";p=&quot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by WARRIOR";p=&quot View Post
If you were to ask most americans if they gave a (*)(*)(*)(*) about the rights of terrorist, you would likely get a hell no. With that being said, not every detainee is a terrorist. So you can not go around torturing anyone you want. If they are known terrorist, who care want you do to them. A terrorist group will not treat our soldiers better if their terrorist friends are mistreated. Use military personnel should not be in the torture business. Leave that for the OGAs.

The USA probably abuses/tortures a lot fewer than most other countries (at least the ones who actually fight anymore). The difference is they straight up lie about it. Why do you think the detainees who were facing transfer back to their countries or near by homeland countries wanted to stay in the "American Gulag"

I don't believe Al'Qeda signed the Geneva Convention. Why afford them any rights?

As for the Japanese soldiers who faced trial for water torture, that was probably their least offense.

Torture needs to be better defined and agreed upon. Some thing loud music, others isolation, other darkness.

Once again history is written by the victors
Why is it that America's POWs are the best-fed in history? Why are our captives GAINING weight, if they are so "mistreated?"
Because we are a god fearing, morally upright, full of virtue, Constitution loving, freedom loving, transparency loving, people who act accordingly... even to our enemies.
Personally I love the Constitution and all the virtues and ideals laid out in it. I can see how some people see the Constitution as a road block to revenge, but I personally believe it is worth sacrificing your tortorous vengence apon a person who probably deserves it, just to maintain our high morals.

Revenge on a guilty person and losing all moral authority

VS.

Retaining the role as the most virtious society in the history of the world, and letting our enemies sit in prison cells for the rest of their lives, even though we really want to blow torch them.

I will take option B every single time.
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