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  #101 (permalink)  
Old 12-03-2008, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Shiva_TD View Post
...Then Bush Jr invaded Iraq because he hated Saddam for threatening to assassinate his father...
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But a closer look at the 11-year-old plot, particularly in light of the findings by the Iraq Survey Group (ISG), the special team of experts that spent 15 months investigating Baghdad's WMD programs, that they were all dismantled in 1991, shortly after the end of the Gulf War, may now be warranted, especially if Bush is still laboring under the impression that Saddam ''tried to kill (his) dad''.

While the ISG's 960-page report, known as the Duelfer Report, does not address the assassination attempt, its chronology and depiction of Hussein's worldview -- adduced through lengthy interviews by one Arabic-speaking FBI investigator and other interviews of Saddam's closest advisers -- make the notion that the Iraqi dictator tried to kill Bush all the more implausible.

For one thing, Saddam, according to the report, was convinced that the CIA had thoroughly penetrated his regime and thus would know not only that he had dismantled his WMD (which the CIA apparently did not), but also would know about his plans for important intelligence operations. Under those circumstances, it is hard to understand why he would then order an assassination attempt on the former U.S. president.

In October, 1993, however, New Yorker investigative journalist Seymour Hersh assailed the government's case as ''seriously flawed'', noting among other problems that seven bomb experts had told him that the devices were mass-produced and probably not even manufactured in Iraq...

Ambassador Joseph Wilson, who met with Saddam when he served as U.S. charge d'affaires in Baghdad during the Gulf War, said he found the plot ''odd''.

''(Saddam) had to have had some idea that his ability to run operations outside Iraq was not very good, because we had foiled so many things before the war. So you have to ask why someone who was a risk-taker but clearly not suicidal would undertake to assassinate a former president of the United States,'' pointed out Wilson.
in the meantime ignore the indisputable facts;
  • motive ~ to secure the realm
  • intent ~ 'clean break' and letter to clinton
  • opportunity ~ at the center of storm calling for attack on iraq
yes, better to believe in speculation and conspiracy theories
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  #102 (permalink)  
Old 12-03-2008, 01:53 PM
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..If we exploited our own reserves we could live without a drop of Middle East oil which is why being there for oil is so stupid.
what pray tell are you basing this assumption on! wiki's table Estimated reserves in order doesn't suport your position. BTW where our oil comes from middle east or canada or south america, as long as it is from outside the u.s. what happens in the middle east will affect us.
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  #103 (permalink)  
Old 12-03-2008, 01:58 PM
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Not sure what you mean here either, Saddam Nationalized oil in Iraq 35 years ago and kicked the Western oil companies out. How did that leave us with military control of all Middle East oil?
after fall of soviet union we were the only player remaining
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  #104 (permalink)  
Old 12-03-2008, 02:38 PM
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if you want to ignore facts, base your opinions on speculation that's fine with me. as i have said before you'll get there some day ~ by process of elimination. be prepared the longer it take the worse it will be for everyone ~ and i do mean everyone

You mean everyone who thinks it is required we all think the same way. I don't lead my life to satisfy those people.
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  #105 (permalink)  
Old 12-03-2008, 02:46 PM
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The PNAC's stated goal is "to promote American global leadership." Fundamental to the PNAC are the views that "American leadership is both good for America and good for the world" and support for "a Reaganite policy of military strength and moral clarity."
Do think they would have come right out in their stated goals and said, our goal is to dominate the world so as to have maximum control to exploiting their resources?

You have much more faith in their lack of duplicity than myself.
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  #106 (permalink)  
Old 12-03-2008, 02:49 PM
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after fall of soviet union we were the only player remaining

Google China's need for foreign oil. We have competition.
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  #107 (permalink)  
Old 12-04-2008, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by catawba View Post
Not sure what you mean here either, Saddam Nationalized oil in Iraq 35 years ago and kicked the Western oil companies out. How did that leave us with military control of all Middle East oil?
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Originally Posted by calmObserver View Post
after fall of soviet union we were the only player remaining
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Originally Posted by catawba View Post
Google China's need for foreign oil. We have competition.
moving the goal post are we?
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  #108 (permalink)  
Old 12-04-2008, 01:22 PM
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Do think they would have come right out in their stated goals and said, our goal is to dominate the world so as to have maximum control to exploiting their resources?...
apparently you missed my point. its the same "clean break" folks that i have been talking about ~ Elliott Abrams, I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, Norman Podhoretz, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz....

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...You have much more faith in their lack of duplicity than myself.
given the exchange that has been going on in this thread i would say that you have things backwards.
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  #109 (permalink)  
Old 12-04-2008, 01:24 PM
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You mean everyone who thinks it is required we all think the same way. I don't lead my life to satisfy those people.
not at all. i believe people should reach conclusions based on facts and not speculation.
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  #110 (permalink)  
Old 12-04-2008, 03:49 PM
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not at all. i believe people should reach conclusions based on facts and not speculation.

Where are the facts that Iraq was a threat to anyone when we attacked?
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