Thread: Justifiable homicides nearly triple after Florida 'Stand Your Ground' law passed

Long article on the pros and cons of both castle doctrine and SYG. It also goes in to the increased gun permits.. Sure are a lot of armed people in Volusia County.

Justifiable homicides nearly triple after Florida 'Stand Your Ground' law passed

DAYTONA BEACH -- Charles Robbins stumbled to his feet as someone pounded on his door.

Outside the Woodland Avenue residence stood 24-year-old Tyler Orshoski, a career criminal who police believe was ready to strike again.

The 82-year-old man grabbed a World War II-era Russian-built Tokerev, walked to the door and fired once.

"I did what I had to do and I would do it again," the Daytona Beach man said.

Minutes later, Orshoski lay dead on Robbins' porch. Robbins was never charged.

The shooting is one of numerous killings in Volusia and Flagler counties from 2005 to 2012 carried out in the name of self-defense and covered under Florida's controversial statute known as "stand your ground, " according to a News-Journal analysis.

State records show justifiable homicides nearly tripled in the five years after stand your ground passed compared to the previous five years. The number of concealed weapons permits almost quadrupled in the same time period.

In Volusia and Flagler, four out of six people who killed their would-be attackers were never charged or convicted.

The 7-year-old law is under intense scrutiny after unarmed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin was shot and killed by Sanford neighborhood watch volunteer and concealed weapons permit licensee George Zimmerman. The 28-year-old Zimmerman said the teen attacked him, but Martin's family claims the boy was killed in cold blood.

Zimmerman initially wasn't arrested by Sanford police, only to be charged with second-degree murder by the State Attorney's Office following weeks of nationwide protests.

Since the Feb. 26 killing of Martin, some have lined up against stand your ground, claiming the law discourages restraint and has led to unnecessary deaths. Gun rights advocates and the bill's co-sponsor, though, believe the law deters crime and allows people like Robbins the right to protect themselves from an imminent threat.

"If you empower people to stop violent acts, they can, they will and they did," said state Rep. Dennis Baxley, who co-sponsored the stand your ground statute.


'WE NEEDED TO STAND WITH THEM'


Passed in 2005, the stand your ground statute was meant to clarify how citizens could act in the face of danger. It was driven mostly by fears from hurricane-weary residents, and that fear was reinforced after watching TV coverage of the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, which devastated New Orleans, said Baxley, an Ocala Republican.

"People were highly sensitized about that and were worried about protecting themselves and their property," he said.

Until stand your ground was passed, citizens and homeowners were governed by the "castle doctrine," rooted in English common law, which allows someone to protect themselves or their property if backed into a corner.

But the castle doctrine left a lot of gray area, Baxley said.

"Generally, people had a duty to retreat," he said. "But that only gave people seconds to decide whether they wanted to be a victim or not.

continued

http://www.news-journalonline.com/ne...f-defense.html

This part of the article is too interesting to be omitted.

'GOOD LAW USED BY CRIMINALS'


From 2009 to 2010, three people involved in Daytona Beach drug deals fatally shot someone, but only one was charged.

The most recent case involved Emanuel Rivera, who police say shot and killed Lekeefe Lee, 25, after the two argued about a marijuana sale. Rivera initially told detectives Lee appeared to reach for a gun, but his story changed over time and he was charged with second-degree murder, said Daytona Beach Police Chief Mike Chitwood.

In the other cases, Leonard Murphy and Leavitis Golphin were not charged because they said they shot in self-defense and were concealed weapons permit holders, Chitwood said.

Golphin was having marijuana delivered to his Jean Street apartment so he could later sell it, detectives say. As it was being delivered, Armando Navarro Jr., 24, armed with a 9 mm handgun, shot deliveryman Merton Lindsay before he was gunned down by Golphin, according to an incident report.

A year later, police say Tarrence Gatlin, 18, and Murphy met in an apartment complex parking lot for a drug deal involving prescription pills. However, Gatlin tried to rob Murphy without giving him pills.

Murphy shot Gatlin three times, police said, and the killing was cleared through the scope of stand your ground, Chitwood said.

"We have people committing nefarious activities that are running around under the cover of the law," the chief said.

Chitwood is among a growing number in the law enforcement community who believe the law needs to be amended.

"We have a good law that's being used by criminals," Chitwood said.

Volusia County Sheriff Ben Johnson, a supporter of gun rights, said stand your ground is too broad and would support an amendment to limit the use of it.

"While there's no question that the use of defensive deadly force is absolutely necessary on occasion, there also are other circumstances when confrontations can be resolved without having to take a life," spokesman Davidson wrote on behalf of the sheriff.

Gross said the law sets a dangerous pattern of allowing killers to go free.

The old man in the first post should have been charged. His door was locked and the younger man couldn't get in. All he had to do was call the cops and wait, with the gun trained on the door. Instead, he opened the door, placing himself in danger and giving himself no option but to shoot.

Originally Posted by Makedde

The old man in the first post should have been charged. His door was locked and the younger man couldn't get in. All he had to do was call the cops and wait, with the gun trained on the door. Instead, he opened the door, placing himself in danger and giving himself no option but to shoot.

I agree.. The law shouldn't make people trigger happy..

Imagine if someone came to your door for assistance.. and you shot them????

Originally Posted by Margot

I agree.. The law shouldn't make people trigger happy..

Imagine if someone came to your door for assistance.. and you shot them????

I can tell you what would happen - I'd be spending at least the next 20 years behind bars.

Originally Posted by Makedde

I can tell you what would happen - I'd be spending at least the next 20 years behind bars.

Yep.. probably.

My family had a second home in Daytona years ago... I went through there about 7 years ago... Its not as nice as it used to be.. Seems like there were alot of rough characters.

The nexxt question:

Is SYG a law that is also useful to criminals?

Originally Posted by Margot

This part of the article is too interesting to be omitted.

'GOOD LAW USED BY CRIMINALS'


From 2009 to 2010, three people involved in Daytona Beach drug deals fatally shot someone, but only one was charged.

The most recent case involved Emanuel Rivera, who police say shot and killed Lekeefe Lee, 25, after the two argued about a marijuana sale. Rivera initially told detectives Lee appeared to reach for a gun, but his story changed over time and he was charged with second-degree murder, said Daytona Beach Police Chief Mike Chitwood.

In the other cases, Leonard Murphy and Leavitis Golphin were not charged because they said they shot in self-defense and were concealed weapons permit holders, Chitwood said.

Golphin was having marijuana delivered to his Jean Street apartment so he could later sell it, detectives say. As it was being delivered, Armando Navarro Jr., 24, armed with a 9 mm handgun, shot deliveryman Merton Lindsay before he was gunned down by Golphin, according to an incident report.

A year later, police say Tarrence Gatlin, 18, and Murphy met in an apartment complex parking lot for a drug deal involving prescription pills. However, Gatlin tried to rob Murphy without giving him pills.

Murphy shot Gatlin three times, police said, and the killing was cleared through the scope of stand your ground, Chitwood said.

"We have people committing nefarious activities that are running around under the cover of the law," the chief said.

Chitwood is among a growing number in the law enforcement community who believe the law needs to be amended.

"We have a good law that's being used by criminals," Chitwood said.

Volusia County Sheriff Ben Johnson, a supporter of gun rights, said stand your ground is too broad and would support an amendment to limit the use of it.

"While there's no question that the use of defensive deadly force is absolutely necessary on occasion, there also are other circumstances when confrontations can be resolved without having to take a life," spokesman Davidson wrote on behalf of the sheriff.

Gross said the law sets a dangerous pattern of allowing killers to go free.

.............................. .......

I do not understand. People should have the right to defend their property and protect their family's safety with a gun.
And if the intruder is carrying a gun, the homeowner should have the right to shoot the intruder immediately on site, before the intruder shoots the homeowner.

It is just incomprehensible that liberals are so concerned about the life of an intruder that breaks into someone else's house, especially if that intruder is carrying a weapon.

Originally Posted by Margot

Justifiable homicides nearly triple after Florida 'Stand Your Ground' law passed

It would be interesting to see how the crime rate will be affected. I bet there will be fewer burglaries, and fewer women that get raped in their own homes by unknown intruders. And lets look at the obvious plus side of all these homocides: there will be fewer criminals on the streets.

Originally Posted by Margot

The nexxt question:

Is SYG a law that is also useful to criminals?

Yes.

The allow is being used to allow people to instigate confrontations and then respond with lethal force.